Bob your points are well taken, but long noses are yaw distablizing. If we just stretched the tail moments a bit; not much and shortend the nose moments a bit I think we could have better flying planes. I have 20 years plus designing prop planes some of which have been flown at the TOC by Steve Stricker, but no designs that I have done myself for a turbine plane. I did just today recieve a copy of Kerry Sterner's Facet 2300 serial number 1 on the plans. It has just what I was asking for; a slightly longer Tail moment compared to the nose moment. I will pick uop a copy of Kamps book to take into the points you have pointed out. Thanks for the information.