skyracer068

I concur!! Just kidding buddy.

Tim Redelman

My Feedback: (36)

I was helping an old friend to day and last couple of weekends with a Velox. CG set on the front antirotation pins as called for by Wagner himself at the recent dogs meet in Dayton. Trouble is that the airplane will pitch wildly at various times during flight very similar to the old videos of the mig29 or Sukoi su27 doing what they called the Cobra manuver. This happened to me on Landing in one instance and happened to him three times during different flights. When it happened to myself it was right before touchdown and the airplane pitched 90 Degrees to the runway and by sure luck was exactly the right hieght to come back down and land squarely on all three gear. I chalked it up to a gust of wind, whatever. Today two times during flight at a safe altitude (Luckily again) when the airplane was flying alittle slow but nowhere near a stall it did it again once in a shallow turn and once flying straight and level. Last time was on a botched landing from the owner (sorry Bob) where he came in and bounced hard at which time it instantly did the same cobra type manuver pointed straight up and this time made it to about 25-30ft in the air and it was pancakes for everyone. After it happened to me we put two strips of stick on wieght in the nose and it didn't seem to make it fly/land any different. Whats up with this thing, Of course I recomended a strict diet of purple koolaid but its a little late for this now. He also had another Velox that had a similar problem on its maiden voyage and the one we were flying today was a replacement given to him for the first one which crashed similarly. Elevator to close to center of lift ?? I'm not a desighner I leave that to B.V. Two Veloxes= One Bobcat isn't that what they say??? We'll I think were there arent we. And have nothing to show for it. This is not a bash at Fei Beo and not really an push for BVM but facts are facts was up?

Tim Redelman
BVM rep trying to help a friend.

Ruizmilton

My Feedback: (29)

Funny, Mine did exactly the same on the maiden flight on landing, plane was damaged beyond repair, exchanged e-mails with Wagner, thought he would be willing to replace as this is definitely a design issue whether FB acknowledges it or not, yet did not happen, as it was explained to me it was my fault!!!??? ..... I won't comment on that... I asked for replacement parts, he does not have any, they need to be manufactured to order!!! needless to say I won't buy another Feibao.

TREADSTONE

Well...'They' is a very powerful word...This Velox from the get go has been very good...now fitted with a simjet 23lb ...very smooth flying, consistently good. Not saying that it has the superb quality of BVM. But neither does it have the Price.

JustABigKid

My Feedback: (3)

Treadstone - have you experienced this pitch-up/cobra situation during slow flight?

gmeister

My Feedback: (8)

No problem with mine. I just flew the snot outta mine this weekend at Route 66 jets. The only problem was my stained shorts and high blood pressure. With a P70 this thing is a missile and is fast enough for me.
It also slowed down very nicely.

RCISFUN

My Feedback: (44)

Gary, was that your Velox in the photos
See thread
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7924726/tm.htm

It looks great in the air and judging by the photos you must have burned your fair share of Jet A

Rich

gmeister

My Feedback: (8)

Yes that is my Velox. Look real cool doesn't it!

Gary

=skywalker=

My Feedback: (7)

What would you say the top speed is with a Wren SS? Also flight time? I wanna smoke my jet buddies who are flying the Bobcat.

=skywalker=

My Feedback: (7)

What would you say the top speed is with a Wren SS? Also flight time? I wanna smoke my jet buddies who are flying the Bobcat.

InboundLZ

My Feedback: (10)

Are any of you guys flying the Velox without the engine fairing in place? The engine I have installed is too big to allow the fairing to be installed.

Please Advise

hoversmooth999

Hello to all,
I did the maiden on my Velox this last weekend and had two successful flights with perfect landings. It is equipped with a JC Falcon. I love the way this aircraft flies. I did however encounter this Cobra phenomena on my second flight during the last turn on my final approach for landing. Although very alarming, I was able to power out of it and proceeded landing without flaps. It still landed nicely at a comfortable rate of speed without the flaps. I intend on going back out this weekend and take it a couple mistakes high and purposely try to make it happen to see exactly what causes this. In doing so I hope to learn what not to do to prevent this from happening again in the future.So far, it is not known if this happens without flaps, because it happened to me with flaps deployed. My theory thus far, from my own experience and from what I've read, is that this mainly only happens during slower than normal flight, because my second flight landing approach was an extreme bit slower than in my first flight landing approach. It also seems that in slow enough flight the leading edge of the wing and flatness of the front of the fuse could possibly prevent airflow if any from reaching the stab and elevator thus rendering it useless. I say this in connection with the fact that if flying on a warm day, maybe one of the many hot air thermal lifts on the field could violently pitch up the nose during this event of slow flight, which I've observed many a time on non-powered gliders in thermal lift. Keep in mind, I am no engineer, but this is just a hypothesis that I hope to test this weekend. For now I would just think that as long as the flight speed is held sufficient and nose of the Velox kept at a proper angle, this could possibly help in prevention of this happening. This is no Eurosport, and high alfa landings are out of the question. Like I said, this is however a great flying jet and I'm very impressed with it. I will update after this weekend. Sorry for the lengthy post. Thank-you.
Regards[8D]

InboundLZ

My Feedback: (10)

Hover, you have the same engine installed as I do, you running the engine cover?

rcjets_63

My Feedback: (4)

hoversmooth999,

Any info/testing/impressions on the cobra problem would be much appreciated. I have a spare turbine that is looking for a home and a Velox is under serious consideration. However, this cobra phenomenon has me concerned and, if anything, would be the reason to stay away from the Velox. So far, it sounds like if you get a bit too slow on final, you're looking at a cobra and quite possibly a complete loss of the airframe. Not good!

Regards,

Jim

TREADSTONE

..Gents.. ...there realy is no 'Cobra phenomenon'...its very simple...keep the speed up , the nose down...NO high Alpha landings...Thats it...

Just Enjoy...

TREADSTONE

...the Velox X is nice too...Sandor's at Jetpower in Germany couple of weeks back...

InboundLZ

My Feedback: (10)

So, all these Velox's out there and nobody has any input on my question about the engine cover?

CARS II

My Feedback: (7)

Don't sweat it about the engine cover, if you decided to instal a bigger engine and the engine cover doesn't fit now then put it a side for later use ( look at all the deltas out there ). I don't own one myself but I have concidered it before and my engines are to big to fit the cover, it's like using the bypass or not, I have used it full, half, and non at all, it worked fine on all aplications.

I hope this helps.

PS: Good luck with the move ( I know the feeling, no field no move )

hoversmooth999

Hello,
Diamondback, my Velox flies fine without the engine cover. To Treadstone, I agree with you and I think I in fact mentioned about keeping the speed up and nose down in my paragraph. I said that the jet flies great. I just want to find some kind of answer for the Velox owners who have encountered this and see why this happens in slow flight. Thank-you and again, the Velox flies great.

CARS II

My Feedback: (7)

Imaging all the drag been created by the Flaps when they are in the down position and the disturb air coming form the Flaps interrupting the smooth flow of air over the Elevator, the Elevator now is not creating suficient positive lift to push the plane nose down for level flight [:@] so, here comes the Cobra maneuver. Whatch out Tom Cruise!!!!!


I hope this helps
( or someone correct me )

Correction: negative to positive, sorry.

hoversmooth999

Hello all,
That is a very good explanation. I hope to put these theories to test on Sunday when I go out to fly. That flaps may have a lot to do with it. Mine flew fine with 20 mm of flap under good power. It was that second flight where it may just have slowed a little too much. I remember even going to idle at one particular moment to lose some altitude. That just may have been the cause. I'll be sure to know by the end of the weekend. Until then just keep up air speed and keep the angles low. This sure is a beautiful aircraft. Thanks everone for the insites.
Regards

hoversmooth999

ATTENTION:
I would like to clear something up, and even apologize if I was misunderstood. I DO NOT intend to disuade anyone from purchasing this fine aircraft or give it a bad name. I love my Velox. In my opinion it flies excellently and very solid. The fact of what happened to me on my last flight just made me curious. If it's about keeping up speed or keeping the nose down or anything, I would like to know just how slow or just how high an angle it can handle. I am sorry and I just wanted to help by posting my findings. Thank-you everyone.
Regards

CJ2002

No need for apologies, Hoversmooth, the Velox does have an unusual stalling characteristic form which, here in the UK anyway, it seems to have developed a bad name.

It's perhaps controversial to say, and it's my take only, but I'm convinced much of this opinion is because quite a few people who have/had Veloxes here, were 'brought up' on the ultra safe and not very challenging ARF trainers, which you can 'abuse' in terms of handling, but when something comes along with slightly unpredictable characteristics (like the Velox) that requires experience and a 'bit of that piloting sh1t', incidents occur. Lots of pilots don't explore their models flight charcteristics to find out what they're like/capable of, too. Several Veloxes have been lost here due solely to mishandling (not just my opinion).

To balance it up a bit, Treadstone obviously likes his Velox, I like mine (80+ flights to date), it's a nice model to fly...as long as you stay inside it's comfort zone (and yours!).

If it's of any use, I did a build/flying thread here...

http://jmajets.co.uk/board/viewtopic...st=0&sk=t&sd=a

...and you'll se that my (final) opinion is that the tailplane gets blanked, causing the violent pitching up...which looks great when you do it on purpose!

Rgds,

Dick
England

justinh

My Feedback: (6)

We've got 3 people with Velox's here. 100 flights on one, 39 on another and a third ready to be maidened next week. You can't really go wrong for the price. Mine flys great, no bad habits. P-80, no engine cover. Slows down very nice, I run 50 degrees of flap with 3 degrees of crow in the ailerons for landing. We've been flying all summer from a 450' runway with corn planted 50 feet from the end, so landing approaches are fairly steep and slow. The Velox's seem to come in just as good as the Bobcats at the field.

Only times that I've seen a 'cobra' type situation is when the airplane is stalled. A friend of mine bounced a landing which kicked the nose up and stalled the airplane which resulted in a cobra type situation. Also, if you go up and stall the plane like a spin entry it will pitch up. Neither of which should happen during normal flying unless you do it on purpose.

Overall, I can't complain and I'd buy another one. A little more work to get it in the air than a BVM, but I can think about where to mount alot of stuff and reinforce quite a few glue joints for $3000.

hoversmooth999

Well sirs,
I would hope you are not implying a lack of experience on MY part (CJ2002) and I guessing not. I can however thankyou for your insites as several people have asked about this already. I just wanted to help because no one was responding to their questions. This aircraft is quite a rocket compared to my C-ARF Euro and I love it. It seems a good number of people were very appreciative of my standing up to finally look into the matter. For those I thank-you as well.
Regards everyone.