nickster46

@Yura: Glad to hear I am not the only one who couldn't see water coming out of the outlet.

beejay1

Voltage of battery was 3,86 V readout after the run. Pack was fully loaded, everytime with a balancer.
The 1550 mAh lipopack (20C) was ok, I normally storage it on 3,8 V per cel. Today I have discharged it after fully loaded, and after 4 minutes and 15 A full discharging all 3 cells where 3,55 V. it tooks about 8 minutes for fully discharge (1436 mAh total readout). Temps where about 100 F/45 C. So the pack seems to be ok...

I tried to get into to program settings of the esc that comes with this Bolt, tried the manual of nickster46 and even with a program card but it seems not programmable... Only thing you hear -in different stick positions of the transmitter- is the 2 short 1 long sound that may should give an automatic setting of your stickposition as mentioned in the manual of nickster46.

Next time I try a different pack and, if it slows speed again after 3 minutes, with a different esc it should give some answers... We will keep trying!

Greetings, BJ

nickster46

@ Beejay:

If you are looking for a cheap 60A ESC wich is programmable with my manual, you should try this one: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/60A-Watecool-W...oControlled_JN

Motorcrosskid

I got my small bolt about three weeks ago and i love it i still cant figure out how water gets into the hull but i have sponges to absorb the water i would recomend it forsure still havent gotten the oxtura prop for it but i hear it is good does anyone have range problems with the hobbyking gt2 radio?

Motorcrosskid

Im not forsure if this will work but here is a video of it



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nickster46

@ motorcrosskid: wich octura are you waiting for? the x432? I can tell you that this prop increases plaining and a bit speed. but mostly the plaining.
the vid doesn't work proper.
I get absolute no water in my hull, I guess I'm lucky. I tape my hull with hockey tape.
Did you put a shrink tube on the shaft/strut part? and did you grease your shaft with a waterproof grease lik teflon grease?
these options are the main causes of water leaking in the hull.
What battery do you use?

Yura

Mine work well in the range where I can see my boat normally and in the range I can swim to flipped boat

carakter

Can you guys post pics of your boats? [8D]

nickster46

Here you are. resized

beejay1

I tried the little Bolt again, this time with still the same esc but with an other lipopack (1500 mAh zippy 20s) and that gave no problems. Runtime was about 6 minutes for mostly -or as long when possible- at full speed. Temps were ok, and a slight bit of water in the boat but that was only in the little sponge at the left side. The backup esc (Turnigy plush 40 Amps watercooled) will remain in the box with the small Bolt, you never know! It is programmed for 3S with soft cuf off (reduce power when it reaches 9,6 V) and Cut off treshold at high (3,2 V per cell average).

It looks like the first pack was appearently not that good, although earlier tests with a continue 15 Amps discharge at home showed no indication of a bad pack or cell... But with this pack it runs good again! Runtime or better capacity of the lipo must be some more for races in future (mini hydro). The weigth of the lipopack is still restricted till 140 gramms, all in... With a nice 1700-1800 mAh pack it should do the trick, now we have to look for such a 3s pack... It will be difficult to find.

Greetings, BJ

carakter

@beejay - it's good you had that sorted out. I did sense that it was your battery as you could still run it for 3 mins.
I will plug in my Wattmeter when I go to the pond and see how much amps the motor is pulling.
I just got my new lipo today. It's the Turnigy nano-tech - 3S -2200mah - 25-50C discharge.
I can't tell the exact weight as I don't have a scale, but site says 187 grams.
It's a nice fit. I can mount it sideways thereby giving me freedom in moving the COG.

I hope to test this soon in a real pond.



As you can see, I repositoned the esc to the rear, this will provide unrestricted battery placement.
Also tried installing the 4200Kv outrunner motor. I hope the stock ESC holds up.
Will probably install a cooling fan temporarily until I get the motor cooling sorted out.


Turnigy 2200mah nano-tech 3S battery positoned lenghtwise (25 - 50C discharge! ) Enough space even with the stock inrunner motor.


Battery positioned crosswise - up front. Sure glad I got this battery, no force-fitting here, battery moves freely from side to side.


Battery positioned near the motor. Lots of space here to play with the COG - center of gravity.


Next on the list isthe Octura X430 & 432, and maybe a 427 if I get the higher Kv motor in the future - will probably need that ESC upgrade by then.

beejay1

That is looking great! You have certainly a lot of space now. An outrunner will certainly be a good alternative for the stock motor. Cooling this type of motor is a bit tricky. You can take a watercooled motormount or put a cooling between motor and mount such as an esc cooler.
Perhaps you can take an outrunner who creates an airflow such as a Turnigy Typhoon 2215H motor (3550kv). This is also a good alternative. I have this Typhoon motor in a small mini mono hull, even on 2s it runs great.
I hope you can hold the 4200 kv Bolt on the water, corners would certainly be taken with lesser speed!
Looking forward to your testrun!

nickster46

nice pictures of the boat. I like the special 'paint'.
The outrunner does create a lot of space for the battery!
Today my new 3s 25c 1800mah Lipo arrived and I took it for a test.
I used to put 3s 2200 20c in the small bolt.
The 25c rating does give the boat just that little bit of extra power I liked.
The 20c battery was running great for about 30sec (full throttle) and thereafter a bit less power.
That was alway a pain in the ass for me.
With this new 1800 I am very happy. It is also a lot smaller than the 2200 so I got myself a lot of space too.
I also tried a 35mm plastic prop from my other boat. But my experience is that the octura x432 runs a lot better. (sooner planing and faster)
THe temperatures where not really high with the 35mm prop.

carakter

The "special paint job" is actually from the sticker sheet of my UL-1.
I will also be sealing the reciever and servowith Corrosion X. Extra insurance for water intrusion!
I don't forsee any problems with the stock servo . . . having bent the pushrod to clear the hole.
But then again, I could be wrong.
I have also "knife edged" the rudder and strut for les****g.
Now all I needare the Octura props. . . .

carakter

Let me bactrack and re-phrase my answer on this . . . I also noticed some binding (still) even with the bent pushrod. I concluded that the servo is sitting high in proportion to the hole.
I will take out the plywood base mount and glue the servo direct to the hull and see if that will solve the problem. From my initial trial fitting, it looks to have solved the problem.
But let me glue the servo and report back to confirm it's success or failure.

nickster46

it looks nice.
I did polish the rudder myself too. I had some minor flat spots on it.
I am still struggling with the rudder's push rod. The friction between the push rod and the hole are decreased but I got a difference in steering left or right. the small bolt's steering to the right is much better than steering to the left. Is this normal or should I check my pushrod?
I am waiting for a 5750kv inrunner to arrive. I will try this motor and see how it goes.

carakter

Ok, servo glued on. Still experiencing some servo case movement despite seeing no noticeble binding in the pushrod.
I think it has something to do with the servo arm geometry.
Like you, I also have more steering to the right than left . . . but as stated, races go clockwise so I guess it's okay.
I will try playing with the servo trim to see if I can correct the difference.
I think the servo arm is struggling with the Z-bend of the pushrod.

I am contemplating on trying out a ball connectoron the rudder and kwik link (airplane use) on the servo arm..
Well, trial and error . . . more bench tests to try and perfect this little critter.

Butat speeds, you reallywant to limit your steering ratio or you'll flip the boat when you turn abruptly. . . . just like in a real car.

5750Kv?Just bench testing the Outrunner4200Kv and it's already screaming! What more with your 5750!
You will probably need the Octura x427 for that. Remember, the more Kv, the smaller diameter prop you will need.

nickster46

Yes! I just tested the 5750kv. maaaaaann!that is awesome!
Bench testing makes it really really scream!
Than I had the small bolt in a little pond near to my home.
The result: the boat is way faster, way better plaining (no clapping on the water)
and acceleration is also much better.
Another benefit is that this motor is like a centimeter shorter than the stock motor wich will result in more space for the battery.
it fits just perfect into the cooling jacket.
so much more fun than the stock engine. and even with the octura x432 on it, it runs perfect. Nothing to do about it
And so much more fun for such a el cheapo motor
for information: this is the motor I use this motor<pre class="exampletext"></pre>

carakter

I would like to see a video of your 5750! No heat problems?

Yura

Wish you a good play with this thing!

(For me) I don't think 5750kv is a good idea if you plan your boat to make more than 20-30 runs...

Yura

Also this motors have max Amp about 10A

nickster46

I took this 5750kv motor without any particular reason. It was cheap and I wanted to know how the small bolt goed with it. And I like to hear rpm sound
Maybe I can make a video tonight, that depends on the weather.
I am not really a calculator when it comes to Ampères, Kv, and prop diameters. I'm more practical 'trial and error': if it goes well than it is ok, if it goes less fast than it is not ok. Do I burn my finger when touching the motor/esc than its not ok..etc.
I also have an 4200kv outrunner as spare. maybe I will test this motor soon.
The battery duration is a bit less than with the stock motor but I still can run for about 8-10 minutes (not full throttle all the time offcourse).

carakter

Could you make a comparative video? Please?

Running with the different motors on the same course would tell us a lot how the Bolt reacts with each motor.
You should consider gettingthe X430prop so you can fine tune your setups.

Also,outrunners produce more torque compared to inrunners . . which is why it's the motor of choice for planes and helis.
And of course now they're discovering it's use for boats!

I envy you man! Having a nearby pond to test / run your boats.

carakter

@Yura - you seem to be good at calculating things . . can you be our resident engineer / mathematician and do the calculations forthe proposed setups? That way we have a heads up on what to expect and see/compare the difference between the two.

I for one am still confused about prop perforamance in relation to motor Kv and voltage. Like nickster,I do the trial and error routine.
Calculated predictions can help narrow the choices for more precise results.

I do know that you can push the Bolt only so much.
There will come a point wherein it can only take so much power.
But, don't we all want to find out where that is?

nickster46

Yesterday I was again running with the 5750 kv but I am a lot less happy with it now. It looks like after about 30sec-1min the setup is in some restriction mode. It looses a lot of power and my battery (3s 25c 1800mah, brand bew 1 time used) lost its power. The day before, the battery was really hot and the plastic around it was swollen.
I have the idea that the motor doesn't reach its maximum rpm's wile running in the water. When I test at full throttle on the shore I get way more rpm's (that's normal, I know because of the water resistance) but I sure got the idea it is restricted somehow. I tested several batteries with different C ratings but it looks like the esc is decreasing the power. But that would be weird because it is a 60A esc up to 18v input.
When running in the pond the motor doesn't scream out his rpm's. Maybe because of the high kv's it couldn't deliver enough torque to reach it's maximum rpm's. Unfortunately I forgot my camera so a video isn't available. I have ordered the 3600kv inrunner as well, I gues it is the best of two worlds (between the 2604kv stock motor and the 5750kv inrunner) because some more kv's but maybe still got enough torque to reach it's max rpm's.

After that I tried the 4800kv outrunner. I had to enlarge the holes of the motor mount because the outrunner's diameter is bigger. I also had to move the motor mount 1cm to the rear because the motor shaft is shorter than the inrunner's. I tested this one in the dark in the pond near to my house but after a run of 2-3 minutes the motor was really really hot!! I burned my finger when I touched it and I measured with my infrared thermometer (see pictures). The benefit is that the outrunner provides more space for the battery. I am not really satisfied with the outrunner because of the temperature, I guess it won't last long.

Would the restriction be caused by the battery?that it is losing his mah's? or maybe would the restriction caused by the esc?If you see my profile, Blogs, I uploaded the manual for the ESC. Can anyone take a look at this and maybe tell me wich setup option could solve this problem?

youtube:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAMJq8_EyHg


motor temperature


motor space