Glacier Girl

My Feedback: (4)

50%
Ditto, it seems the tide is going to the no to all.
I like the idea of a 1yr trial, with standard bennies. 3 mo is not enough, you loose out on the ones who get first birds at Christmas and such, for the most part they won't fly till spring, and by that time they will forget about the 3 mo offer. If you think about it why would you sign up for 3 mo during non flying time? Ok granted some of us nuts fly all year long, but most newbies aren't really thinking of flying when it's in the 20's, snow is waist deep and the winds howling.
And the seperate E mag is just more of an expense. Is it not a multi type aircraft mag now?
All coming out with a E only mag is going to do is get the others crying for their own seperate mag, causing even more costs to the AMA.

TerryE

My Feedback: (12)

GG;

By jove, I think you've got it !

That is what I proposed a while ago, and still think is the best answer. If a newbie is still flying after a year (and has club welcome and help) he is addicted like the rest of us, and will pony up the $$ just to stay with his "buddies" at the club.

If he gets shumnned by the club, the no discount in the world is gonna get him back.

TE

Lee MRC

Well I sent in my reply and received an answer in return. I advocated for two seperate "groupes and/or mag's" because I an tierd of having all of the mounthly space occupied by "the motor guys" instead of those that keep the institution aloft. I may be in the minority but so what "I can handel it".

I sure hope they get back to the bussiness Of flying model planes instead of "send me money and I'll pray for you".

Lee K5MRC

Loubud

GG,
I've seen a few Lotus' around here as there is/was a dealer a few cities away. And I know well Lucas parts. Just like the looks of them.

Glacier Girl

My Feedback: (4)

Lou,
It's out in your neck of the woods, I sold it to some fool out there. It's a red 78 Esprit S2.

Loubud

Glacier, Then I should see it on the side of the road one day.

nyflyer56

GG and Lou,
LMAO about the Lotus. I have always had a hankering for a "7" which really is a freakin' go cart.
but >>YEEE HAAAA they scoot! Also familiar w/ 'the Prince of Darkness" aka Lucas, as I have 2 Brit Bikes,
a 1967 BSA 441 Shooting Star, and a 71 Triumph Bonneville Chopper.


To get back on topic, I am going to push my AVP in the direction of the full boat 1 yr, at a discount. makes the most sense and is a K.I.S.S. kind of thing.
Phil

Loubud

Out here we consider Ferrari's and the like as weekend cars. Pick up the car on Friday, drive it a few hours on the weekend and tow it back to the shop on Monday. Repeat.
Good luck finding Triumph metric bolts. I suspect you've done a bit of die tapping.

nyflyer56

Lou,
The Triumph was bought in it's current form. I intend to convert it back to stock. The bolts are not metric, but witworth, which is not metric or SAE. Found this out first time I went to work on the Beezer and none of my wrenches worked! I now have a set of Witworth wrenches and a few sockets. The BSA is apart. When I rebuild it I may retap/thread some stuff for convenience sake. Or I'll have to bug Ray to find me some!
Phil

Stickbuilder

Triumphs don't use metrics. They use a thread pitch called B.S.F. (they say British Standard Fine) (We say British Strip Fully) The bolt size is based on the spanner (wrench) size. So do B.S.A.'s, Vincents, AJS, Nortons, Matchless, Ariels, Brough, and others. [8D]

Stickbuilder

The wrench sizes are Whitworth

the-plumber

You've gone off the edge far enough to acquire Whitworth spanners and such, but have you learned the meaning of the acronym "BSA" ?

nyflyer56

of course British Small Arms. Is that why it always felt like kickstarting a grenade? Never could get the hang of that Compression release...

Stickbuilder

Yep. It stands for Birmingham Small Arms. At least it did way back when I bought my Gold Star.

Bill, AMA 4720

Stickbuilder

Fred,

I didn't know that they even built Motorsickles in Alabama.

the-plumber

They didn't, but to Alabama's credit, the toothbrush was invented there.

At least, it must have been invented there.

Otherwise the device would be called a teethbrush.

the-plumber

I always thought "British Small Arms" and "Birmingham Small Arms" are marketing ploys to hide the truth, which is that the acronym really stands for "Ba$tard Stopped Again".

Stickbuilder

True. We are all painfully aware the Joseph Lucas was the Prince of Darkness.

archerry

My Feedback: (6)

I think (and have always thought) that tiered memberships to AMA is a good thing, however, segregation (even historically) is not.

What I'm trying to say is that with increased risk, pilots should pay more (all insurance policies are that way) but we should not deny them access to AMA sanction events or charter fields.

I look as this situation has grown into a cross between an oxymoron and a conundrum... Damned if you do...... Damned if you don't...
Most would say well then... to hell with that........., I know I would!!!

If this does not pass, look at what AMA stands to lose... an increase in revenue from membership and an increase from club charters. What did we in the current modeling communities loose.... NUMBERS. Numbers would make all of us stronger and increase our club revenues.

Here's a question... I have full AMA..... Am I limited to Nitro and only allowed to fly at a nitro chartered club field only, or, will I be able to fly my foamies at a new parkflyer field as well with the same AMA card/membership?

Isn't it funny..... The membership in general, on previous forums, did not want tiered memberships and now they do....... go figure!!

jonkoppisch

My Feedback: (162)

I haven't seen that. There's been a couple mention it but that's it.... I'd like to see a new poll on that one

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

Here is why the AMA pitched the e-ticket and I talked with Joyce about it and she confirmed.

Read more about the EAA's/FAA's Sport ticket here: http://www.sportpilot.org/

EAA knew that the first step in aviation, the private pilot license, was the most difficult step. With drop out rates exceeding 50%, we knew that aviation needed a different approach to becoming a pilot. While the number of active private pilots has declined by almost 30% since 1984 and active student pilots had declined by 42%, EAA recognized that other recreational activities, like motorcycling, have exploded over the same time period. How can this be when learning to fly and being a pilot is such an exhilarating, life changing activity? We determined the root causes were time and money and set about doing something about both.

EAA worked with FAA and industry for over 10 years to create the Sport Pilot/Light Sport Aircraft rule. Flight training was simply too time consuming and too expensive. Sport pilot solves the time/money issue by creating a basic, entry level pilot certificate that is not bogged down with training people for things they may never use while not jeopardizing safety. The result is a pilot certificate that is half the time commitment and half the cost of a private pilot certificate. Based on the initial response to Sport Pilot, we are convinced that aviation now has the opportunity to grow and be competitive with other recreational actives.

Does any of this sound familiar with our own AMA? Here's a great idea that's much like what the EAA did, the e-ticket!! What a wonderful idea which has already been successfully proven with the "other" kind of flying. And before you say that it's apples to oranges you might want to know what the Sport ticket really is.

The new Sport ticket is designed so that people that want to enter full scale flying cheap or health restricted still have a way to get in the air. You don't need a physical, just a drivers license, which get thousands of health restricted pilots up there. You can only fly smaller, lighter aircraft only and you can only fly in restricted air space. You can only fly from dusk till dawn which is perfect for parks! You can get the ticket for about half the price of a Private ticket. Boy oh boy does this sound familiar too, doesn't it ... or is it just me?

There's an old saying ... if it's broke then fix it.

50%plane

My Feedback: (5)

STL, the sport ticket is a great idea and I have thought about doing it myself, but the AMA plan isn't inline with the EAA program. For one thing, the AMA is an insurance provider and doesn't grant the model pilots license. However, there are different levels of pilots licenses for different types of aircraft. The AMA only has one policy. Maybe the AMA needs to completely rework the system so that if you don't fly helis, you only have to pay for the insurance. If you only want to fly electric PF, then you only have to pay for that.Here's a rough draft that I just came up with and I'm sure it needs work, so don't flame me for it based on anything other than the general idea.

Lets say that the plan starts out at $10/year w/o benefits.(such as the full blown MA)
If you want to add MA, then that would be, say $7.50.
If you want to fly parkflyers, then lets add $3 to the total.
If you want to fly 30% and above, then add $6 to the total.
Under 30%, then add $5.
Helis-add $4
etc.
Also, I think that the AMA should send out specific versions of MA. (like a 5 page think on PF if that's all you are signed for. 5 pages on Jets if that's what you want.[10 pages if you signed for both] Maybe make it an Email thing so that includes all the district stuff.)
This would not create the awful tiers as it would just give you the coverage that you need. That way, if a PFer wants to move to 40%'s he will be able to up his plan. and not change much.

The current idea, as I understand it, for seperate fields for the AMA members and the proposed PFers is over descrimination. I think it should be up to the club to determine what is flown there and if there's a need for an electric field, I think that the AMA should step in to help by petition from people in that area.

Anyways, what do ya'll think?
50%

jonkoppisch

My Feedback: (162)

I say let the ama go for it. I believe several things will happen.

A larger membership in the ama but only slightly larger membership in clubs as park fliers don't think it's affordable to join a club, and/or still feel the clubs are unfriendly

More E only clubs are formed (which puts us back to the origonal proposal which would probably have worked, $29/year and have E only clubs to fly at chartered by the ama)

A large prejudice is developed between club members and Park Fliers as Park Fliers are given special rates and privaleges (money is always the #1 debate in anything)

Ama gets lots of negative emails concerning clubs being asked to regulate insurance cards, model sizes, policing everything..

More new regulations instilled about club layouts for fliers and how to manage the additonal ins cards

Some clubs go park flier exempt as this puts the club in danger of loosing the lease due to insurance reasons (some clubs already do this be it for helis, turbines or large gas engine aircraft)

New tiers and insurance $'s are enacted. Glow fliers say since the PF's have special rates then they should have special rates as well, vs helis, giant scale warbirds, aerobats and jets

New waivers are put in place to qualify for the different tiers, glow, heli, giant scale and jets

Ama starts to act even more like an insurance agency.. ie, your rates of insurance are based on plane size, # of accidents and AGE!! If you are over 50 you're bumped into a higher insurance bracket.... If you need glasses, handicaped etc....

jonkoppisch

My Feedback: (162)

Isn't that exactly what a tiered system is?

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

50% I'm trying to show you the CONCEPT! The concept is in fact nearly identical. I know one works one way and one works the other way but the CONCEPT is the exact same. The end result is also the same, increased membership and a better AMA. Tiered memberships WORK and they work well with just about every organization known to man.

The problem is that the AMA members are afraid for change. Typical, but this is the year 2006, not 1906 things change and they change fast.

VISION! The AMA's VISION was that of the same of the EAA and it worked perfect for them.

All the little details like the insurance benefits, rules and such can all be fixed as we go as needed, rather adjusted along the way. But what they proposed is in fact good enough to get things moving RIGHT NOW. We live in a very fast paced world 50%, cars move fast, email moves fast, planes move fast. But adjustment always takes place along the way.