One more point if I may, sometime a plane which tries to climb too much may have the aielrons acting a bit like flaps which act like a high incidence wing. This can be more pronounced on a hard wing such as the VF airplanes as the wings do not tend to mush and provide strong lift till the last. I usually try to set both ailerons slightly higher at zero position if the wings are giving too much lift, usually will work without having to down thrust the engine. Once all these variables are set, which can take quite a bit of experimenting, both the VF Edge and the Extra will drop the nose slightly when power is chopped, a bit more drop with the Extra. M2cW![8D]