PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

Hello All,

I have been reading thru the posts and trying to figure out which system to get. Man is it confusing.

I have my ham license and would like to transmit the picture to a video monitor.

I would like to get the best quality picture from the lightest and smallest system. I can set up a pan and tilt with some old elevon mechanical mixers I have.

I see that there are different angle lenses on the cameras.

What do you recommend?

I don't want to spend a fortune but only want to make one purchase.

I really don't need audio.

Mr Boulevard-delete

http://www.blackwidowav.com is probably a good place to start. It's tiny Tx spider thingy is the smallest I have seen on the web. Here's the link.
http://www.blackwidowav.com/spidermite.html

Or you can get the complete system here
http://www.blackwidowav.com/bwav240200system.html

There camera runs on 5 volts like the above transmitter, so you will not have to worry about adding more batteries.

I believe anything over 330 lines would be perfect.
IMHO
Any thoughts anyone?
Mr B.

Mr Boulevard-delete

One more thing...

[quote480] lines is a LOT of resolution. By way of example, standard VHS tape is capable of recording around 250 lines of resolution. [/quote]
found at...
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_11...tm.htm#1240469

Enjoy

Fubar-One

My Feedback: (1)

Pretty much what Mr Boulevard said.
Good systems and I can vouch for the CX-161 camera as far as lightness and picture quality. You can also use different lenses for these cameras which are available at Supercircuits.com. I forget what they call em but you can find em by searching around on the site. I forget if these are called micro or PC cameras.

PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

The videos you guys have posted are great!

The CCD type look to have better picture quality than the CMOS cameras. I was hoping that the cheap ebay units would do the trick but it looks like they are not legal for use in the US.

The Panasonic cameras are being discontinued in 2004 so now seems to be the time to buy them.

Do you prefer the wider angle 115* lenses or a more 70* standard lens? If I buy the CX-161 I can get a different lens for it?

Fubar-One

My Feedback: (1)

I dont think I would use a 115 degree lens. There is already a bit of a "Fisheye" effect using the 70 degree lens. You can see this in some videos where the wing is in view. Definitely looking curved. I think a 115 would be good where you have the camera looking thru a peephole in a door or something where you need to see a big a field of view as possible but not so good for our purposes.
I could be wrong! Has anyone here used one?

yb2normal

I've used the 115 degree version of the CX161 (and KX121) and while it is a neat affect to try on occasion, I wouldn't make it my bread-n-butter lense.

You can see two videos shot from the CX161-115 here:
http://www.blackwidowav.com/KX121-115.html


The KX121-115 will give you the same affect.

For general video anything over 50 degrees and less than 90 degrees is pretty reasonable. 50 degrees let's you see more detail on the ground, while 90 degrees lets you see more of the ground! When I RPV, I use an 80 degree lense I got from www.rock2000.com which screws onto the CX161. The viewing angle is wide enough to give you a good situational awareness while in the air, but narrow enough that can still pilot the plane from the view. I've piloted the plane with the 53 degree lense, but I spent more time turning the plane to get my bearings. When I want good detailed shots of other planes and/or the ground, I'll fly with the 53 degree lense.

Bill

PINETAR

Awesome video on the Wingo... I have one of these as well... It looks like you have done some mod's to the trailing edge of the wing? Is this what allows you to roll or have you modified the plane in some other way?

Also in regard to the video quality. That was the best I've seen. Is this with the standard receiver and antenna or have you suped (sp?) this up?

Please advise

Thanks

PINETAR

Mr Boulevard-delete

And this is my obsesion (as Fuba-one would probably agree) with resolution. Is it right to think that a larger resolution camera could use wider angled lens but retain a similar quality of lower res. camera at a lower angled lens?

Just some passing thoughts.

yb2normal

Pinetar, the Wingo videos were from a stock 2.4ghz 100mw BWAV system which is out of production. The new BWAV200 system (2.4ghz 200mw) gives great results too, but in a slightly smaller package.

Mr Boulevard, I think it fair to say that a higher resolution camera would be able to pick out more of the detail available in a wide angle image, so your reasoning seems reasonable

Regards,
Bill

PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

Hi Bill,

I want to make video while flying formation and at some point get a heads up display to fly by line of sight and video at the same time. That would be a hoot!

I would need a good field of view to see the other plane and the ground, most of our flying is done within a 1000x1000x300' high box 40' off the ground. It sounds like the 70-90 range will fit the bill.

Panasonic makes a CX171 that is switchable from 12V to 5V but I have not found it for sale anywhere.

yb2normal

hey skypilot,

The cx171 is a great little camera, it is just a little bit bigger than the CX161 due to an attached heatsink, but the resolution rivals that of some camcorders!

If they still carry them you can call the guys at www.rock2000.com but be ready for some sticker shock, they are a bit expensive!

Regarding a good lense to use for both RPV and plane chasing, the 80 degree lense would be a good compromise I think. You'll need a good clear monitor on the ground that you can see well in order to pick another plane out of the sky. It is surprisingly hard getting another plane in the viewfinder, but once you do it makes it all worthwhile

PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

yb2normal,

Thank you for the link. Looks like I'll get my camera with a 2.9mm 69* angle lens from them.

Fuber-one,

What do you feel the ranges are of the systems you are using? Do you get any frequency drift on the less expensive systems? Would you recommend the 4 channel PPL systems more?

I know you have several and I'm still undecided as to which transmitter to get.

I will be flying no futher than 1500 feet away but will be doing aerobatics.

Thanks

Fubar-One

My Feedback: (1)

Hard to say what the ranges are for each system. They are all using simple whip antennas but would probably have longer range using either patch or yagi antennas. Havent really experimented with those as yet. Using the stock antenna, I have specked out my Super Scooter on the slope and still had a decent signal. The Supercircuits 900mhz system holds a good signal as far out as I have flown it but is very touchy about flying over the antenna. The 200mw cam/tx Spylinker cam hasnt been tested yet other than my dad trying his in the backyard. I havent noticed any frequency drift on the cheapo Spylinker system.
I think I would check with Bill (yb2normal) on the BlackwidowAV systems he sells on 2.4ghz.
I was recommending the Spylinker setups (very cheap and they do work well) before the 1.2ghz illegalities came to light as a cheap entry level system that actually works. Having used those and the 10X more costly Supercircuits system, I now have my eye on the 5v 2.4ghz systems that Bill is selling, the 600mw one in particular since I already have the Panasonic CX-161 camera.
Patch antennas for these systems are readily available also and pretty inexpensive along with yagi antennas.
Knowing what I know now, I wouldnt have purchased the Supercircuits system but would have purchased one of the Blackwidow systems instead. Or will in addition, probably. Havent given up in the 900mhz system but the signal reception is very disappointing.

Mr Boulevard-delete

I have heard about these patch antenna's and I just wondering if these transmit in only one direction or if they transmit in a 360 degree circle?
Aparently patch antenna's increase power output (or range). Might be worth the investment. Are there any negative side-effects with these antenna's?

Just curious.

crashone

My Feedback: (1)

Hi! Dan:
[Knowing what I know now, I wouldnt have purchased the Supercircuits system but would have purchased one of the Blackwidow systems instead. Or will in addition, probably. Havent given up in the 900mhz system but the signal reception is very disappointing][/quote]
Is it because of high cost of Supercircuits system or picture quality?

[The Supercircuits 900mhz system holds a good signal as far out as I have flown it but is very touchy about flying over the antenna.][/quote]
If the plane did not fly over the antenna what about the picture quality, better or same as Backwidow system?
Supercircuits system does have much bigger range than Blackwidow system, doesn't it?
Thanks.

PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

Fubar one/yb2normal,

What system would be recommended for a 1500 foot range with standard antenna's? I will be flying close in but not directly over myself, at least not on purpose. We have to stay 75" in front of ourselves at our field.

With the 5 volt cameras and receivers should I use a 4.8 volt pack or a 6 volt pack and a 5 volt regulator?

Fubar-One

My Feedback: (1)

They have a directional reception pattern something like 75 degrees horizontal and 65 degrees vertical or something like that. Putting it at the end of the field or on top of a helmet should insure a good signal at all times. Putting it at one end of the field wouldnt work for me because there is no way I am leaving any electronic equipment sitting farther away than I can leap in a hurry do to the less then honorable element that sometimes shows up at the field. There is usually some kind of riff raffing along and anything that aint nailed down is fair game. I actually had to race across the busy highway to retrieve my plane from some low lifes that were sprinting to their car with it. Litterally yanked my Uproar out of this expletive deleted's hands.
No way is my camcorder getting beyond arm's reach!

W4UAV

Dan, sounds like you guys need another field to go to!

Fubar-One

My Feedback: (1)

Well, the image quality is about the best I have seen in actuality with the Supercircuits system. It was pricey at $350 but not as bad as other systems I have seen. I guess what I am less than happy with is the reception I get with the system which is kinda cranky about where the plane is where the cheapo $25 system holds the signal better. This could be due to how I have the tx mounted in the plane which requires the antenna to be folded at a 90 degree angle (its hinged) and this is something I plan to check on.
I am also going to look into a patch antenna for this system and we do have a yagi antenna to try out but needs a second person to aim as its got a 6' boom length.
I just figured that for what the system costs there should be NO dropouts! As far as its range vs the BlackwidowAV range, that I cant tell you as I havent compared the two.
Once I get my vehicle situation straightened out and can concentrate on the video stuff properly, I should iron it all out and will definitely share the results here.
Is it because of high cost of Supercircuits system or picture quality?

[The Supercircuits 900mhz system holds a good signal as far out as I have flown it but is very touchy about flying over the antenna.][/quote]
If the plane did not fly over the antenna what about the picture quality, better or same as Backwidow system?
Supercircuits system does have much bigger range than Blackwidow system, doesn't it?
Thanks.
[/quote]

Fubar-One

My Feedback: (1)

Tell me about it!
This field is about a block from where they filmed the bar scene in Terminator II and where Rodney King got beat down. Not a good neighborhood.
Once I can get my dan to be able to land on an actual runway instead of an open field, we can fly at the club field but that runway is pretty much set up for carrier landings. We figure we are going to lose access to the dirt field soon anyway as they are planning on building a children's museum in that park and that is a prime location.
Oh, I forgot to mention that they close the parking lot there on Sundays due to the gangbanger shootings. Honestly. I guess the bangers dont shoot each other on Saturdays because its open then.
Have I ever mentioned that, when I retire, I am moving the hell outta this state?

yb2normal

Hi Skypilot,
If you go for the BWAV200 ready to fly system you can run the tx on anything from 5v to 10v since the vreg is built in. It comes with a small patch antenna that will give you about 1/4 mile range. If you are "rolling your own" using the 5v transmitters, then a 4.8v pack will work fine... the transmitters can handle the 5.x volts of a 4 cell pack hot off the charger. Splurge on the 8dbi circular polarized patch too, I had a client tell me he was seeing video (albiet scratchy) at 0.8 miles on the ground using my 200mw tx!

Bill

crashone

My Feedback: (1)

Dan :
Thank you for the information about Supercircuits system. The wider range is important for me, I may have no choice, but Supercircuits system. When you get further test information, I would like to read.

PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

I ordered a 171 camera with both 87* and 70* lenes from Rock2000 today to try out.

It looks like no matter what tx/rx combo you use it's the antennas that makes the biggest difference in reception quality.

I'll have to get together with a few hams and start building.