Gentelmen.....what is the current concensus/practice on the application of a single A123 (preferably dual) A123 powered system, that powers the; receiver, servos and ignition for a 30% airplane equipted with 5 (ea) hitec 5955.

servos.http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_70...tm.htm#7052876

Thanks all!

****

proper link:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_70...tm.htm#7052876


Thank you

****sheee

If you read through that thread you will see a lot of people giving opinions but nobody with any actual experience doing it. This is pretty typical for internet forums.

I have respect for opinions of Pat Roy (Tired Old Man) and Bob Pastorello, but in this case their opinions do not jive with my actual experience. Being cautious is great but you don't learn as much and you may miss some good stuff.

I have been flying my 2.4 ghz. receivers for well over a year powering them off the A123 pack, and powering my ignition from the same pack. I've done this on at least 5 different planes both 50cc and 100cc. In some cases I used a single A123 pack and in others I used 2 packs, powering the ignition off one of those packs.

I've used this setup with Spektrum AR-7000, AR-9100, and JR 921 receivers on at least 5 different planes, possibly more (I've lost count). I am now flying a 50cc Extra 260 with a Futaba 6014 FASST receiver and a single A123 2300mah pack. I fly the heck out of this plane, it's my "mule". I use it to test anything that I think might bring the plane down, because this is a plane that I won't miss when it's gone. It's got a lot of flights on it and the ignition setup has never shown any indication of noise. It's not like it's on the edge of failing, I feel like I have plenty of margin.

One caution, however. I've only ever done this with the RCexl ignitions like come with the TOC-53, DL-50 and 100, etc. Other ignitions may not behave as well, but the RCexl units have not presented any problem.

And here's something else to think about. I take the power off the pack from the light-duty charge lead that is on all the packs I have/sell. The power for ignition does not go through the receiver bus. It's possible that the battery pack is acting as a huge capacitor and absorbing some of the noise that other people are sure is there. Also this way I can charge the pack through the charge jack on my ignition switch which is very convenient.

I am not suggesting that you should do it this way. You should do what make you comfortable. But I am telling you that if you do this, you are not the first one and others have had positive experience with it. I have heard from others who have done it succesfully and I have NOT heard from anyone who tried it and it failed.

One of these days maybe I'll haul out a 72mhz FM or PCM receiver and try it on one pack, just to see what happens. If I have time I'll hook up a scope to the receiver's power pus to see if there is anything ugly coming down the line.

TF

I'm still flying 72mhz so I won't even consider it. The preponderance of my ignition systems are CH since I gnerally change out the RC Exl. Direct conversation with the people sat CH suggests that I stay with a separate battery for the ignition, even if I was using 2.4.

That being the way I view it, there's no denying it has worked for Tom.

Gentleman:
I have been flying a BLING 3D since last Summer with ONE A123 2300 ma battery
and have had absolutely NO problems.. NO GLITCHES

When I first built this plane it had FOUR batteries and isolators.
ALL I DID BETWEEN FLIGHTS IS METER AND CHARGE BATTERIES...

The ONE A123 powers:

DL 50 motor ignition
6 Hi Tec 5985 servos
1 JR 8711 servo
I Futaba 3010 servo
1 2.4 Futaba receiver
TME smoke system

Out of 2300 it uses PER FLIGHT:
180 ma in warm weather
220 ma in cold weather

Thanks Tom, It is MUCH MORE fun to fly and NOT charge batteries...

Walt

I love being right!

This is an interesting discussion and the only real question I have is what do you gain? An ignition battery only weighs a few ounces. I'm flying 72 still, so it's kind of a mute point for me.

Hey Tom how is the 6014 doing I got one with my 10C and was wondering have you tested it on the new servos and which servos do you have in the MULE LOL

With 72 mhz is a no brainer. You run a separate ignition battery.

For those running 2.4 you can save a couple of ounces and a switch. For some I suppose that means a lot. However, using a spearate ignition battery means you could have an ignition battery failure and successfully land a "glider".

Just my outlook.

That's what I was wondering. Didn't seem like there was a whole lot to gain.

I suppose it makes the process a little less expensive and simpler for some.

I do it for several reasons.

It's simpler, I don't have to find a place for the ignition battery. Sometimes this can be time consuming and a nuisance.

It's lighter, although that really isn't an important issue.

I think the biggest thing is that I don't have to pay attention to a second power supply. I charge one battery and it's good for everything. I usually charge on the way to the field, so when I get there it's ready to go. With a separate battery pack I'd have to stop and change the charger over, I might use a Nimh battery in which case I have to carry a second charger.

It also makes it easy to charge my main pack.

No one thing is really a big deal, but the totality of the benefits makes it something that I think is worthwhile for me. YMMV.

TF

To be honest I can't remember what's in this plane. Something fast on the elevators, some real cheapies on ailerons, and I think the rudder is like a 5955 or something. I've been flying it a long time (for me) and the elevator servos are buried inside the stabs so I'd have to take it apart to figure it out.

But I'll be putting a 6014 in the new prototype 106" Yak that I'm working on (oops! did I let that one out?) and it's all 7955s. So far everything on the 6014 works as it should.

BTW the Futaba FASST system is wicked fast, as fast as the DX7. It's so fast that the cheapie servos I have in the wings get confused if I let go of the stick. The position signal is changing so fast that they go all the way to the end of throw in the opposite direction and eventually come back to level. This is why I decided not to sell them. They even stuck at full throw once (in the air) and did 3 or 4 rolls before I was able to wiggle the sticks and get them to come back to neutral. Note to self, must not let go of the sticks and let them bounce.

TF

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh well see ya Friday to pick up my parts and hopefully I will get a peek LOL. Bringing the Honda Magna Sukhoi !!!!

Because even though the respondents often seem like they are not paying attention, there are lots of people who read and don't reply, kind of like a radio talk show.

People with experience and honest accurate information are encouraged to participate even though it seems like it's futile. It looks to me like Walt and Sage fits into this category, he relayed his own experience that seems to be accurate.

People with no experience and only hearsay to contribute are encouraged to spend their time studying, learning and confirming what they want to pass along rather than just blathering about some subject that they know little or nothing about.

We don't get too much of the blathering here in the Wild Hare forum, but go out into the public forumes and one sees a very high blather-to-fact ratio.

There are at least 3 types of posts generally. Informed facts (tiny minority), hype/shilling by stealth vendor reps (larger minority, sometimes accurate and often not) and blather (majority). I define blather as either incorrect information or semi-accurate information obtained from shills and then re-posted as known facts.

TF

Tom,

Just so I understand your setup, is the light duty lead you refer to the same as balancing leads as found in other setups or do you have two "normal" output leads on your pack with perhaps different wire gauge or conections?

Yes, our balance lead termninates on a standard JR servo connector so it can plug directly into a switch.

TF

Walt and Sage. The only reason I said there doesn't seem to be a whole lot to gain is I run 2 A123's to my reciever, which is more than plenty, and one 4.8 nicad for ignition. In my case the only gain that I could see is eliminating a couple ounces of weight by getting rid of the 4.8 nicad. I charge before I fly and have plenty for 5 or 6 flights, so no real gain for me.
Tom always gives great advice and so does Pat. I asked the question just to see if there was something I was missing. Wasn't trying to start anything.

Ok, since the can of worms has been opened and your looking for been there done that answers.
For what its worth I've been using a single A123 in one of my gassers for several months now. I also fly with a friend who has well over 100 flights with his DL50 powered katana using a single pack and have seen no ill efects. My plane originally had a 4.8v bat on the ignition and to be honest I do not notice any difference as far as weight and performance, but as Tom stated I makes for an easy simple setup. IMHO if you want to try it, try it.
If you don't trust it, stick with the standard setup. It all comes down to personal preference and what you are comfortable with.
At our local field we have several people who have all sorts of opinions obout why we shouldn't use a single pack, I guess putting my plane back in the van in one piece at the end of the day isn't enough proof that its an ok setup.
I'll end by shairing this little story: A couple of days ago a friend of mine flying his 50cc 540 lost his plane due to the fact that he improperly charged his Tx. The plane had 2 bats on the Rx and 1 on the ignition, so lets not forget about the ONE battery that really counts.

Tom and X Ray ............ I used the Fromeco wolveriene switch with 2(ea) battery input leads and 3(ea) heavy duty output leads.

2(ea) leads to a power expander
1(ea) lead to the ignition
Did you set up look something like:

http://www.fromeco.org/Products/04FR...b/Default.aspx

in particular item #5 where the 3rd leg on the right is to the ignition

I am using: 2.4 Ghz, 2 (ea) A123's, no regulators and 6.6 volts to the ignition.

I call DA the other day and the technician stated that the ignitions are handling the 6.6 volts and they have not heard of any problems

Thanks all

eeehsofom

Hi flatspin,
Yes, just a misunderstanding...
I did not know that you had two A123s and were just talking about your ignition battery...
WISHING YOU GREAT FLYING IN 2009....[sm=75_75.gif]
Walt...