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Old 10-15-2004 | 11:03 PM
  #44  
cummings66
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From: Moberly, MO
Default RE: Real Flight G3!

Did you even check out Elite's product and website? X-Plane is not the first flight sim to be certified, you'll notice I said "his out" is consumer priced. The other products are very expensive, costing 10's of thousands in the beginning, but it was a flight sim and only able to be used as a real training aid if you bought the hardware to go with the software. And I do believe Version 5 was touted by Austin as being certified. In any event, if you read the x-plane website you'll see they're using a version 6.12 for the training, not 7 as you believe. Plus you'll notice it's a LOT more than the software, you will not buy a $25 program and be able to use to for FAA training. What you have to realize about Austin is he tends to leave out details. For example, 6.12 is the only version the FAA allows to be used with the hardware for training, so, the FAA has said nothing about version other than the one they looked at. If you've been a long time X-Plane user like me you'll know that he's made many changes during each version and that some changes are radical and changed the characteristics of how the sim runs.

Read this quote from his site if you don't believe me. Now tell me again this is consumer priced for the FAA certified trainer.

Now, actually LOGGING this time requires you to be in a Motus full-motion sim (price tag: about $150,000.00) with an instructor, so this route will only be affordable if you train at a fight training center that uses a Fidelity Flight Simulations Motus platform... but if you want all the accuracy without the cost... then you can have it for $79.99 right here!

I'll add, how do you get the accuracy when you don't have that hardware. The Cheap CH Products do not come close in quality to the Motus hardware pieces. Don't even try to convince me a consumer grade joystick is as good, not even close.

I didn't claim to be better than the FAA, but I have flown the sims they have approved in the past and they are not that realistic compared to the real thing. They do not replicate the VFR environment as you think they do. They do fine as an IFR trainer, but I know of no CFI who claims they do well for VFR flying. Read up on FAA certification before you make claims that certification endorses a flight simulation product's realism. It does not. Also make note of the fact that it's not X-Plane 6.12 that was certified, it was that PLUS the hardware, it was a system that was certified. Not just a piece of software. There's a couple of flight sims such as On Top that are also certified, with hardware for PCATD training. What I am saying is that there are several sims that are FAA certified with the appropriate hardware for usage and that FAA certification does not give it a stamp of realism as you seem to believe. If you don't believe me then call your local FSDO and ask them personally for the requirements for certification.

Maybe it's our hardware we use to drive it. I use CH Products Yoke and rudder pedals and find that the rudder is much too sensitive unless I adjust the controls, then it's too slow to react. For example, in my Cessna if I drop in 40 degrees of flap, use full rudder and enough aileron to do what I want I can get a descent rate and attitude that the sim does not replicate. I can not stall the sim as my plane stalls in that configuration, it does not want to enter a spin as easily as my plane. It does not bounce as realistically as my plane does in turbulence.

I have found no difference between various planes in how they handle crossed controls, they're all pretty much the same for the stock planes. I've tried the downloaded ones as well, and some are better than what Austin provides, which are customer supplied if you didn't know it, and I have yet to find a free plane that will slip or handle a crosswind correctly. That's what I dislike about the sims, they have yet to duplicate that aspect of flight realistically. Maybe the commercial planes are better, I didn't want to spend more money on a plane that wouldn't be better than the free/provided planes.

As to the Alantica, I heard it from the owner. I have heard nothing more as to why he's not continued on. He originally said he'd fix it and continue testing but as far as I can tell it's a dead project now. Maybe you know more since you say it was pilot error, all I know is he said it lifted off early and he didn't intend on flying it then, but he did so in order to save the plane. It was too sensitive in pitch I think he said and ended up crashing on the runway if I recall correctly, it's been over a year ago now.

Lest you think I don't like X-Plane or Austin, let me say it plainly. I think X-Plane is the best PC flight sim on the market today, it's the most realistic one you'll buy. But I'll qualify that by by saying it does not replicate the VFR flight experience in all details such as modeling spins, slips, things like that. Ask Austin, he's admitted that already. Read the forums, you'll see that mentioned there as well.

Good software yes, perfect modeling, no.