Talked with some pilots today, they recommend me to get a Sig 4* or similar plane for my 1st plane. They said with an instructor and on a buddy box, it would be no problem to learn on this semi-symmetrical, low-winged, tail-dragger. I'm not afraid of getting this plane for my trainer, just don't want to get in over my head. Any recommendations.

you could use it as a trainer but it is really a second plane... trainers like the alpha or LT-40 are more of the first plane type... although if you want to skip a trainer and use the four star as a first it would really matter. The four star can be really docial (SP?) but it can also be a really fun plane.

If you are young, have good vision, good coordination, good concentration, good attention span, the FourStar would be a good way to go. It's only slightly more challenging than a high-wing trainer, but nothing you can't get a grip on with decent instruction. When you're flying solo, you can expand your repertoire on this plane somewhat beyond what you might do with a flat-bottomed high-wing trainer. (I am speaking from an old duffer's point of view.)

Something to keep in mind is that some guys have been flying for a while. Flying becomes second nature and it is easy to forget just how chalenging it is to a new pilot. I have been flying for 2 years and I just retired my trainer so i could put the radio into my first low wing plane. You should start with a trainer, thats what they're for. I am building a 4-Star and i can tell by the design that it will not stand up to the abuse a good trainer will. If it is possible for you i would also recommend that you build your trainer fom a kit. You will learn a lot about how the airplane works and you will understand how they're built. You will also be able to repair the plane much easier if you know how it was built and have the plans.

OTOH, I was young, had good coordination, etc when I learned. Within two months of flying I was bored with my high wing trainer and had already progressed to a low wing semi-symetrical plane. With a buddy box I probably could have learned on the low wing, but buddy boxes were not so common way back then.

Now, having said that, I still suggest starting with a high wing and going to a low wing later. However, if the instructors in BVFlyer's area think he (or she, never can tell with some of these nicknames) is up to the challenge of learning with a low wing, and they are up to teaching with one, then more power to 'em.

Hi BVFlyer... You know the saying about first planes...
The four Star's are docile planes which make them eaiser
to get along with.. And will carry you far beyond "first plane
trainers".. But they will not take the abuse of a true trainer!!
Which means staying off the ground besides when it's on it's
wheels.. And talking about wheels... 4*'s will not take alot of
hard landings, But they do land nice and easy!! It's your
choice.. On a side note, The 4* is what I planned to be my
first plane... But my trainer wouldn't go for it, thought of just
switching trainers.... But he had too much to offer me.. After
it was all said and done... I know, he now knows my thoughts
on my first plane was correct.. hence, why I received the the
items I got from him....

Let me ask, were these pilots offering to be the instructor, and furnish the buddy box? It's usually a good idea to take the instructor's advice, when you're learning from him. If he says to use a 4-star, I'm sure he can make it work for you.

If, however, the person doing the recommending is not offering to be the instructor, you might wait until you have an instructor who will make his own recommendations.

Just my 2 cents worth, good luck!
Dave Olson

You have enough on your plate just learning to handle the plane in the air, trying to learn on a tail dragger would be too much too soon.
A 4* is a sport plane with quick handling and requires allot of elevator/rudder coordination when landing and taking off compared to a trainer, stick with the trainer until you can throw it around with confidence and then move on but keep the trainer... you can still learn allot from it.

Why not compromise and get an Arrow or Avistar? Build the wing flat if they already aren't. That should be a plenty hot enough plane for a new person.

I don't think so. My trainer was a tail dragger and wasn't difficult to learn on. I chose it because I didn't want to fix ripped out firewalls from nosewheel landings. That was some gallons ago and I still haven't crashed on takeoff. Tail dragger takeoffs are not generally as difficult as made out to be. Some planes are exceptions - the 4 star is not one of them, however. Just make sure the main gear has a bit of tow-in and you won't have to worry about ground looping.

BVFlyer, I think the pilots you talked with MAY be right. I've read of a number of guys who learned on a 4*. Haven't ever heard anyone try one and say it was too much so they went to a trainer. But, I'd find an instructor you intend to work with first. Then ask him. His thoughts will have far more importance than anything you read here - because he's the one who has to work you through it all.

Personally, I think your engine choice is more important than the choice between a 4* or trainer. Buy something with more then adequate power for the plane you buy. And buy one that you don't have to dick with to keep running. Your instructor will really appreciate it. So will you as you watch other guys spending more time trying to get their engines running right than they do flying. Boy does that give an instructor the fits.

Good luck!

We soloed a young man this weekend his first day but he had be using a sim for about a year. He is flying a trainer but will move up to a 4* soon. By using a trainer he soloed sooner and after another day of flying he may be flying on his own so he can get more flight time in not having to watt on help. We like to use high wing semi-symmetrical trainer 60 size like the Hobbistar 60. You could learn on a 4* but would take longer to solo. Gary

Each person has certain inherent abilities and certain weaknesses. I have no idea if you are a "natural" at R/C flying, but if you are, a 4* would work OK with good instruction. However, if you are like the majority of new students, this will be a difficult exercise for a while, & in that case a 4* would be a poor choice. Standard trainers are designed to make the initial learning steps as painless as possible -- and there can be a lot of pain. It's your choice, but my advice is to go for a standard trainer. When you have outgrown it, you can hop it up substantially & learn a bunch more from it, without having to buy a second plane until you have more definite ideas about where you want to go in this hobby.

I can see the merits of both viewpoints, and can only offer my own personal opinion. I originally "learned" to fly on a taildragger biplane that was a hand-me-down from my brothers. I say "learned" because after a couple dozen flights, I never really learned to land, despite the fact that it was a pretty docile plane. I always needed an instructor's help.

When I got back into flying after 15+ years out, I bought a well-used Sig Kadet to learn on. After a couple sessions with an instructor both with and without a buddy box, I had soloed. I now feel comfortable to fly completely on my own, and have actually given a little buddy box instruction to family members. I think part of the reason I was able to progress pretty quickly was because I wasn't afraid of crashing the Kadet. I can try new things and I know I can recover from just about any situation. I can work on making my landings smooth, instead of just making it down in one piece. I can also practice a lot of aerobatics that aren't normally associated with a trainer. For example, this weekend, I practiced flying inverted for extended periods of time. I figure if I can fly around inverted with the Kadet, it will be that much easier when I move on to another plane.

I recommend getting one of the ubiquitous ARF trainers, using it all you can, and then selling it to another beginner. Have fun!

-Scott

When I started out (at a club "learn to fly" weekend), I flew my instructor's high wing 60 size flat bottom trainer. I got maybe four or five flights when I decided to take the plunge and get my own setup. After much discussion with my instructor, I decided on a Big Stik 60 for several reasons -- high wing like a trainer; dihedral like a trainer; tricycle gear like a trainer, fully symmetrical airfoil like a second plane, easily modifed to tail dragger like a second plane; huge wing area to aid in slow landings.

When I took the plane to the field for the maiden, the instructor was so impressed with the flight characteristics (trainer like in speed and landing, dihedral to help self-righting, symmetrical airfoil for improved aerobatics, etc.) that when his trainer bit the dust, he replaced it with a Big Stik which he now uses as his trainer. Since that time, I've had the opportunity to fly "typical" trainers, and I have always found them wanting in terms of really helping a person learn. The combination of high wing, dihedral and tricycle gear combined with a full airfoil and serious wing area makes this, in my opinion, the best of both worlds for a trainer.

Sadly my Stik met its' expiration date (bad switch), but it gave me enough confidence to move into an Ultra Stik and now into a 24% Edge. I have had no problems adjusting to tail draggers or fully aerobatics planes, and I truly believe that is due to the broad range of experience I got with the Stik.

Probably more than 2 cents worth, but I really like(d) that platform.

Mark

Thanks to all who have offered their opinions. I am now thinking in favor of the high-wing, semi-symmetrical trainer (MW Aerobat, H9 Arrow, or the Hobbico Avistar). Seems to me to be a good compromise between the flat-bottom winged trainer and a true sport plane. Anybody have any opinions on these planes?

Hi BVFlyer, I have the Avistar and can vouch for it. Great plane. I have dumped it into the ground a handfull of times and patched it back together and it still flies very well. On one crash it split the right side panel off and broke most of the front end. I had back in the air in two days. Also in another crash the tail broke all the way off and glued that back on and still am flying it. I bought a replacement ARF (plane only) and will have it flying shortly. Very nice planes.

Avistar is the favorite trainer with our club instructors, who are a very active bunch, train more students than any other club in our area.

BV, my first plane was an Avistar and I`ve not been sorry, to say the least. Recommend it highly. I`ve since added a PT-19 and a 4*40. I`d have to say that I think a " regular " trainer like an Avistar would be a better first plane for most new pilots than a 4*.

BVFlyer... You'll like the Avistar... And it will do good for starting
aerobatics.. I started with it also and still take it to the field some
times, But now I'm thinking of adding floats to it... My instructor
wanted me to get a basic trainer, I did keep my stand on this one:-)

I learned to fly with a tail dragger. Don't see a problem.

Some good choices there, BV. I have trained people with their Avistars, and one with an Arrow. I've trained about 3 with a Midwest AeroStar, don't know how that compares to the AeroBat.

Setup is another variable that makes a difference. I like to start new folks off with low travel. Seems to help them if they can actually move the stick, instead of just applying pressure to it. After a few flights, then they can usually handle additional travel on the elevator & ailerons. Just my preference.

So I guess my point is, when you are in training, and the plane seems too sensitive... try moving the pushrods into holes in the horn that are farther from the hinge. That will make it easier to do smooth flights with.

Good luck,
Dave Olson