prop 7 spinner
01-03-2011 | 03:52 AM
#2
RE: prop 7 spinner
Hi!
????Does the spinner move??
First of all! Don't use a spinner if you can!
It's much better to use a alumium spinner nut! But if it's a scale plane use a Tru Turn alumium spinner.! Plastic spinners without back plate should be avoided because they flex and could in the worst case explode!!!!!
????Does the spinner move??
First of all! Don't use a spinner if you can!
It's much better to use a alumium spinner nut! But if it's a scale plane use a Tru Turn alumium spinner.! Plastic spinners without back plate should be avoided because they flex and could in the worst case explode!!!!!
01-03-2011 | 08:02 AM
#3
RE: prop 7 spinner
Plastic spinners are perfectly safe. They aren't loaded with gunpowder, and they won't explode.
If you are seeing some wobble, chances are you have installed the spinner crooked. Make sure that the cutouts aren't touching the prop blades and make sure it is seated properly all the way around in the back plate. If you still can't get it straight, take it off and install it without a prop to see if it still wobbles. If so, you have a bad one and there's not much you can do about it.
If you are seeing some wobble, chances are you have installed the spinner crooked. Make sure that the cutouts aren't touching the prop blades and make sure it is seated properly all the way around in the back plate. If you still can't get it straight, take it off and install it without a prop to see if it still wobbles. If so, you have a bad one and there's not much you can do about it.
01-05-2011 | 02:49 PM
#4
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From: Poolesville, MD
RE: prop 7 spinner
Yeah the plastic spinner nonsense.... sigh...
Spinner nuts have their place, but full spinner cones are more aerodynamically efficient and scale like.
kapSidEm:
As Jester_s1 mentioned it may be a mounting issue.
Most spinners come with extra adjustment "rings" that put the back plate in place perfectly centered.
If the spinner you are using came from another plane then, it is very likely you are not using the correct ring for the prop shaft width.
The prop shaft and the spinner center should have a very snug fit, so the backplate cannot move out of center.
If that is the case, all is good.
You then have to make sure that you EVENLY tigten the spinner screws.
All too often newbies will tighten them down unevenly or WAAY too tight.
The spinner screws should force the cone onto the backplate completely with just a bit of extra strength. DO NOT grind them down tightly.
If you overtigten the screws you'll deform or crack the backplate or cone... causing the spinner tip to wobble around center.
If you've not overdone things, try loosening the screws and retighten them EVENLY. That may fix the problem.
This is what causes the "explosions" Jaka is referring to erroneously as being soley endemic to plastic.
Overtighten an aluminum or metal spinner/backplate and the same thing will happen to it! Kaboom!! at high RPM's.
But this more the fault or inexperience of the installer/pilot not the spinner materials themselves.
Spinner nuts have their place, but full spinner cones are more aerodynamically efficient and scale like.
kapSidEm:
As Jester_s1 mentioned it may be a mounting issue.
Most spinners come with extra adjustment "rings" that put the back plate in place perfectly centered.
If the spinner you are using came from another plane then, it is very likely you are not using the correct ring for the prop shaft width.
The prop shaft and the spinner center should have a very snug fit, so the backplate cannot move out of center.
If that is the case, all is good.
You then have to make sure that you EVENLY tigten the spinner screws.
All too often newbies will tighten them down unevenly or WAAY too tight.
The spinner screws should force the cone onto the backplate completely with just a bit of extra strength. DO NOT grind them down tightly.
If you overtigten the screws you'll deform or crack the backplate or cone... causing the spinner tip to wobble around center.
If you've not overdone things, try loosening the screws and retighten them EVENLY. That may fix the problem.
This is what causes the "explosions" Jaka is referring to erroneously as being soley endemic to plastic.
Overtighten an aluminum or metal spinner/backplate and the same thing will happen to it! Kaboom!! at high RPM's.
But this more the fault or inexperience of the installer/pilot not the spinner materials themselves.
01-05-2011 | 04:51 PM
#5
RE: prop 7 spinner
I see the last 2 posts...posts 3 and 4, are made by guys with about 5 years experience...apparently you guys have never actually witnessed a cheap plastic spinner "explode"? I don't mean to put you guys down, but if you've been modeling for a long time...in my case about 40 years...you'll see a LOT of things happen. (picking shards of plastic out of your buddys forehead is not a fun thing...)
All plastic spinners (the ones that are entirely made of plastic...with plastic backplates ) should be avoided...
The ones with alum. backplates are OK...
The advice about making sure the prop openings are big enough, and the cone does not contact the prop blades is very good...and make sure the backplate (prop shaft ) opening is a good snug fit on the crankshaft...no excess clearance. Use a bushing if necessary.
All plastic spinners (the ones that are entirely made of plastic...with plastic backplates ) should be avoided...
The ones with alum. backplates are OK...
The advice about making sure the prop openings are big enough, and the cone does not contact the prop blades is very good...and make sure the backplate (prop shaft ) opening is a good snug fit on the crankshaft...no excess clearance. Use a bushing if necessary.
01-05-2011 | 06:27 PM
#6
RE: prop 7 spinner
Du-Bro plastic spinners are fine to use on any sport type engine. They are high quality and will not shatter (explode) unless they are compromised, as in a crash, or extreme cold. I would avoid using them on high RPM engines like those used on speed A/C, or during winter in areas that have very low temps. In 30 years of flying the only spinners I have ever seen fail are the cheap cones that come on ARF's and that was after excessive abuse.
01-07-2011 | 12:34 PM
#7
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From: Poolesville, MD
RE: prop 7 spinner
ORIGINAL: proptop
I see the last 2 posts...posts 3 and 4, are made by guys with about 5 years experience...apparently you guys have never actually witnessed a cheap plastic spinner ''explode''? I don't mean to put you guys down, but if you've been modeling for a long time...in my case about 40 years...you'll see a LOT of things happen. (picking shards of plastic out of your buddys forehead is not a fun thing...)
I see the last 2 posts...posts 3 and 4, are made by guys with about 5 years experience...apparently you guys have never actually witnessed a cheap plastic spinner ''explode''? I don't mean to put you guys down, but if you've been modeling for a long time...in my case about 40 years...you'll see a LOT of things happen. (picking shards of plastic out of your buddys forehead is not a fun thing...)
Case in point is the "fuel in the back of the tank on downlines" myth even proported IN MAGAZINE WRITINGs by RC greats such as Clarence Lee.
A simple video put up after my observation that this was physically impossible shattered years of insistence from long term modelers who really SHOULD have known better but never questioned the status quo.
Proptop:
YES I've seen spinners "explode".
I've had it happen to me, and during many training lessons that I take part in teaching.
But instead of merely assuming that "plastic spinners are to be avoided" I looked at the cause of the problem.
In ALL cases it's turned out to be user error of one type or another.
Those same errors ( over tightening, deformation of the backplate, etc. ) apply just as redily to metal and aluminum backplates you are espousing.
I've seen them "explode" too more often than plastic ones.
If anything the flying metal fragments have more energy and are far more dangerous than those "cheap plastic spinners" you are nixing.
There is absolutely NO REASON to avoid plastic spinners, they are no more dangerous ( and are probably SAFER ) than metal spinners.
What is to be avoided is improper setup by inexperienced flyers, who have been erroneously told that metal backplates are "safe" or "ok".
That false sense of security that simply because the backplate is made of metal, it will not shatter, will someday blind someone.
Overtightening or improper seating are the most common causes for spinners exploding.... particularly if the novice cranks things down and does not realize that they are stressing the backplate FORWARD or BACK due to improper configuration setup.
And that applies EQUALLY to metal backplates, all metal spinners, carbon spinners or plastic ones.
01-07-2011 | 12:49 PM
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From: Bellingham,
WA
RE: prop 7 spinner
Whats your experiance with duct fan failures inside jet type planes and how dangerous are these in compaison to spinner failures since they usually are inside some housing. ?
AltaTed
AltaTed
01-07-2011 | 02:22 PM
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From: Bend,
OR
RE: prop 7 spinner
OK..........I've been in the hobby since 1979 and I've never, never seen a plastic spinner fail. I've seen an aluminum spinner seperate itself from the plane but I've never seen a plastic spinner come off of a plane or self-destruct. I have 10 flyable planes in my hanger at this time and 6 of them have plastic spinners.........and I don't think I can count the ones I have successfully used.
01-07-2011 | 02:40 PM
#10
My Feedback: (-1)
RE: prop 7 spinner
Not all plastic spinners are created the same. I would never use one of those cheap spinners with the plastic back plate and little screws holding the cone but I do use the nylon spinners with the metal plates, even on giant scale planes. I can't count how many cheap plastics I have seen break and shatter sending out shrapnel in all directions.
The OP only wanted to know how to balance a spinner. The how to is usually printed in the instructions when you buy a prop balancer.
The OP only wanted to know how to balance a spinner. The how to is usually printed in the instructions when you buy a prop balancer.
01-07-2011 | 05:59 PM
#11
RE: prop 7 spinner
ORIGINAL: opjose
One of the things I find all too often in this hobby that those who proport long times modeling, all too often assume that their own views are inherently correct.
Case in point is the ''fuel in the back of the tank on downlines'' myth even proported IN MAGAZINE WRITINGs by RC greats such as Clarence Lee.
A simple video put up after my observation that this was physically impossible shattered years of insistence from long term modelers who really SHOULD have known better but never questioned the status quo.
Proptop:
YES I've seen spinners ''explode''.
I've had it happen to me, and during many training lessons that I take part in teaching.
But instead of merely assuming that ''plastic spinners are to be avoided'' I looked at the cause of the problem.
In ALL cases it's turned out to be user error of one type or another.
Those same errors ( over tightening, deformation of the backplate, etc. ) apply just as redily to metal and aluminum backplates you are espousing.
I've seen them ''explode'' too more often than plastic ones.
If anything the flying metal fragments have more energy and are far more dangerous than those ''cheap plastic spinners'' you are nixing.
There is absolutely NO REASON to avoid plastic spinners, they are no more dangerous ( and are probably SAFER ) than metal spinners.
What is to be avoided is improper setup by inexperienced flyers, who have been erroneously told that metal backplates are ''safe'' or ''ok''.
That false sense of security that simply because the backplate is made of metal, it will not shatter, will someday blind someone.
Overtightening or improper seating are the most common causes for spinners exploding.... particularly if the novice cranks things down and does not realize that they are stressing the backplate FORWARD or BACK due to improper configuration setup.
And that applies EQUALLY to metal backplates, all metal spinners, carbon spinners or plastic ones.
ORIGINAL: proptop
I see the last 2 posts...posts 3 and 4, are made by guys with about 5 years experience...apparently you guys have never actually witnessed a cheap plastic spinner ''explode''? I don't mean to put you guys down, but if you've been modeling for a long time...in my case about 40 years...you'll see a LOT of things happen. (picking shards of plastic out of your buddys forehead is not a fun thing...)
I see the last 2 posts...posts 3 and 4, are made by guys with about 5 years experience...apparently you guys have never actually witnessed a cheap plastic spinner ''explode''? I don't mean to put you guys down, but if you've been modeling for a long time...in my case about 40 years...you'll see a LOT of things happen. (picking shards of plastic out of your buddys forehead is not a fun thing...)
Case in point is the ''fuel in the back of the tank on downlines'' myth even proported IN MAGAZINE WRITINGs by RC greats such as Clarence Lee.
A simple video put up after my observation that this was physically impossible shattered years of insistence from long term modelers who really SHOULD have known better but never questioned the status quo.
Proptop:
YES I've seen spinners ''explode''.
I've had it happen to me, and during many training lessons that I take part in teaching.
But instead of merely assuming that ''plastic spinners are to be avoided'' I looked at the cause of the problem.
In ALL cases it's turned out to be user error of one type or another.
Those same errors ( over tightening, deformation of the backplate, etc. ) apply just as redily to metal and aluminum backplates you are espousing.
I've seen them ''explode'' too more often than plastic ones.
If anything the flying metal fragments have more energy and are far more dangerous than those ''cheap plastic spinners'' you are nixing.
There is absolutely NO REASON to avoid plastic spinners, they are no more dangerous ( and are probably SAFER ) than metal spinners.
What is to be avoided is improper setup by inexperienced flyers, who have been erroneously told that metal backplates are ''safe'' or ''ok''.
That false sense of security that simply because the backplate is made of metal, it will not shatter, will someday blind someone.
Overtightening or improper seating are the most common causes for spinners exploding.... particularly if the novice cranks things down and does not realize that they are stressing the backplate FORWARD or BACK due to improper configuration setup.
And that applies EQUALLY to metal backplates, all metal spinners, carbon spinners or plastic ones.
Not gonna argue with you Mr. Peabody...I mean after all, you know more than Clarence Lee!
(yeah, right...that's a good one...
)The only time I've seen problems with an all Alum. spinner is when a 4 stroke has backfired or kicked the prop off...and yes, that was generally caused by "user error".
FWIW I've been a flight instructor since 1975...and an Intro pilot for I don't even remember how long...own and successfully operated hundreds of model engines over those years...never "blown one up" or crashed one beyond repair. (have also rebuilt / repaired dozens of them for other modelers )
Tru Turn or Dave Brown spinners are the best choices (they have a nice / thick backplate ) or the Aluminum backplate spinners with the groove all the way around the backplate for the nylon cone to seat into. It is a good idea to get into the habit of using high quality equipment. (Some of those cheap ARF aluminum spinners can be almost as bad as plastic...too thin and flimsy )
Spinners with plastic backplates will most likely distort, especially after the prop nut has to be re-tightened after a while. Just having the prop nut "tight enough" can cause a plastic backplate to distort...it doesn't even have to be "over torqued" to cause problems.
This whole hobby is about doing things the right (correct ) way, isn't it!? IMO using a cheap spinner with a plastic backplate is asking for problems. They usually wobble which puts more stress on the bearings, and can cause fuel foaming, and puts more vibration through the radio system, airframe, etc. etc.
But to at least try to answer the O.P. question...sometimes just repositioning the spinner assembly can change thinge enough so that it doesn't wobble...or wobbles less.
Also, you can get yourself a Top Flite or DuBro balancer and check the instructions...and try a search on spinner balancing...there have been discussions about this in the Glow Engines forum.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXD712&P=ML
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXHY61&P=ML
01-07-2011 | 08:06 PM
#12
RCU Forum Manager/Admin
My Feedback: (9)
RE: prop 7 spinner
Ok guys, this IS NOT THE PLACE for an argument like this. While it is a valid discussion these arguments back and forth are not on topic for this thread, and the petty bickering back and forth only serves to distract from any actual information being passed on. Let's stop the bickering and get back to helping people in this forum.
Ken
Ken
01-08-2011 | 10:13 AM
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From: Bellingham,
WA
RE: prop 7 spinner
OK Guy's, now that you stopped arguing about spinner failures that, by the way I learned lot's about spinner failures and what to stay away from with all your "discussions". Good information for all of us!
I'm now strictly into electric powered planes and some of these can spin 20,000- 30,000 rpm from what I have heard. The "Jets" using internal duct fans spin way up there so my earlier question was, 'Are these dangerous" since these are housed inside the plane and must be bad for the internals of the planes when they blow but, are they dangerous to the fliers aroud them ?
AltaTed
I'm now strictly into electric powered planes and some of these can spin 20,000- 30,000 rpm from what I have heard. The "Jets" using internal duct fans spin way up there so my earlier question was, 'Are these dangerous" since these are housed inside the plane and must be bad for the internals of the planes when they blow but, are they dangerous to the fliers aroud them ?
AltaTed
01-08-2011 | 02:00 PM
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From: Las Vegas,
NV
RE: prop 7 spinner
ORIGINAL: jester_s1
Plastic spinners are perfectly safe. They aren't loaded with gunpowder, and they won't explode.
Plastic spinners are perfectly safe. They aren't loaded with gunpowder, and they won't explode.
01-08-2011 | 02:37 PM
#15
RE: prop 7 spinner
ORIGINAL: AltaTed
OK Guy's, now that you stopped arguing about spinner failures that, by the way I learned lot's about spinner failures and what to stay away from with all your ''discussions''. Good information for all of us!
I'm now strictly into electric powered planes and some of these can spin 20,000- 30,000 rpm from what I have heard. The ''Jets'' using internal duct fans spin way up there so my earlier question was, 'Are these dangerous'' since these are housed inside the plane and must be bad for the internals of the planes when they blow but, are they dangerous to the fliers aroud them ?
AltaTed
OK Guy's, now that you stopped arguing about spinner failures that, by the way I learned lot's about spinner failures and what to stay away from with all your ''discussions''. Good information for all of us!
I'm now strictly into electric powered planes and some of these can spin 20,000- 30,000 rpm from what I have heard. The ''Jets'' using internal duct fans spin way up there so my earlier question was, 'Are these dangerous'' since these are housed inside the plane and must be bad for the internals of the planes when they blow but, are they dangerous to the fliers aroud them ?
AltaTed
There have certainly been incidents of fan failures...visit the EDF (electric ducted fan ) forums and do a search...you'll find that some of the high power set-ups are spinning 40,000 - 50,000+ r.p.m. so great care needs to be taken to use the best quality equipment. They are made of carbon fiber and are extremely strong (at least the good ones are ) but like anything man made / mechanical, they can fail.
From the early 80's up until 2005 we flew LOTS of ICDF here at Griffiss Air Force Base, and quite a few Turbines as well...I never saw a failure personally, but heard of a couple.
Usually the shroud contains the bits and pieces but an occasional stray part gets out.
Best thing to do is stay out of the plane of rotation of the fan / turbine wheel...same practice as in full scale aviation. Don't stand directly behind or in front either...
