bdavison

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Ive been seriously considering this plane as I have a two cycle .91 that is just sitting around. Anyone know if it would have enough power for it to do 3D?

Basement Troll

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Barry I got my Sig tailwhell assembly in the mail today. It looks good but I was wondering if you bothered to put the second (support) piece in when you installed it on your other plane? It seems like overkill to me. It's a bit heavier than I thought it would be but it will likly withstand my lousy landings better. The kit's tailwheel is a bit suspect. The plastic support bends from side to side when I'm just working on the plane. Let me know what you think.
Don

aubej

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The 91 should give it good performance. We'll be testing the RII on a MVVS 91 soon.

Jason

mndless

Hey all,

I recently received mine and am very impressed with the kit... I have it together and am waiting on my back ordered 120 from Horizon ... The kit has been very easy to assemble and the quality is quite good... although I'm going to go back and look at the landing gear again after reading basement troll's note.... what did you notice that indicated they were backwards?

Hope to have her in the air next week - if the engine gets here... but again, the quality of the kit is quite good and assembly is very easy and straightforward.

Mndless

Basement Troll

My Feedback: (3)

On the landing gear there is an angled side and a straight side. The angled side should be rearward the straight side forward. It's only a cosmetic thing, it won't hurt to leave it. I just a bit anal I guess. I don't have a very good picture of it or I would post it for you.
Don

Barry Cazier

My Feedback: (17)

Basement Troll...
Concerning the Sig tailwheel, I don't have any pictures for some reason (I know I took some) but I do have a picture of one I installed on my UCD60. I'm not clear bywhat you mean about a 2nd support. I just screwed it on and attached it to the rudder.

Still haven't got mine, should be today or tomorrow.

Thanks,
Barry

STG

My Feedback: (26)

I think you are right. The 2nd or 3rd leaf (spring) is most likely overkill on this size bird. It is more for scale looks than anything else. Rest the tail wheel on a scale without the extra leaf(s) and apply pressure to bottom it out. You will most likely see that it takes a lot of force...more than you want to generate on any landing. Think my Sig tail wheel bottomed at ~15 pounds and the stock one bottomed at 5 pounds(different plane).

Basement Troll

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Hi Barry. The tailwheel assembly is the same as I have but mine came with another leaf like a leaf spring setup for support. I thought it was a bit long and started working on it and broke it of course. I have this thing about breaking tailwheels.[:@] I ended up fixing it and it looks good anyway. I ordered 2 as I needed one for my Harrier too. I think I'll order 2 more for when I break these. I re-did the rudder pull/pull last night and it's much better now. I started on the engine mounts last night and it is fine except I need to trim away some of the triangle stock behind the mount so the nuts will sit flush. I might put a bit of fibreglass cloth inside the motor box and use some alcohol diluted epoxy for a bit of extra strength. Most of the jobs from here are easy enough but I have a serious dislike of doing cowls. I ordered a Performance Specialties muffler and adjustable exhaust header so I can go out the bottom of the plane. I haven't seen it yet though and it's getting close to when I'll need it. Hopefully it comes soon. I guess I should have requested express shipping and paid more. Let me know when yours comes.
Don

Barry Cazier

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Basement Troll...

Got my plane just a few minutes ago. I opened the box just enough to verify no real damage. I couldn't see any.

I was surprised that the box was not double boxed, yet it seemed to arrive in good shape. I pulled out the wings and fuse and I felt the covering and workmanship are first class quality. Not a single wrinkle in any of the covering. I'm impressed. The cowl is huge!. The elevators are "flying". The hinges are CA, I'll probably change them to pinned. I've had a couple of CA hinges break on one of my UCD. I caught it before it became a problem but I'm not going to chance it.

The motor mount box was very different. Not closed it. Yet it looks strong with the side braces going through the firewall into the fuse and appear to be about 8" long. Good engineering.

The wings, fuse, elevators all come in different cloth/paper bags. This is the first ARF I've got that did that. Pretty nice. Things were boxed ok. Nothing real special and I felt that if the box was crushed very bad there may have been some damage. But....It arrived safe, I guess that means the box was "good enough".

The fuel tank looks huge. Not sure how big but surprisingly big. I might go smaller to reduce weight, but I'll look into that further.

Over the next day or two I'll weigh each part individually and see what we got . By the weekend I should be able to start the assembly process.

My first impressions are very good. One of the very best or maybe even the best ARF I've seen. They all just seem to get better and better. I've personally assembled a EF Yak, Showtime, Funtana, Mayhem, and many UCDs. Also an Ultra Stick or two. This Velox is as good as any, (yes, including the EF Yak) by my first impression. Very nicely done. I'm impressed.
Well, got to go.
Thanks
Barry

Barry Cazier

My Feedback: (17)

Couldn't stand the thought of that airplane "in the box" so last night, late last night, I pulled everything out and weighed it. Here's what I got

(2) Wings w/ailerons = 27.0
Carbon fiber wing tube = 3.0
Canopy, untrimmed = 3.8
Fuse w/hatch = 31.0
Cowl, uncut = 5.6
(2) Stab w/elevators = 4.4
Rudder = 1.2
Tailwheel = .4
Aluminum LG w/hardware = 5.8
(2) Wheels = .8
(2) Wheel pants = 2.2
Fuel tank w/fittings = 3.4
Engine mount w/hardware = 3.4
Rear stab tubes w/hardware = 1.0
Hardware package = 2.0

Total = 95.0 or 5lbs 15ozs

I didn't look that close, very late, but I think there is a pull/pull package or rear mount rudder package, both would be in the above weight. Obviously you would only use one. Also, I think there is two hardware packs. Obviously you would only use one.

I feel with the cowl cut outs, the canopy cut, don't use wheel pants, maybe a couple of other things (packageing in above) I think the actual weight is about 6 ozs less. So figure 5lbs 9ozs. My engine radio gear package is 45.4ozs or 2lbs 13.4ozs.

So...add it all up...89ozs + 45.4ozs = 134.4ozs or 8lbs 6.4ozs. Add say....4ozs for glue and various misc items, my best guess ready to fly weight less fuel is 8lbs 11ozs.

That's not as light as I'd hoped, but every plane I own is in that catagory. Certainly though, it should be a very competetive weight. The wing area is 965 square inches. So it should have a light wing loading. I'm not sure how to calculate that. Can you guys give that too me?

Anyways, as I looked thing over more closely I'm very impressed with the quality and finish of this ARF. I look forward to the build.

Thanks
BArry

Barry Cazier

My Feedback: (17)

Oh, and so we can keep all this in prospective....

The manual weighs 1.8 ozs
Shipping weight = 12.1 lbs

Thanks
Barry

Basement Troll

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Barry that is almost exactly what I came up with for weights. I didn't add as much for glue though. One thing I forgot to mention. I have big hands and get a bit rough at times. I have cracked the balsa former that runs around the top of the opening of the hatch a couple of times just pulling my hands out. Be careful as it is fairly fragile. I mounted the engine last night and as I said above I had to use my Dremel to sand away flat spots in the tri-stock for the engine mount nuts to sit flat. I used Nylock nuts and washers instead of the blind nuts supplied. There is lots of room to get at the nuts with this engine mount design. Mounting the engine was easy enough but mine ended up 3 or 4 mm further out than it was supposed to because of the carb control horn hitting the engine mount bolt. I could have taken everything apart and drilled another hole in the mount but I decided I would leave it as is. I then ran the pushrod in one bottom corner where the fuel tank goes. I made a notch in the bottom of the firewall and then made a "U" with a piece of aluminum tube. I drilled 2 small holes in the bottom of the tri-stock and glued the "U" in to support the pushrod. This ended up being a very straight run and seems to work smoothly. The only thing I'm unsure of is the setup I have on the throttle control arm. I don't trust the set screw thing I have on there so I might switch to a ball connector. I used a Sullivan nyrod for a push rod, mostly because it was the only thing I had that was long enough. The pictures are below. I have included a picture of my slightly revised Sig tailwheel assembly. (Revised as I broke it before I installed it)
Don

Barry Cazier

My Feedback: (17)

Basement Troll...

Looking good...Very good. Man you are close. Is your weather such that you can fly this time of year?

I wouldn't trust the set screw on your throttle. At least I wouldn't trust it again. Mine came off on my Harrier and I flew it for 11 minutes at wide open throttle. Testiment to that plane that it didn't come apart. After inspection it was the set screw came loose and allow the rod to pull out and leave the throttle wide open. I fixed it with just a "Z" bend.

Your Sig tailwheel looks nice. Maybe they'll start offering that as an option.

Thanks
Barry

Barry Cazier

My Feedback: (17)

Basement Troll...

When you are completely done please give us your weight then too. I know that when you weigh it piece by piece it doesn't always add up to the sum of the parts. I'm interested to hear your final weight.
Thanks
Barry

Basement Troll

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The weather here has been very mild. Usually at this time of year we have a foot or two of snow and it would be rare to go above freezing. This year it has hardly gone below freezing. It was 50 degress on Monday here. I have flown a lot this year. If we get snow I fly my profiles. I just hand launch them and harrier in and plop them in the snow. I bet I've put 20 flights on my Harrier in the last 3 or 4 weeks. I think I'll take your advice and use a "Z" bend on the throttle. By the way that is pronouced "Zed" in Canada! The fuel tank is big. It is 18.5 oz. That should be good for about 18 minutes of messing around. I asked Jason and he said the tank worked well with the YS. I have a 16oz Hayes around I could use. I'll decide that when I start putting the thank together. I'm anxious to see the end weight as well. I thought of piling everything into the fuse last night to see what I ended up with but I got over it.
Don

Basement Troll

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Last night I installed the throttle servo which went well. I put a "Z" bend in the pushrod for the throttle control horn and a set screw on the servo arm. It seems to work well. I then started on the cowl. I usually dread this but it went well and didn't take me that long. I made the opening on the bottom quite big as I worry about the engine over heating. The way the cowl goes on this plane works well. I then decided I would pile everything that needed to go on the plane into the fuse and see what kind weight I would get. The only thing I didn't have was the Tru-Turn spinner that I haven't got yet. The weight came to 8lbs 14.4oz. This was about 6 oz more than I had hoped for but I don't know what I could change other than Karbonite servos and a mini on the throttle. The tailwheel assembly is likely an oz or so heavier as well. I did not put the wheel pants in either as I don't use them. I was then reading about the EF Yak and it seems to be around 9 lbs dry so maybe I was expecting too much. Hopefully the 110 is enough for this plane. It should still be light wing loading. I still have a fair bit of tinkering to do with fuel tanks and canopy etc. I might get it done for the weekend but the weather is supposed to be lousy andyway. I still need to run the YS in a bit too. Here's the pictures.

STG

My Feedback: (26)

Looks nice.

If you are not at high elevation the 110 will pull it fine @ 9 pounds if running well on 30% -- you could save a 5oz RTF by going with a 13oz fuel tank. (and don't mind landing more often to refuel)

The only other power plants I would consider for this bird if looking for best possible performance would be the AX120 or the SA125 --That is if you can get the CG where you want it with these 25.5-27oz motors.

Basement Troll

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I had already decided to go to a bit smaller tank. I have a Hayes 16 oz tank that is 1.4 oz lighter empty. The tank that is supplied looks great but it's big. My metric conversion calculator says it's 18.5 oz of fuel. I fly my Harrier 3D with a 110 on a 16oz Hayes and I fly it for 12 mins. and still have a couple of oz left. I have a 14oz Dubro on my OMP Yak with a 110 and it is good for at least 12 mins. The Yak is so light I'm at low throttle settings all the time though. I can also see the fuel on the profile as well. Thanks for the tip though.
Don

Barry Cazier

My Feedback: (17)

Basement Troll...

Fine looking airplane. You've done a good job. 8lbs 14.4 ozs is a bit heavier than I thought it would be also. However, I'm at 4800' elevation and my Showtime weighs the same, 8lbs 14ozs. and it flys very nicely. I have a YS 110 in it and I use Cool Power 30%.

I would cut even more out of the bottom of the cowl. I believe in really opening up the air flow. I've had a couple of instances where the engine they heated up and loss power or became unreliable. Opening the cowl more really helps. Makes the performance way more stable.

The video of this plane on Maxair website shows it with the YS110 using 10% fuel. It flys very nice in the video.

My engine will save about 3 ozs, I won't be using wheel pants either, servos are probably about equal except I'm using a mini. Maybe I can say 4 ozs over you? I'm going with a 14-15oz fuel tank. I think I have one in the "room" somewhere. I have 6 airplanes with the YS110. I have 14-16oz tank on every one. I fly 13 minute flights and always have a few ozs of fuel left. I think I could easily go 15 minutes. I'm assuming the Saito will be about the same economy. Anyways, I'm hoping.

Can't wait for your flight report.

Thanks
Barry

Barry Cazier

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STG...

Do you know how to calculate the wing loading from my post #35? Also, what is your opinion on that wing loading?

Thanks
Barry

Basement Troll

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Barry I'm at about 600 ft asl. I know my Harrier has tons of power and it's only a bit lighter. I think I will take a bit more out of the cowl. Maybe I'll put the mini in for the throttle as well. I like th HS81's as they're fast as well. One concern I have is all the openings in the firewall. The engines seem to spray a bit of fuel around the inside of the cowl and I'm concerned the fuel will get back into the fuse. Do you think I should try to put some covering over the holes or will it be ok as it is? Most of the planes are sealed except for where the fuel lines come through. I also need my Performance Specialties muffler still. Are you going to mount you Saito sideways or inverted?
Don

Basement Troll

My Feedback: (3)

Barry the wingloading based on 8lbs 14.5oz is 21.27 oz/ft squared. 8lbs14.5oz = 142.5oz 965 sq. ins. = 6.7 sq.ft. (965/144, 144 being the number of inches per square ft.) If your plane ends up at 138oz (4.5 less than mine), it will be 138/6.7=20.6 oz/sqft. All this tech stuff is great but we've all seen the plane fly excellently with a 110 in the videos. Mind you Jason is in Moncton NB which is likely about 100' above sea level. I have a hard time believing it will be that much different. If you have the Yak, how does it fly at your altitude? Also how does it fly compared to the Harrier?
Don

aubej

My Feedback: (1)

Hi Don,

I didn't have any problems with fuel spatter, but I can't see putting some covering in there being a problem if you want to be on the safe side.

Barry, here is how to calculate the wing loading:

8lbs 14 oz = 142 oz
Wing area = 965 in. square = 6.7 ft. square

142 oz / 6.7 ft. square = 21.2 oz/ ft square

A little more than we projected, but still a very low wing loading.

I'm looking forward to hearing your flight reports guys.

Jason

Basement Troll

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Jason, I'm looking forward to making one!!
Don

STG

My Feedback: (26)

Wing loading will be good.[sm=thumbup.gif] About the same weight as the E.F. Yak and a bit more wing area-- What I would expect from a good newer IMAA legal scale plane with 68" wing span.

I can't imagine hearing anything but positive flight reports from this bird.