LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
12-12-2010, 02:41 PM
#28
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Well, despite my blatant and shameful attempt at getting SeamusG to volunteer untold hours of his personal time and resources...... no joy. [sm=cry_smile.gif]
[sm=lol.gif] [sm=lol.gif] [sm=lol.gif]
Here's my idea for a color scheme on the project:
[sm=lol.gif] [sm=lol.gif] [sm=lol.gif]
Here's my idea for a color scheme on the project:
12-12-2010, 03:47 PM
#29
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Blatant? I was looking for unabashed. [img]../../punymce/plugins/emoticons/img/trans.gif[/img]
My LT-40 started with an all-white base like yours. Here's my thoughts.
Leading edge - gotta toss something over the LE - bright yellow, true red (but NOT Mike B's. shimmering glitter). What really shows up when you're dropping below the hog back are the yellow wrap-arounds on the shoulders. They look like big ol' landing lights. Not sure how an all-white LEwould show up on final approach. Might work. The bottom really disappears until you roll a tip and get some light on the yellow. The top - the black and yellow rear arcs on the wing are pretty worthless. The side has the best flying visibility of the three views.
On your graphic -
I really like the wing top images! I'd get a bit bolder on the purple hockey stick - wider at the fuse side "base" and take it over the aileron otherwise it gets lost anywhere but the bench. While Ilike the yellow accent stripes - thinkin' that they'll be way more effort than the bang in the air. I've kinda given up doing stuff of the stab / elev - a lot of work with little benefit - they make for good bench appeal. White background seems to eat up nice graphics - especially when there is a gap between the pieces. The black and yellow stripes on my wing top didn't do "nuthin'" in the air. I added them after flying it maybe 10 flights. 1st the yellow was added - whopeee chit. Then I added the black - couldn't see it either - waste of time and Ultracote.
The wing bottom needs those stripes to be pretty bold - maybe 2 1/2 - 3 inches each with 2 1/2 - 3 inches between.
The sides - those little old stripes will disappear. Do you have window decals? Imade some black Ultracote windows (standard is gray) and they really stand out. Take a look at the last pic - a bold splash up the side.
Now that I look back at the original covering (white base, midnight blue bottom stripes, red-n-blue side stripes and wing tops)I like it better than the white/red/yellow by a long shot. So why did Ichange it? Duh - no clue!
Yea - Ido know. I converted it into a tail dragger and eliminated the rubber band wing approach. Required taking an awful lot of covering off. I tried used an RCKen approach of one-piece wing/aileron covering - no hinge gap. Ididn't have a good handle on the technique and had more wrinkles than someone over the age of 100. Needed to shrink the covering before every visit to the field.
Final note - the nice sweeping curves are tough to cut - geometric stuff - easy to cut.
My LT-40 started with an all-white base like yours. Here's my thoughts.
Leading edge - gotta toss something over the LE - bright yellow, true red (but NOT Mike B's. shimmering glitter). What really shows up when you're dropping below the hog back are the yellow wrap-arounds on the shoulders. They look like big ol' landing lights. Not sure how an all-white LEwould show up on final approach. Might work. The bottom really disappears until you roll a tip and get some light on the yellow. The top - the black and yellow rear arcs on the wing are pretty worthless. The side has the best flying visibility of the three views.
On your graphic -
I really like the wing top images! I'd get a bit bolder on the purple hockey stick - wider at the fuse side "base" and take it over the aileron otherwise it gets lost anywhere but the bench. While Ilike the yellow accent stripes - thinkin' that they'll be way more effort than the bang in the air. I've kinda given up doing stuff of the stab / elev - a lot of work with little benefit - they make for good bench appeal. White background seems to eat up nice graphics - especially when there is a gap between the pieces. The black and yellow stripes on my wing top didn't do "nuthin'" in the air. I added them after flying it maybe 10 flights. 1st the yellow was added - whopeee chit. Then I added the black - couldn't see it either - waste of time and Ultracote.
The wing bottom needs those stripes to be pretty bold - maybe 2 1/2 - 3 inches each with 2 1/2 - 3 inches between.
The sides - those little old stripes will disappear. Do you have window decals? Imade some black Ultracote windows (standard is gray) and they really stand out. Take a look at the last pic - a bold splash up the side.
Now that I look back at the original covering (white base, midnight blue bottom stripes, red-n-blue side stripes and wing tops)I like it better than the white/red/yellow by a long shot. So why did Ichange it? Duh - no clue!
Yea - Ido know. I converted it into a tail dragger and eliminated the rubber band wing approach. Required taking an awful lot of covering off. I tried used an RCKen approach of one-piece wing/aileron covering - no hinge gap. Ididn't have a good handle on the technique and had more wrinkles than someone over the age of 100. Needed to shrink the covering before every visit to the field.
Final note - the nice sweeping curves are tough to cut - geometric stuff - easy to cut.
12-12-2010, 04:40 PM
#30
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Thanks for the comments Seamus.
I like your suggestion to widen the purple where it meets the fuse near the TE of the wing. I'll definitely widen it enough to swallow a little bit of the aileron root.
I know the yellow stripe is not going to be seen at more than 10 feet away. It's purely bench appeal. Same with the fuselage stripes. But I couldn't handle a plain white fuse side. I do have windows on the side of the fuse. They are black. The top of the wing - in the center - has black as well. Sorta "Decathlon" or "Citabria" theme...... where you can look up from the cockpit and see out. Updated fuse pic with the black windows attached to this post.
I've found that the bottom of the wing and stab are rarely seen if flying a race track pattern. I try and put the stripes on these areas so that I can keep my orientation when doing aerobatics. Don't know if you've seen me fly yet? [sm=confused.gif] I'm RARELY flat and level. Always twisting and rolling - upline or downline. I need something on the bottom to differentiate when the plane is balled up. Thats the only reason I even bother with the bottom of the wing and stabs at all. If you're flying flat and level - the bottom of the wing usually looks black anyway. Only time you see it flying the race track is an overhead pass down the runway.
Bottom wing stripes are 2.5 inches wide and will be spaced same distance. Bottom of the horizontal stab stripes are 1 inch and were spaced same.
Purple strips on the fuse are 1/2 inch and the yellow will be touching it, but only 1/4 inch wide for the yellow stripe. Red strip will be 1/2 inch. Thats all I can fit on there. The back of the fuse, under the stab is only 2 inches deep.
I like your suggestion to widen the purple where it meets the fuse near the TE of the wing. I'll definitely widen it enough to swallow a little bit of the aileron root.
I know the yellow stripe is not going to be seen at more than 10 feet away. It's purely bench appeal. Same with the fuselage stripes. But I couldn't handle a plain white fuse side. I do have windows on the side of the fuse. They are black. The top of the wing - in the center - has black as well. Sorta "Decathlon" or "Citabria" theme...... where you can look up from the cockpit and see out. Updated fuse pic with the black windows attached to this post.
I've found that the bottom of the wing and stab are rarely seen if flying a race track pattern. I try and put the stripes on these areas so that I can keep my orientation when doing aerobatics. Don't know if you've seen me fly yet? [sm=confused.gif] I'm RARELY flat and level. Always twisting and rolling - upline or downline. I need something on the bottom to differentiate when the plane is balled up. Thats the only reason I even bother with the bottom of the wing and stabs at all. If you're flying flat and level - the bottom of the wing usually looks black anyway. Only time you see it flying the race track is an overhead pass down the runway.
Bottom wing stripes are 2.5 inches wide and will be spaced same distance. Bottom of the horizontal stab stripes are 1 inch and were spaced same.
Purple strips on the fuse are 1/2 inch and the yellow will be touching it, but only 1/4 inch wide for the yellow stripe. Red strip will be 1/2 inch. Thats all I can fit on there. The back of the fuse, under the stab is only 2 inches deep.
12-12-2010, 04:56 PM
#31
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
My Chaos originally had two 1/2" stripes down the side on a bunch skinner fuse than the LT's. Thing that I realized - it's darn near impossible to lay down two (let alone three) stripes straight. I bailed on the skinny scheme and went wider because the film is much more easily handled. Are you using MonkeyKote? If so, maybe the Windex method for laying the stripes down would be a much easier task.
12-12-2010, 05:10 PM
#32
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Whatcha mean "race track" pattern? Who says? Unless you're planning on getting back into training mode. Are you gonna instruct again?
12-12-2010, 06:03 PM
#33
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Have ya ever laid down one of your favorite little tools and then forgot when you did it and what you were doing when you did it? Geez. Mumble, mumble, mumble ... No matter how much "cleaning up" you do in your search it doesn't show up.
12-12-2010, 06:06 PM
#34
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
ORIGINAL: SeamusG
Whatcha mean ''race track'' pattern? Who says? Unless you're planning on getting back into training mode. Are you gonna instruct again?
Whatcha mean ''race track'' pattern? Who says? Unless you're planning on getting back into training mode. Are you gonna instruct again?
Not sure I follow you ...
I meant to say that if a person is going to fly the "race track" then the bottom of the wing and stab is rarely seen. Only time a person would see it during that type of flying is on an overhead pass down the runway. So, if thats the type of flying a person is doing - then there's no point in striping the bottom of the wing or stabs. But thats not how I fly. I usually fly pretty aggressively and I need those stripes to keep myself oriented.
I did not mean to imply that you fly the race track. I hope my rambling did not come off like that. [
] I've seen you fly and I think you do a fine job on the sticks. [8D]I am finished with instructing for now.
Let's have a look at some updated pics. [8D]
12-12-2010, 06:10 PM
#35
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
ORIGINAL: SeamusG
Have ya ever laid down one of your favorite little tools and then forgot when you did it and what you were doing when you did it? Geez. Mumble, mumble, mumble ... No matter how much ''cleaning up'' you do in your search it doesn't show up.
Have ya ever laid down one of your favorite little tools and then forgot when you did it and what you were doing when you did it? Geez. Mumble, mumble, mumble ... No matter how much ''cleaning up'' you do in your search it doesn't show up.
I was looking for the allen wrench earlier so I could swap the razor blade in my Monkeykote stripping machine. Looked for it for 45 minutes. Several choice words flew outta my mouth. Finally found it.......... right where I left it.
12-12-2010, 06:16 PM
#36
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
What I meant to say when I said what I did was that you see the side while on the back straight and you see the bottom on the front straight. That leaves the turns where you would see the top while banked. And, yea, I fly kinda high. Hey, it's a trainer (isn't it?) ...
But then anybody who promotes a 3D throw down (ahem - like you) isn't gonna be flying many race track patterns ...
I'm to the point of going thru the trash - maybe it got pushed off the table into a trash bucket that got emptied into the big barrel ...
oops - forgot - kudos on the side stripes. Purple, yellow and red - em - I have some pearl purple, yellow and red ...
What are you using for covering?
But then anybody who promotes a 3D throw down (ahem - like you) isn't gonna be flying many race track patterns ...
I'm to the point of going thru the trash - maybe it got pushed off the table into a trash bucket that got emptied into the big barrel ...
oops - forgot - kudos on the side stripes. Purple, yellow and red - em - I have some pearl purple, yellow and red ...
What are you using for covering?
12-12-2010, 07:00 PM
#38
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Yeaaaaaa - found "da tool". Must 'a grabbed it up with a bunch of clamps and threw the mess into the clamp pile ...
Have you ever or have you seen a plane where someone tossed counter balances on the ailerons?
Have you ever or have you seen a plane where someone tossed counter balances on the ailerons?
12-12-2010, 07:05 PM
#39
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
ORIGINAL: SeamusG
Have you ever or have you seen a plane where someone tossed counter balances on the ailerons?
Have you ever or have you seen a plane where someone tossed counter balances on the ailerons?
The 4*60 wing was framed when I got it. I could easily have cut into the last wing bay and ran counter balances 3 inches wide on the tips of my ailerons. I'd have left the lite ply tip rib in place though. My aileron counter balance tip would have been 1/16 inch inside that last rib. I guess the counter balances would have been about 1 inch of 1.5" ahead of the hinge line.
Got the stripes on the bottom of the wing.
[:@] "internal server error" [:@] can't upload pics for some reason
12-12-2010, 07:47 PM
#42
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
yup - lighting thing. I've scanned pieces of covering. The RGB numbers for the color are consistent with snipits from Hanger 9's Ultracote site but, when it comes to blues & purples - they all look the same.
I've been able to upload using the original upload tool - not the "beta" uploader. When I do and I try to load more than 1 pic, the 1st loads fine but the 2nd loads really, really, really big. Gotta delete it, edit the post, upload 1 more pic, finish the edit and then repeat. Not gonna upload 12 pics any time soon. Hopin' that RCU admins don't put this "conversion" on their resume - they'll be on the streets in no time. Pretty amateur hour.
Oh yea - I'm starting a GPExtra 300S60 size build. There is a Extra 330SC (Red Bull Michael Goulian competitor flies one). He's got precise pics on his site and I've created some engineering drawings that match the 330SC ailerons (add counters), elevators (add counters)and rudder (bigger counter). Iput a post up on the aerodynamic sub-forum looking for some expert input as to how the mods will affect the flight characteristics. Been there for a while and NOposts. Emmmmm ...
I still haven't managed to sharpen a razor blade to NIB sharp. I'll try some more practice blades - unless I accidentally slice-n-dice myself.
I've been able to upload using the original upload tool - not the "beta" uploader. When I do and I try to load more than 1 pic, the 1st loads fine but the 2nd loads really, really, really big. Gotta delete it, edit the post, upload 1 more pic, finish the edit and then repeat. Not gonna upload 12 pics any time soon. Hopin' that RCU admins don't put this "conversion" on their resume - they'll be on the streets in no time. Pretty amateur hour.
Oh yea - I'm starting a GPExtra 300S60 size build. There is a Extra 330SC (Red Bull Michael Goulian competitor flies one). He's got precise pics on his site and I've created some engineering drawings that match the 330SC ailerons (add counters), elevators (add counters)and rudder (bigger counter). Iput a post up on the aerodynamic sub-forum looking for some expert input as to how the mods will affect the flight characteristics. Been there for a while and NOposts. Emmmmm ...
I still haven't managed to sharpen a razor blade to NIB sharp. I'll try some more practice blades - unless I accidentally slice-n-dice myself.
12-12-2010, 08:08 PM
#43
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
I saw your drawings of the counter balanced ailerons. GO FOR IT!! They look really cool.
I took some clear Monkeykote backing and taped it to the top of my wing. Then used a black ball point pen to draw lines all over. I've created a template that I can see through.
Laid the template on top of the covering and taped it down. Gonna start slicing soon. Pics to follow - gimme 15-20 minutes.....
I took some clear Monkeykote backing and taped it to the top of my wing. Then used a black ball point pen to draw lines all over. I've created a template that I can see through.
Laid the template on top of the covering and taped it down. Gonna start slicing soon. Pics to follow - gimme 15-20 minutes.....
12-12-2010, 09:48 PM
#45
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Clear template taped down over the purple. If you look hard you can see the pen marks.
Right wing with graphics laid out. Not ironed down yet.
Didn't turn out exactly like I had it drawn, but who cares? I don't usually try and cover like this. It's a lot of work and this is just a sport plane for hogging around the sky. Still, it's kinda fun to press yourself and try more complicated stuff. [8D]
That was a loooooooong 20 minutes. More like 1hr and 45 minutes.
Got all the parts and pieces cut for the wing. Dead tired and 6am comes early. Gotta hit the rack. Will stick it down tomorrow after work.
Right wing with graphics laid out. Not ironed down yet.
Didn't turn out exactly like I had it drawn, but who cares? I don't usually try and cover like this. It's a lot of work and this is just a sport plane for hogging around the sky. Still, it's kinda fun to press yourself and try more complicated stuff. [8D]
That was a loooooooong 20 minutes. More like 1hr and 45 minutes.
Got all the parts and pieces cut for the wing. Dead tired and 6am comes early. Gotta hit the rack. Will stick it down tomorrow after work.
12-13-2010, 05:01 PM
#46
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RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Hello RC Pilot;
Here's my "Bashed" LT-40 Scratch Built, OS .70 Four Stroke, 75" Wing, Twin Rudders, smooth flyer, 4 years old.
Also my LT-25 and Standard Sig LT-40 all used for Thursday evening RC Student Training by the Oklahoma Radio Kontrol Society (TORKS)
Ken AMA 1528
Here's my "Bashed" LT-40 Scratch Built, OS .70 Four Stroke, 75" Wing, Twin Rudders, smooth flyer, 4 years old.
Also my LT-25 and Standard Sig LT-40 all used for Thursday evening RC Student Training by the Oklahoma Radio Kontrol Society (TORKS)
Ken AMA 1528
12-18-2010, 08:40 PM
#50
Senior Member
RE: LT-40 and 4*60 Kit Bash
Thumbs up!!
I've felt your pain. I've never used monokote - have you ever danced with the "rumored" Windex method for doing monokote trim?
I put a piece of trim on a 4Star60 wing about the size of your purple trim. Easily took 1 hour for that one piece to keep the bubbles out.
I really don't like using a T pin to "plick" holes in the bubbles - rather use a decent #11 X-acto blade slipped into the side of the bubble while pushing the air out with the iron. It'll fix a bunch of evil bubbles. Give it a try. I really hate it when the damn forum software blocks out certain words that rhymn with plick.
I've felt your pain. I've never used monokote - have you ever danced with the "rumored" Windex method for doing monokote trim?
I put a piece of trim on a 4Star60 wing about the size of your purple trim. Easily took 1 hour for that one piece to keep the bubbles out.
I really don't like using a T pin to "plick" holes in the bubbles - rather use a decent #11 X-acto blade slipped into the side of the bubble while pushing the air out with the iron. It'll fix a bunch of evil bubbles. Give it a try. I really hate it when the damn forum software blocks out certain words that rhymn with plick.