Observation From One Member
04-12-2007 | 03:02 PM
#27
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From: Warner Robins,
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RE: Observation From One Member
Hoss,
There are sometimes when I agree with you wholeheartedly...like using PR to advance the AMA.
There are other times...when I....well quite frankly..wonder what you're smoking.
But the reason I would not vote for you is because I dont think you can set aside your differences with portions of the AMA community and represent us all with unbiased decisions. Your views regarding the electric crowd disappoint me.
The AMA goal is to promote model aviation....not just the ones we perticularly like or dislike.
I ask you the following questions.
Could you honestly put aside your preference of nitro/gas planes over electrics and allow yourself to promote the electric crowd as equally as the nitro/gas crowd?
Would your quest for PR promotion be solely based on providing information of AMA activities to the public, or do you envision a more commercial PR type campaign?
Just curious.
There are sometimes when I agree with you wholeheartedly...like using PR to advance the AMA.
There are other times...when I....well quite frankly..wonder what you're smoking.
But the reason I would not vote for you is because I dont think you can set aside your differences with portions of the AMA community and represent us all with unbiased decisions. Your views regarding the electric crowd disappoint me.
The AMA goal is to promote model aviation....not just the ones we perticularly like or dislike.
I ask you the following questions.
Could you honestly put aside your preference of nitro/gas planes over electrics and allow yourself to promote the electric crowd as equally as the nitro/gas crowd?
Would your quest for PR promotion be solely based on providing information of AMA activities to the public, or do you envision a more commercial PR type campaign?
Just curious.
04-12-2007 | 03:21 PM
#28
RE: Observation From One Member
ORIGINAL: Hossfly
Carwood, I'm betting you are not in a timewarp, and like the vast majority of RCers, you never know when you receive an election ballot from AMA, and if you did, you would not do anything with it other than the nearest trash can. Those CL and FF modelers, being in a time-warp, if there was some way to observe such, I would bet that 85-90% of them not only know when the ballot arrives, but they know how to mark said ballot, plus where to send said ballot to keep the people that keep that magazine publishing articles for CLers and FFers and keep that magazine being mostly paid for by RCers. 
Some years ago it was audited that nearly 90% of the non-RC fliers voted in AMA elections. Less than 10% of RCers voted in AMA elections. If we were to meet at some big RC event, I would bet you a case of MY favorite drinking whiskey (Gentleman-Jack or Maker's Mark) that we could go forth and ask any number of RC fliers three questions: 1. Are you an AMA member? Most would know the correct answer to that one. Then #2 What is your AMA Number? and #3 Who is your resident AMA District Vice President? If more than 5 out of any 100 members, asked questions # 2 and 3, could correctly answer both questions, I would buy you a case of YOUR favorite DW.
So my point is that the CL/FF community knows what is happening. Those that make things happen take care of those that take care of them. RCers are of the newer generation and expect things to be provided for them. Hey, I raised 3 kids now approaching their fifties, with teen/grown kids of their own. None have ever wanted. I had to make my own way since age 14. Mine and theirs always have had the milk in the refrig. Unfortunately far too many expect others to pave the way and make things right all the time. If you want changes get involved.
If you want things changed, it's time you make some changes and become interested in the operation. OTOH, if AMA doesn't give the CL/FF some attention, just who will? Both of the disciplines are wonderful works of the true arists and craftsmen. Comparing the skill required to wallow a foamie around the sky as compared to the CL stunt pattern is like comparing a walk along the sidewalk to a runner jumping hurdles. The FF doesn't have to fill these forums with, "Where's my CG?" and "What size prop.?" He finds it out or just knows.
AMA stands for Academy of MODEL AERONAUTICS, not just RC. We're all here together.
ORIGINAL: carwood444
//snip//
Just to let you know I am not dogging you for your opinion. But the total split of R/C as one group and CL+FF as another group, can not be 50/50. It is probably more like 90% R/C and 10% CL+FF. My point to this is as I stated earlier, when was the last time you opened up any other Flying Type magazine and saw this much coverage of these two area's of flying on a continual basis. I don't want to demean the people that fly CL or FF, I think it is great they enjoy this part of the hobby.
My point to all this is not running down MA or the AMA. My point is that the AMA is stuck in some kind of time warp. They are living in the past and in order for the AMA to survive the AMA needs to change with the times. I was hoping that someone might pick up on the point I was trying to get across. The way these people that publish the AMA magazine proves the point. I don't care about how many advertisements are in the magazine, count the numbers of ad's for CL and FF and then count the number of ads for R/C.
//snip//
//snip//
Just to let you know I am not dogging you for your opinion. But the total split of R/C as one group and CL+FF as another group, can not be 50/50. It is probably more like 90% R/C and 10% CL+FF. My point to this is as I stated earlier, when was the last time you opened up any other Flying Type magazine and saw this much coverage of these two area's of flying on a continual basis. I don't want to demean the people that fly CL or FF, I think it is great they enjoy this part of the hobby.
My point to all this is not running down MA or the AMA. My point is that the AMA is stuck in some kind of time warp. They are living in the past and in order for the AMA to survive the AMA needs to change with the times. I was hoping that someone might pick up on the point I was trying to get across. The way these people that publish the AMA magazine proves the point. I don't care about how many advertisements are in the magazine, count the numbers of ad's for CL and FF and then count the number of ads for R/C.
//snip//
Some years ago it was audited that nearly 90% of the non-RC fliers voted in AMA elections. Less than 10% of RCers voted in AMA elections. If we were to meet at some big RC event, I would bet you a case of MY favorite drinking whiskey (Gentleman-Jack or Maker's Mark) that we could go forth and ask any number of RC fliers three questions: 1. Are you an AMA member? Most would know the correct answer to that one. Then #2 What is your AMA Number? and #3 Who is your resident AMA District Vice President? If more than 5 out of any 100 members, asked questions # 2 and 3, could correctly answer both questions, I would buy you a case of YOUR favorite DW.
So my point is that the CL/FF community knows what is happening. Those that make things happen take care of those that take care of them. RCers are of the newer generation and expect things to be provided for them. Hey, I raised 3 kids now approaching their fifties, with teen/grown kids of their own. None have ever wanted. I had to make my own way since age 14. Mine and theirs always have had the milk in the refrig. Unfortunately far too many expect others to pave the way and make things right all the time. If you want changes get involved.
If you want things changed, it's time you make some changes and become interested in the operation. OTOH, if AMA doesn't give the CL/FF some attention, just who will? Both of the disciplines are wonderful works of the true arists and craftsmen. Comparing the skill required to wallow a foamie around the sky as compared to the CL stunt pattern is like comparing a walk along the sidewalk to a runner jumping hurdles. The FF doesn't have to fill these forums with, "Where's my CG?" and "What size prop.?" He finds it out or just knows.
AMA stands for Academy of MODEL AERONAUTICS, not just RC. We're all here together.
Actually if you were to ask R/C people at an actual competition such as an IMAC , pattern, or pylon event I think they would answer all questions correctly. Not only that they would vote about the same percentage as the C/L and Free fright people. But if you were to go to an actual chartered AMA field where contests are never held, you would find that all would say they belonged to the AMA, but about 10% would be lying. You would find that about 80% may not know their number, another 10% know it and have it printed on their airplanes that they use in competition, and the rest would probably know part of it. About 15% would know who their Distric VP is and 10% of those compete in regular competitions. Just my observation that almost all C/L and free flight people compete, only a small number or R/C people do. I think its the competition that keep the non R/C people so intrested in their hobby.
04-12-2007 | 03:31 PM
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From: Newberry, FL
RE: Observation From One Member
ORIGINAL: SSRCCPREZ
If Imus was in R/C would he refer to FF and C/L as Q-tip headed geriatrics?
If Imus was in R/C would he refer to FF and C/L as Q-tip headed geriatrics?
04-12-2007 | 04:08 PM
#30
RE: Observation From One Member
I didn't know that the hair related n word was a bad word till the Don Imus thing. My brother had an Afro in the 70's. That word was sometimes use to refer to that hairstyle.
04-12-2007 | 07:11 PM
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From: MAnsfield,
MA
RE: Observation From One Member
O.k.,Red, please tellme you saw the humor in my post......
I was kidding[X(]
Also, I am pretty sure that when Al Sharpton calls for Imus to be ousted he ought to first listen to his own show. He used the term "jew'em down" three weeks ago on his show.Hmmmm.....
nonetheless I am no fan of Imus or Sharpton, just am tired of all the PC crap. Change the station. Don't want to change the direction of the thread by accident, just want to make sure you understand I was KIDDING.
I was kidding[X(]
Also, I am pretty sure that when Al Sharpton calls for Imus to be ousted he ought to first listen to his own show. He used the term "jew'em down" three weeks ago on his show.Hmmmm.....
nonetheless I am no fan of Imus or Sharpton, just am tired of all the PC crap. Change the station. Don't want to change the direction of the thread by accident, just want to make sure you understand I was KIDDING.
04-13-2007 | 08:19 AM
#36
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RE: Observation From One Member
You guys need to observe some other sanctioning bodies to see how well that you have it. As an IMPBA (International Model Power Boat Assn.) member you pay $50.00 a year for lousy insurance (it only covers you at an IMPBA sanctioned event) and our magazine, the Roostertail used ot be delivered to my door quarterly. Now, the only way that you can get it is if you own a computer and have to download it. Those that don't hasve one are outta luck. We have no HQ in Muncie, no Hall of Fame except on paper, no museum, just a couple of people working out of their homes.
You don't know how well that you have it until you look around at the other R/C sanctioning bodies.
You don't know how well that you have it until you look around at the other R/C sanctioning bodies.
04-13-2007 | 10:06 AM
#37
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RE: Observation From One Member
I have cleaned up this thread a bit. it was getting off topic and inappropriate. I didn't notify everyone individually but instead am posting here to notify those who see any of their posts missing that they were part of the cleanup to remove the off topic tangent this was headed in
Please keep it on topic, clean, friendly and inside the rules. thanks all for your enthusiastic cooperation in advance
Please keep it on topic, clean, friendly and inside the rules. thanks all for your enthusiastic cooperation in advance
04-13-2007 | 11:22 AM
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From: Sandy,
UT
RE: Observation From One Member
I think Ron brings up a great point.
There are folks that seem to sit around and try to think of things to complain about.
I like seeing all of the things that the other sigs are doing. This hobby is cool from end to end, plus looking at how stuff is done by the other modelers brings new ideas to the front.
There are folks that seem to sit around and try to think of things to complain about.
I like seeing all of the things that the other sigs are doing. This hobby is cool from end to end, plus looking at how stuff is done by the other modelers brings new ideas to the front.
04-13-2007 | 12:03 PM
#39
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From: MAnsfield,
MA
RE: Observation From One Member
I'll agree to my post needing to be deleted for being off topic, but dirty? I do not think there was any post that was dirty or vile???? Off topic O.k., but dirty?
C'mon.....
Nonetheless, I appreciate your hard and thankless work monitoring this forum. You guys really do a good job and I am sure it is not an easy one at that.
C'mon.....
Nonetheless, I appreciate your hard and thankless work monitoring this forum. You guys really do a good job and I am sure it is not an easy one at that.
04-13-2007 | 01:21 PM
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From: Miami, FL
RE: Observation From One Member
If you ask me. We should have an option to get AMA or not. I think we should have some organization at the local field level to control the hobby. All the the ama card says is that I have $58 bucks to waist on a card. it doesn't say nothing else. The park where I fly is requiring for you to go to the main office and show your valid AMA to fly. I think this is the type of control that we should have and do it with a valid drivers license so you have an actual record of who is who in the field.
04-13-2007 | 01:57 PM
#41
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From: New London,
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RE: Observation From One Member
If your club requires you to be a member, then it is the club's requirement and not the AMA.
04-14-2007 | 11:09 AM
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From: Park Rapids, MN
RE: Observation From One Member
ORIGINAL: mscic-RCU
This is incorrect. If your club is chartered with the AMA, all flyers, members and guests, are required by the club charter with the AMA to be members of the AMA. In the event that something would happen, the club's insurance is invalid if the incident involves a non-AMA member. If the AMA is not a monopoly, why did it go to such extremes to put the old Sport Flyers association out of business a few years ago? As I have said many times before, most clubs can not afford to purchase liability insurance on their own for their flying sites, therefore they charter with the AMA. The AMA had a captive audience until park flyers came along. Maybe now we don't need them as much!
If your club requires you to be a member, then it is the club's requirement and not the AMA.
Your telling us the original statement (above) is incorrect! Then you go on to state that the club charter requires you to be a member of the AMA. The club therefore chooses affiliation with the AMA, and to do so, must enforce membership in the AMA for flyers using it's field. The AMA's cadre doesn't enforce this rule at the membership level, the individual clubs do. I have never felt I am forced to be a member of the AMA, I choose to be a member. I chose to be a member of the AMA and not a member of the Sport Flyers Asso.
So, who requires you to be a member of the AMA?
Also, define what a monopoly is.
04-14-2007 | 09:59 PM
#44
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From: Sandy,
UT
RE: Observation From One Member
Mode One,
You are just trying to be argumentative.
If the club requires it then the club requires it. In most cases private individuals that own the land, townships, counties, states all require some type of insurance and the easiest thing to do is fall back on the place that does it all in one shot...the AMA. Most clubs require as you pointed out that one must be a member of the AMA to fly at their locations. If all you fly is electirc park flyer stuff then you can get away with flying pretty much wherever you feel like with no major hassles. However if you require a runway then you are probably stuck joining if you want to fly.
You say you have never felt "forced" to join the AMA.
I would imagine though that there are a number of folks that feel "forced" every year.
It probably occurs more in a location that is more densly populated but I am sure it happens all the same.
You are just trying to be argumentative.
If the club requires it then the club requires it. In most cases private individuals that own the land, townships, counties, states all require some type of insurance and the easiest thing to do is fall back on the place that does it all in one shot...the AMA. Most clubs require as you pointed out that one must be a member of the AMA to fly at their locations. If all you fly is electirc park flyer stuff then you can get away with flying pretty much wherever you feel like with no major hassles. However if you require a runway then you are probably stuck joining if you want to fly.
You say you have never felt "forced" to join the AMA.
I would imagine though that there are a number of folks that feel "forced" every year.
It probably occurs more in a location that is more densly populated but I am sure it happens all the same.
04-15-2007 | 06:52 AM
#45
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From: Park Rapids, MN
RE: Observation From One Member
I am not being argumentitive, I am defending my position. The quoted statement is mine: "If your club requires you to be a member, then it is the club's requirement and not the AMA". Although I think this statement was removed with whatever else was removed by RCAdmin. Mscsc-RCU then stated: "This is incorrect."
I understand that some people don't want to "think" they are forced to be a member of the AMA so they can fly model airplanes. Since I don't feel "forced" into joining and being a member of the AMA and other people do and certainly have a right to feel this way, it's apparent to me nothing can be said here to change their minds.
Happy landings Liberator!
I understand that some people don't want to "think" they are forced to be a member of the AMA so they can fly model airplanes. Since I don't feel "forced" into joining and being a member of the AMA and other people do and certainly have a right to feel this way, it's apparent to me nothing can be said here to change their minds.
Happy landings Liberator!
04-15-2007 | 07:29 AM
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From: MAnsfield,
MA
RE: Observation From One Member
Here again, I come back to the fact that I am not forced to buy car insurance in order to drive my car, however,I cannot drivemy car on public streets or property without it. So,TECHNICALLY, I am not forced to own auto insurance, but am required to have it so I may use my car. In the case of R/C. I am not forced to have AMA. I can fly in any open space, but I am required to have it if I want to fly at an AMA sanctioned field.
I believe the mistake here is in the defintions. People are replacing "required" with "forced".
Point in fact these words have very different definitions.
I believe the mistake here is in the defintions. People are replacing "required" with "forced".
Point in fact these words have very different definitions.
04-15-2007 | 08:30 AM
#47
RE: Observation From One Member
SSRCCPREZ, I feel that you have put it all in a nut shell with just the two words , "forced" and "required". We are not forced to partisipate in model aviation, but there are those things that are required of us if we want to do so. Our club requirements for flying at our new field state that one must first be a club member and have an active AMA membership. Both of these requirements are for the protection of the club field and members.
Jim
AMA # 173709
Jim
AMA # 173709
04-16-2007 | 04:22 PM
#49
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From: Warner Robins,
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RE: Observation From One Member
This is incorrect. If your club is chartered with the AMA, all flyers, members and guests, are required by the club charter with the AMA to be members of the AMA. In the event that something would happen, the club's insurance is invalid if the incident involves a non-AMA member. If the AMA is not a monopoly, why did it go to such extremes to put the old Sport Flyers association out of business a few years ago? As I have said many times before, most clubs can not afford to purchase liability insurance on their own for their flying sites, therefore they charter with the AMA. The AMA had a captive audience until park flyers came along. Maybe now we don't need them as much!
Under current AMA administration, the intro pilot program allows NON-AMA members to fly at a AMA sanctioned clubs field provided that they do so under the intro pilot program. While under the intro-pilot program they are covered by the AMA.
Also, non-flying spectators do not have to have a AMA membership to participate, view, or be a guest in AMA sanctioned club field events, provided that they do not fly. Non-flying non-members that are spectators are also covered by the AMA insurance.
Parkflyers need the AMA too. Without it how are you to protect your field, field owner, or others that may be present. The AMA offers landowners 5 million in coverage, in addition to the 2.5 million that each AMA member carries on themselves.
04-16-2007 | 05:11 PM
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From: MAnsfield,
MA
RE: Observation From One Member
All of theabove said is v ery true and accurate. Also, very intelligent, well researched and well thought out.
It is this typeof response and responses that promogate the positive and dispell the rumor and misnomers that are out there.
On a side note,doesn't this stuff just give you a headache!!!! My goodness, if I was prone to alcohol this stuff would put me up there with the Kennedy's.
It is this typeof response and responses that promogate the positive and dispell the rumor and misnomers that are out there.
On a side note,doesn't this stuff just give you a headache!!!! My goodness, if I was prone to alcohol this stuff would put me up there with the Kennedy's.
