Jonny, i can do this with my cogar really easy. im hoping to fly it on saturday and get some photos. Ive managed to trap my arial in the elevator, thats a bit frigtning wehn you have to pull up to get it out and then the plan pitched towards you [X(]. With my flip i just find it unstable when the hover isnt completly verticall. i cant get completly verticle hovers as its always too windy so i have to puch the nose down there fore making it really unstable. it deos very nice TRs tho, solid.