EASYTIGER

My Feedback: (119)

As far as VPs and office members spending our money on out of town trips, I don't know if that is so or not, but it is pure speculation, and I'm a little dissapointed in you for saying that.

I don't know how much money AMA will get from losing the free ride for CDs, and I don't know of any CDs who are just scamming us for a free ride. Could be, maybe not. Can we just stick to more grounded facts, and try to avoid speculation, for both sides?

fliers1

I have heard that VPs get a travel allowance but I don't think that any VPs will let us in on that. But I don't think that they should have to pay travel expenses out of their own pocket.

Well there are some 2600 AMA clubs. Now if there are at least one CD for every club, and there are more than likely more than one for each club, that would mean that AMA would save at least $75,400
annually by having CD's pay half of their membership dues.

Take care,
Clarence C. Ragland
http://www.kites.org/rc_instructors

Gordon Mc

My Feedback: (11)

Sorry Clarence, but I disagree. Your calculations assume that all CD's apply for their freebies/reductions, which is definitely not the case.

Gordon

John B

My Feedback: (1)

I dunno,
I am not against the AMA, but, I feel the modlers are getting lost for the buisness. Just my opinion, fancy base of operations and all the other things the they deem nessacary is not. A flyer a couple times a year and the ins is all that is really needed. the rest is unessacary fluff. I do believe the ama is loosing sight of the origional idea in order to make a buck.
John

fliers1

EasyTiger posted in part:

>

Yes, I did calculate how much AMA would get from losing half the free ride for CDs, if all CD's did apply. Then again, how many CD's are in each club and how many apply? Who knows?

Take care,
CCR
http://www.kites.org/rc_instructors

JohnW

My Feedback: (6)

To Bob1931

I can tell fevers are running warm over this, come on guys, it's just $29. I spend more than that filling my car up with gas.

As for how I think, if you read my post closely, I clearly stated that anyone who pulls off a major event deserves some form of compensation, I only mentioned money (such as free membership) but I'd personally be happy with a pat on the back knowing I helped fellow modelers enjoy their hobby.

My point about event size/scope versus payment is that there is no check/balances on the event. After your first two events, all you need is to CD one event a year to get free AMA... the event size/scope really dosen't matter... 5 pilots or 500 pilots. The way "I think" is that it is not worth $58 to the AMA for a CD host a small contest. My point about "The contest/event will go on" is that there will be little significant impact by not paying CDs.

The idea that workers MUST be compensated for offering time and services can come back and bite you when we are talking about donated time to a hobby. How about the people that attend the events/contests... If you extrapolate that thinking maybe they should be compensated too. I put on a show at a major fly in recently and I was interviewed by the press/media afterwords, so I did something that helped the hobby, gained public awareness, probably some kid right now pestering his parents to buy him a plane becase he saw me fly, etc. My costs are much higher than the CD's, $6000 plane, motel room, travel expenses, not to mention hundreds of hours of practice, fuel costs, etc. Shouldn't I get free AMA for all the work and money I had to invest to put on a show at the Fly-in? No? Slap in the face? Abuse? Come on. (I'm not serious here as I do NOT desire or expect payment of any kind, I fly for fun, just making a point.)

RCPilot100

My Feedback: (4)

To clear up some misinformation here, a CD only gets their membership freebie if they sanction and run at least one event per year - and submit the paperwork on time. Just because someone has a CD rating does not mean that they automatically get a free renewal.

Just to clear up my situation, I have been a club officer and CD for many years. I am done - burned out. I didn't realize it until this issue came up and it is just sort of the last straw. I want to enjoy my hobby - building and flying - not being a club officer or CD anymore. I have given and given without regard to personal paybacks in the form of freebies or thank yous - it is just that now that I stop and think about it, I need to change what I have been doing so I don't come to hate what I really enjoy doing - building and flying.

Dan

JohnW

My Feedback: (6)

RCPilot... I think you are on the right track. I too am close to burnout... club officer, newsletter editor, club webmaster, etc. If being a CD causes you to resent what you love, you need to drop the CD business so you can enjoy your hobby.

Dave Bowles

My Feedback: (7)

Fact - VPs do get reimbursment for travel when spreading the good word from AMA and making the rounds in thier district.

I know of at least one person that conviniently makes these rounds when he has Other buisness in that area.

I guess the word abuse could be a matter of opinion.

Hossfly

Not to argue the CD thing anymore, however I received my renewal with a 50% credit for my 2 events so far and 1 more yet to go this year. I got $5 off for being OLD and I mailed my $174 back to AMA. 58/2 = 29. 29-5=24. Add 24 to $50 for site maintenance plus a *hunnerd* for the museum and my dues are now paid. So be it.

Now, MB, you say you are nearing burnout due to all the club work you do, so let me run this by you. It would place money in your jeans to repay a small amount of your out-of-pocket expenses for the Club, cost AMA nothing other than a mailing to several thousand Leader Members for it does require a change to AMA Bylaws.
The "Charter" Club would be changed to a CHAPTER, thus becoming a sub-unit of the mother organization. All the Club Officers would be accomplishing work for the mother 501 (c) 3 organization and therefore their expenses become charitable deductions at Volunteer rates, for Federal income tax.
For example as a Club President, let's say you drive to the field 2 times weekly, RT distance 40 miles and for say 40 weeks per year.
That is 80 miles per week X 40 = 3200 miles and X .14 per mile equals a $448 additional deduction, which if in the 31% excess bracket brings you back $138.48 to buy some gas with.
Just think of all the other items that could be eased into this "Volunteer" status.
VPs as directors can use business rates, plus expense a substantial amount of their model costs as they have to *keep up* with the trends.

Any ideas about all this?
While the incumbent Ex VP wants to set up corporations to hide capital, I am much more interested in bringing good things back to modelers and clubs.

Think about it.

Horrace

Groundforce-RCU

My Feedback: (20)

I think there are many of us out there who are disabled. What I think the AMA should do is give us a cut rate as they do the people 65 and over.......and on Social Security

$ircra$halot

Not really but I do see very good points to both sides of this. I too am partialy disabled, and through layoffs have found myself in what I hope to be, a short financialy challenged role. I fear there are many more that avoid the hobby because of the cost incurred in the price of just getting a plane in the air, or car ext. Let alone AMA dues, club dues, club initiation fees, I can go on and on, it can be overwhelming. Now I am the first to admit I am no finance wizard but I'm thinking, if we can bring cost down here and there it would draw more people into the hobby, therefore allowing the AMA and some of the other cost to be recovered through volume. I do understand there are problems incurred with this stratadgy that may defeat the purpose. Anyhow I realize I have strayed off subject here and will wrap up by saying. I plan to help out with our events as soon as I can free up some time, and do not expect to be payed in any way shape or form. But hey if someone insist!

fliers1

I've been in the hobby for over 30 years and in that time I have seen literally hundreds of people drop out of the hobby. Not because it was too expensive, as many of those who dropped out were quite financially well healed. They dropped out because they were initially told that there would always be someone to teach them. Keep in mind, most of these people were from many different clubs and many different states.

They were not told that instruction was only held once or twice a week. They were not told that they may have to wait several hours for one 15 minute lesson, if they were lucky, also they were not told that they would most certainly crash in the learning process before they made their purchase. It's hard to believe that solo RC fliers, with an investment of hundreds, if not thousands of dollars in their equipment would not rejoin because of an annual rate dues of $58.

Take care,
CCR
http://www.kites.org/rc_instructors

vegas mossie

As a new member, (I just got my first renewal) I carry the AMA insurance because it is required at two of the three fields that I fly at. These are public fields owned by the city. As for a club, we just have a bunch of guys that like to fly, no organization. I would like to carry the insurance just for my own personal piece of mind. I would however like a choice of whether or not I want the magazine. (I don't) That part of my dues could be better spent on something else.

Question: What do you figure the cost of AMA without the subscription would be?

The AMA needs to realize, that they exist to help and protect US,
We do not exist to support the corporation. Just my .02 Loren

EASYTIGER

My Feedback: (119)

About $10 less. I asked them a few weeks back.
Vegas, I say this in a kind way, not as a criticism, and I know some of the anti-ama crew out there will respond loudly and violently...
AMA is much more than the insurance. They have done a lot for us, and continue to do a lot. We would not have model aviaton as it is today without them.
And...don't beleive that a majority of AMA members have big grudges against AMA. It's really just a few loud ones here on the internet, and the vast Silent Majority just roll their eyes at this stuff, pay their measly $58 a year, and count their blessings that they have AMA.

Greyhawk

Works for me. Has anyone priced out golf lately?

dennis1943

My Feedback: (12)

Gentleman,
please dont forget why this forum was started all i wanted to do was let the AMA know how a group of us CD's felt about all these changes that were made, i did not know about any of these untill i read about it in the magazine, i am really dissapointed that my on v-president did not advise us that this was coming, it seems to me that something of this importance we should have been told about what was coming.

I sent out numerous emails to all the higher up's in the AMA and to this date no one has had even the courtesy to respond, this is one of the reasons that i am looking at my voting preferences this time, also Mr. Russ Miller this post was for you.

Dennis W. Martin Sr.
AMA 7030 CD

Greyhawk

Dennis,

Point well taken.

What is often lacking, and goes beyond the monetary policies in many Organizations is a basic lack of leadership.

Either a conscious desire NOT to inform and respond to individual concerns among people (such as yourself) who do the bulk of the field work, or a leadership structure that simply overlooks the issues that matter most.

AMA needs leaders who are willing to make the tough decisions, but are also willing to track and take responsibility fro the effects of same.

Regards,

John

dennis1943

My Feedback: (12)

dont send your dues in yet something is in the wind watch AMA web site after sat. for anouncement to be forth coming, heard this today from ama,

dennis1943

Flyer DC-3

I for one am a new CD. I am not overly concerned about the 50% dues deal. However I would have appreciated an email, phone call or letter from AMA in reference to this rather than EC dictatorship. I do think that that this should have been brought to the entire membership of AMA for a vote.

I did not become a CD for a free ride on my membership, I am also a Club President and have served in all club officer positions over the years of being involved in this hobby/sport.

I had to pay AMA $20.00 for the privilage of becoming a CD, take a written examination and be subject to all the problems that take place at sanctioned events, not to mention the possible consequences of sanction by a district VP if he so desires or the EC, or become party to a law suite if someone so desires.

I for one like Mr. Horace Cain, his ideas are fresh and just may be effective in making some needed changes at the top.

Use your vote to make changes in the EC and VP, give the AMA back to the membership.

Since our club secretary treasurer does most of the leg work, paperwork, our club membership voted to give him/her free membership for work performed.

We still do not have anyone stepping up to the plate to take this position from our current secretary/treasurer just to get free membership in the club.

I spoke with Dennis1943 at some length today about the free CD deal and what is now law it seems at a flyin he attended and I was CD. I feel he is justified in his intent to return to the CD being given free membership. It may require that a certain number of events be held etc to make it more fair. Example would be no charge by AMA to become a CD for one.

B. Brammer

My personal feelings are If the AMA truely gave a hoot about the important task that the CD provides they would provide recignition to those who year after year, for what ever reason get the job done.
This doesn't need to be monetary,most of us would be happy with a personal pat on the back and a thank you for a job well done .