Ed1955

I'm kind of new to the SuperVee game but love what I've seen so far. Can any of you help guide me in a site to purchase quality long lasting packs for the Vee? Any and all help will be greatly appreciated.
Respectfully,
Ed

Silent-AV8R

For Lipos I use [link=http://www.rclipos.com]RC Lipos[/link]. Good prices, free shipping, and a boat friendly owner. Tell him you're a boat guy. He likes knowing we're out here!!

all in

My Feedback: (1)

I perfer the IB4200 nimh packs.

3/42killer tomato

I also use the 4200 but added an extra 4200 in the series wiring for a total of 3 batteries or 18 cells ,,I call it the 3/42 killertomato the boat is fire red the speed increase was incredible and the stock ESC had no trouble with the extra power,, and the motor did not have a problem and did not over heat and the results,, 5 full minutes longer run time hope this helps with some Ideas ,,,3/42 killertomato supervee 27 signing out..

Ed1955

Are you saying that you're running your SV with 21.6 volts? I'm new at this and really don't understand how series comes into play, but I guess I'll learn it quick. Are the two 7.2's in the stock Vee consider in a series?
Ed

SV27dayton

When you say no trouble, you mean it worked how many times? Are you using the BEC with 18 cells? Are you using the stock AM radio? Did you check the temps? The only reason that I would think you would see longer run times is because you can only run at 1/2 throtte most of the time. I would expect that not only the ESC would be at risk here but also the motor. I wouldn't post alot of encouraging results until you prove this works long term. I'd hate to be the one responsable for multiple ESC deaths. I'm sceptical about the longevity of your happyness.

ryan_t888

ESC will smoke with 18cells.

Ryan

3/42killer tomato

Yes,,that`s right 21 volts 3 batteries in series wiring the third battery was mounted up front in the bow which also made the supervee run more stable it is not back heavy now with the battery in the front. 18 cells and 21.6 volts makes the supervee 27 a boat to be feared even by nitro supervees..check your wiring and make sure you know how to do this before making any wiring changes or disasters could result and make sure you have a lake large enough to run this bad boy or otherwise you will find yourself grounded will quick have fun and enjoy!!!!!killertomato 3/42 signing out!!!!! and 3/42 means,,, (3 batteries running 4200mah)..

Ed1955

Let me tell you what happened to me last night. I went on flea bay and bought some 7 cell 4500 packs which were advertised as the best packs for the SuperVee with real long run times and increased power. Well, the boat did have more power and it probably had a longer run also but when I took the boat out of the water, I could feel the heat through the hull and the canopy. I almost died and was almost in fear of what I would find under the canopy but I of course I had to look. Well, the one pack actually split the shrink tube and both packs were so hot I couldn't even get them out of the boat. The sad fact is that I wasn't even running full throttle all the time because I was unsure about how hot they would get. I found out the hard way in a hurry. No more 7 cell packs for me. I want the boat to last. I think so far in my opinion the IB 4200's are some of the best packs I've tried and for fun laps on the pond with no trophy hunting races, that's all I need.
Respectfully,
Ed

3/42killer tomato

This is not a theory!!!!unless you know how to do this it is a theory,,I run this supervee every day with this configuration and knew even before I did this that it would perform well,, although I would not try another battery for 4 because it would fry the system,all esc units are rated well below the rated spec for durabilty to heat but will handle more power for a shorter time I have had two complete runs for a total of 25 minutes 12 1/2 each one after the other and the esc and the motor was not destroyed,,it is your call it worked with mine and I know a lot about electrical energy but you are responsible for your own mistakes!!!!hope I have given some excitement to the to the supervee 27!!!!!killertomato 3/42 signing out....

3/42killer tomato

Scott::I am just sharing some info about my supervee and my experience and full throttle and full power with 18 cells is what I have done!!!I do not encourage any one with the lack of experience to try this because serious results could results but again I have run this configuration dozens of times and the esc and motor are the same units so for I have not burned them out so all of you out there 3 batteries 4200mah for a total of 21.6 volts is what I have run and the truth of the matter cannot be denide,,,but I am not responsible for any accidents of yours for trying this configuration in your supervee 27 just trying to share my experience with all you out there!!!!

3/42killer tomato

yes the 2 stock batteries are in series wiring!!!!

SV27dayton

Please post quickly when it gives up.

In the mean time feel free to post a video.

When you have alot of experience with electrical energy, it makes me curious what you did with that experience here. You are taking all the components in the power train of this boat and pushing them more than 25% beyond the max stated capacity. Did you look at the specs? Did you measure the caps on the ESC? Or did you just add 50% more cells to see what would happen? I'm just curious of your method of experimentation. "Come on out guys! The ice is holding me!"

3/42killer tomato

scott all products no mater what they are are always underrated for safety and life span from litigation into lawsuits and the 40 years experience with electrical circuit design gives me bragging rights let me give an example if you have a esc and motor rated at the max of 14.5 volts at 3600kv this will never be the redline of the system it must be rated well beyound for safety usually by 2 this motor will probably redline at 2800kv at 28volts and burn,,,,, the closer you get to this mark the hotter the unit will run and shorten the life span an example would be 500 hours for normal life at 14.5 volts at 21 volts this life span drops to 250 hours and so on so you sacrifice life span,, for speed but the unit still operates fine till then,,, all systems have a life span at rated specs exceed this and you shorten this lif e for a gain in speed they do this in all sports if you know anything at all about physics and electrical energy then you will understand hope this helps!!!!killertomato3/42 signing off....

Ed1955

All I'm going to say is that I ran two additional cells, two 7 cell packs and the darn boat felt like the batteries were going to bubble the gel coat of the canopy and the hull and the hull was in a cold pond! There is no way in h*ll I would run an additional six cells without an on board fire control system of some sorts. Also, for what it's worth I've read numerous accounts of how unstable the SuperVee's get when you reach speeds much over 45 mph. As for the increased cell count in this set up, I come from the RC Helicopter Hobby and I see this constantly, guys running 12 lipo cells in a 6 cell machine. It's quite common BUT, these boys have done their math and most run 100 to 150 amp escs like I do so there is no chance of a meltdown simply because when a heli starts unsoldering stuff in flight, they only go in one direction, back to earth. With a boat that directions is probably to the shore or to the trash can. Regardless, last night I learned my lesson pushing the limits of the stock set up by running 14 cells and doubt I will ever do it again. Don't get me wrong though please, with the right esc and a Steve Neu motor you could probably get one of these boats to skip across the water like a .223 round shot out of an AR-15 but I would think there are better boats designed for that much power. I could be wrong though, I've only been in this hobby for a week.
Respectfully,
Ed

ryan_t888

First of all the ONLY limiting factors on any BL motor is current and RPM until it explodes. All other figures are derived from these. Cheaper Motor manufactures limit motors nearly right on there max limit. LiPo manufactures over spec their cells by a fairly large margin. If specs were followed there would be far more dead LiPo's.

A 2800kv motor on 28v would not burn. It would simply fly apart. Voltage does not burn motors out!

Secondly ESC's are usually some what forgiving in there maximum continuous current ratings. There voltage ratings MUST be followed. The caps very rarely have a larger safety margin for voltage. In some cases wiring on more additional cell (1.35v charged) can smoke ESC immediately after connection. Believe me, I know!

Thirdly, you will never see a 12 minute run time out of IB4200’s. IB 4200 are cells of the past and can not dump 38+A for more than 5 minutes.

Fourthly, 18 cells on a SV27 motor will be far too many RPM to use any prop that would fit a 3/16� shaft. And for 12-1/2 minutes, I don’t think so!

For the rest of the readers. Do not run this boat on more than 14 cells. I only recommend a MAX of 15v, 12c NiMh or 4s LiPo. The BEC on the SV runs hotter on 14 cells, using a receiver battery is greatly recommended if you choose this route.

Ryan

3/42killer tomato

ED::Thanks for the complement I must be doing things right because every time I show this configuration to all the rc people they say it cant`t be done ,,so obviously I know more than they do or you,,, sorry pal that`s my story and I`m sticking to,, it can`t change the truth to bad you do not understand,, no offense but I have one over you,, and a faster than nitro boat period...see-ya

ryan_t888

Oh no, I understand, I don't think you understand.

What size prop did you run? What speeds did you hit? Post some photos and video!

Ed, visit RCLipos and pick up some LiPo cells. NiMh cells are lacking greatly in performance and are not worth the trouble.

Ryan

Ed1955

Tomato, you should have one over on me. I've been running RC boats since last Thursday, May 1st. How long have you been into RC boats? I'm not ashamed to admit that I don't understand all the number calculations as to what works and what is safe. That being said, I will say this though, since I was 2 years old I have known that extreme heat is not good. If components of this little boat are so hot that they blister your fingers, then something I'm doing is wrong. My boat produced these temps running only two 7 cell packs. As I sit here and look at the blister on my thumb, I doubt I will ever try running three 6 cell packs no matter how fast the darn boat goes. I like speed just as much as the next guy but blisters bug me as they interfere with my keyboard communicating.
Respectfully,
Ed

3/42killer tomato

well boys::: iam gonna shake the dust off my feet and move on great talking to you all..sorry I could not enlighten your wisdom,, I tried,, maybe some day you will undestand and know!!!! you can`t teach an old dog new tricks ,,,SO-LONG!!!!

SV27dayton

tomato: You never did say what prop you were running. You said plain and simple that you have one up on us. Share it then. Let's get some setup info. I'm intrested in doing the speed calcs at WOT for 21+ volts once you let us know what prop. I'm a mechanical engineer. I know I'm not done learing but sometimes people come on here and don't make sense and some times are even less than truthful. Forgive if we are sceptical when something goes against all our experiece.

Ed: I don't think that it was the cell count that you were running but maybe a lack of balance in your packs. Maybe you ran them too low. My experience is that more cells dont eqate to hotter batts but hotter esc and motor

ryan: you mentioned current and rpm and motor's enemys but, and this may simply be restating current but what about heat? My motor gets hotter on 14 cells than 12 so I can only imagine what 18 would do.

ryan_t888

Heat is the biggest factor for destroying electrical components.

Your right Scott heat is the result of increased current. Too much current passed through a wire will over heat it. Mass of a motor and Kv is what will effect the maximum continuous current of any given motor. As mass and kv increase, so does the maximum continuous current.

A motor with greater Kv will have a lower Rm. A lower Rm will reduce heat allowing great current flow.
A motor will a larger mass will be able to dissipate more heat.

It's commonly mistaken that voltage creates the heat with in a motor but this is not true. Excessive voltage can degrade wire insulation but will not heat the wire up.
I can pass 110v at 5A through 18AWG wire which is 550w with no problems. When I pass 70A through 18AWG wire it gets smokin hot. This is also only 518w. If voltage creates heat my house would be long gone!

Ryan

pompebled

Hi Ed,

Did you cycle the packs in the 14 cell configuration as you ran them? If so, how many times?
NiMH need at least 4-5 cycles to get up to full power, running them low on the first or second run will result in what you've experienced (been there, done that...).

Were the packs soldered in-line, or are the cells connected with bars, side by side?
Keep in mind that most factory packs have cell connectors out of 'lametta', which will glow under load, instead of letting the current to the motor.

Regards, Jan.

CadillacDTS2001

man i am missing so much on here. ...... eh.

Speederson

Hmmm, thought for sure you would jump all over this.[X(]