Pond Skipper

I went and bought yet another set of tires lol the 1.8in seem small still so 2.5in was bought last night. I also picked up pilots from England will post that next maybe a better fit and the paint work is better.

I am now transferring the original sketch into a clean black line drawing to finish out the template work I have bought two sheets of poster board and have all the wood. I will have to wait till the pilots roll in to decide the formers final width.

Its a tad bit of work to clean up the work so far the outside of the drawing is cleaned up next the internals. The rudder was copy pasted and cleaned up this way all drawings under the original will be black and white then printed out to full scale to be transferred to poster board templates. The plans can be reprinted to any scale for .010 to full manned craft should you want a 24 ft span, spruce or aluminum cloth or nylon covered ultralight with a Rotax 447 high performance engine.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

This is the fun way to do the formers..

hllywdb

Indeed. I have a client that has a 24" and 60" lazer. It has let me turn stupid ideas into kits at will! Of course my hand cutting skills have suffered quite a bit and when forced to hand cut a rib on the fly my work now looks about as good as my crayon drawings in kindergarden.

Pond Skipper

Well that just makes me feel like a caveman hacking out wood the old farts way

Pond Skipper

Speaking of formers I have 1/8in lite ply bought on Thurs. but I have been looking at my pilot options and I really would love to haul around 1/10th scale.
The original post of Bridgette looks perfect but alas she is 1/9th and too big so having to sketch wider formers as an option. I have a total of 4 pilots in the mail to see what will work best weight wise and width.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

Well, when the laser breaks down you'll still be happily cranking out formers in a display of keen hand eye coordination and perseverance. I haven't cut a former with it yet, so you're way ahead anyway.

Where it really shines is cutting the 2nd and 3rd copy, or the next version that actually fits like you meant it to. I can handle cutting one of something by hand, usually.

Pond Skipper

Yea as long as my scroll saw doesn't break down I'm good, no way will I go back to a exacto knife or a hand saw.


Welp after some effort a viable plan from the original pencil sketch of the Lil Miss Butter Knife has grown some legs.
Just down to getting the pilot options in the mail to decide on the former widths.

Cross Check

Hi Pond Skipper,
Great thread, Thanks for sharing with us.
Cool Project !
I like Bill Stout's mantra: "Simplicate, and add more Lightness"
(And that was in the Ford Trimotor days !)
I'll enjoy following this thread.

I have a Cox .09 story for you:

Way back when, I was a part of a Cox .049 'control line' gang, Riding our 'Mustang' bicycles with high handlebars, and everything strapped on the 'Sissy Bar' behind the 'Bannana Seat'...
Long story short,
We got into .19 muffled longer lines. No complaints.
One day, a cool plane showed up with a Cox Medallion .09
We were all, this is awesome, can I try it?
Test flight was perfect.
Halfway through the second flight, the Cops showed up.
That 'sweet sound' to us,
Was 'annoying' to others...
I still cannot figure some people out !

Nice Project Pond Skipper,
Reminds me of a low winged Heath Baby Bullet...

Take care,
Have fun,
Dave'crosscheck'Fallowfield
Maac 6437
Unabashed Combat Team

Pond Skipper

Thank you Dave should be a fun one to fly, will be the 4th .09 powered plane I have built.

On a side note I could not resist buying two 1/5th scale vintage British pilots tonight which had me doing up a quick sketch to see just what 4.5in tall pilots would look like in a small two seater small nimble fast lil scout size plane the second man being the cameraman leaving RAF Cpt. Sir Rodney T. Winkle 3rd to do all the flying. What came out was a fuselage 38in in length and an estimated wingspan of 44in. The fuselage being 7in high in the thick area it narrows down fast to keep the drag and weight down. 484sq in wing 11 x 44/ est. 3.2 lb aircraft. Engine and pilots 14.5oz. /4ch flown on a OS 26 Surpass with a 12 x 3 vintage wood prop. So basicly ssssssssslow lumbering eye candy landing on 3.5in wheels.

I dont know if I can pull off a 3.2lb plane this size but carbon square stock and balsa are my friends. I have used a .20 and 26 Surpass both provide good thrust and speed for two other planes under 2.5 lbs. both racer types one 32in span the other 36in span with 9 x 6 sport props. I hope to be able to fly very slow sub 15mph and still hold ground for around 75mph scale speeds for calm lazy day flying in my face up close and personal.The pilots will be sitting lower in there seats around 1in inside the cockpit -

The second pic gives you an idea of size up against the very TD .09 that Miss Butter Knife will be throttling

Pond Skipper

Hit the store Sat. and picked up the last of the hardware, its down to waiting on the pilots to come in to size the beast up.

Pond Skipper

I cleaned up the pic added some more detail and moved the wing forward with engine and batts there is enough to balance this design.
I moved the pilots down into their seats all seems doable. If not a 40 size 4 cyl should be plenty.

Per write up a modern 11 x 6 will get 8.4k rpm on 10%
11 x 4 will get 10.2k ish on 20%
Est. 11k unloaded in the air for 42 mph.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

Whoa dude - unloading to 42 mph.. that's some serious velocity there. Modern aerodynamics might not be able to predict the outcome..

But with technology advancing at the frantic rate it does, I predict some day soon somebody will crack 50 with an RC model - just you wait!

Pond Skipper

Lol yes will actually break the scale speed ratio by a fair amount! Scary fast

Pond Skipper

The aluminum 1.25" spinners came in from china town I was surprised they looked like tru turn spinners, thin and light two for only 12 bucks vs 1 for $23 by tru turn. They are so nice and light I went and bought 2 more for future use.

The stock spinner adapter nut will fit an AP .09 with no mods so recommend. For the TD .09 an adapter nut had to be fabricated. I bought some 3/8th aluminum rod tapped it for a 5-40 bolt as the spinner came with a 3mm bolt. Then tapped the other end for a 6-32 thread for the prop stud slapped two flat spots for a crescent wrench, takes about 20 mins to fabricate depending on your tools / equipment on hand.

Pond Skipper

Update Known weights:

226.2 grams = 7.98 ounces

- Engine / prop
- RX
- 4 servos
- 2 oz round sullivan tank
- engine mount
- 1.8in dia golden age wheels 17.9g - Revised to 2.5" wheels 36.6g

Goal 17oz - 9.02 oz left to work with

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

$12 is just incredible for a True Turn clone.

The G&Z .061 spinner is the pointy type for speed. I imagine they cost a pretty penny, plus you would be stuck with adapting them. They are so wafer thin, but very strong.

What are your known weights for ALL linkages from A to Z...?
This is where I need to improve my game, instead of just grabbing fists full of 2-56 rods.
Pull / pull makes sense to do sometimes..but I'd never use it for a speedy project.
For torsion type rods..I think 2-56 is "about it" for a fast 1/2 A plane. 2-56 torsion rods can get "whippy" if they are made too long, but they are as heavy as I'd go for 1/2 A..
I used to fool around with music wire control rods, plywood control horns and adjustment kinks placed at one end. I also used EZ connectors and 1/16" copper coated steel brazing rods and never had any trouble. With the EZ connectors, you get the model trimmed out before cranking the set screws down super tight. This wasn't much lighter than using 2-56 hardware.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

I think you can do a fine job with 1/2A pushrods out of .047" wire as long as it is supported in a thin light slippery tube and keep your free ends short. I used that on the Simple 400 tail group and they were absolutely no slop, smooth and easy to actuate. I beat the crap out of that thing by burying the sticks at high rate at full bore (120-125) and nothing even whimpered, control was always smooth and tight - this with HS-55's. It didn't do so well in a full power dive through a tree however. (oh yeah, the other "up"..). I need another one, it was fun.

Pond Skipper

http://www.ebay.com/itm/161492847679...#ht_3209wt_877

These spinners with adapter kit are sold thru varies vendors on ebay

$6.30 per I bought 2 so 12.30 + pro rated shipping $8 shipping for 20.60 total on 2 so I payed 10.30 ea. 13 less plus stateside shipping just to get 1 true turn without the adapter kit!!! So cheap cheappp for the quality!

Pond Skipper

I have used pull pull many times bearing servos tend to hold up to the constant pressure better small craft don't need much tension to function well. On big birds I use a slave horn in front of the servo to hold the constant load. Pull pull is the way to go with big planes using stranded steel. I also use small nyrod for anything from 15 to 40 size and the big nyrod for anything from 60 to 120 size from there pull pull is best. 35cc and up slave horns on both ends keep the strain off the control surfaces and servos.

Pond Skipper

Still waiting on my pilot selections to show some from the far east some from the europe, without them I can't confirm the final size. I hope the reduced Bridgette pilot works approx 1/10th scale.

I sourced another option for the 2 seater scout plane a Saito FA 72 here is the size difference in scale to the OS 26 / enough engine to go straight up to hide from the hun in the clouds

Pond Skipper

Cpt. Sir Rodney T. Winkle III and his Scouter Lt. Basil C. Rathbone have arrived to the hanger!
The good Cpt. has been eyeballing the OS power plant he weighs in at 37g Baz comes in at 43.7g

Bridgette's younger sister showed up she is damn near as big W 3mm less H 4mm less. 64mm W
Waiting on 2 more to show.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Those are just too much..!
What a great business to be in, since the product is so tiny [easy to store, ship, etc.] and would appeal to more than just RC modelers.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

I found your next project.. http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/a...c-1970-aam.htm

Pond Skipper

Yea thats cool seen it before but I only build my own designs = ) I haven't done anything but for the last 30+ yrs.


Still waiting on the smaller pilot for final selection.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

That one girl looks like she could be Jack Elam's grand daughter...?