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Old 03-31-2005 | 11:54 PM
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Default Which Glue, and Where

As a newbie to r/c planes, and not having built one, YET.

Can somebody explain the ART OF ADHIESIVE SELECTION and AREA OF APPLICATION.

I understand that glue type is a personal choice, but as a newbie, the range of different adhiesives it's mind blowing.

There must be a genraly accepted standard for types of addhiesives required and the places on an aircraft were they need to be used.

Can you somebody explain please.
Old 04-01-2005 | 02:45 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

Epoxy= good for firewalls, landing gear blocks and such. Provides flexible, more energy absorbing bond. But heavy by volume.
CA=== Good for most applications, comes in fast thin, and thick slow and medium mid. Tends to be Brittle, with little shear strength. Causes headaches when sanding. Oh and if you are exposed to it for long periods, such as building a Kadet wing, it will burn your eyes and throat. Use vent fan.
Wood Glue+ Good all around, light weight, great bond. Comes in Waterproof(outdoor) variety. Sandable. Bad habits? guys? I dont know any.
Old 04-01-2005 | 05:28 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

As sooner said. Epoxy for high strength areas, remember don't go overboard. More glue does not mean a stronger joint. It's only as strong as the wood around it. CA I have found good for sheeting, or area'd with a decent amount of surface area. I use white wood glue in as many area's as I can. I only really use CA glue when I need speed.
Old 04-01-2005 | 05:37 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

What the others said about epoxy. I don't use 5 minute epoxy, the working time is too short. I keep 15 and 30 minute in the shop. I'm a bit of an impatient builder, so I use CA most other places. I've also got a bottle of canopy glue for, you guessed it, gluing on canopies. I like the fact that it stays flexible, and dries clear. Personally, I don't use wood glue on planes, too impatient to wait for it to dry, it is reserved for woodworking projects.
Old 04-01-2005 | 06:10 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

Generally, the build instructions say what sort of glue to use and where to use it. I keep 10 minute and 30 minute epoxy around for strong joints and use CA for most everything else. Someone suggested Gorrilla Glue for such things as hinges (not CA hinges but actuall hinges with joints). I've never tried it but they claim it is very strong and easier to work with than epoxy.
Old 04-01-2005 | 08:28 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

ORIGINAL: Smoggyboy

As a newbie to r/c planes, and not having built one, YET.

Can somebody explain the ART OF ADHIESIVE SELECTION and AREA OF APPLICATION.

I understand that glue type is a personal choice, but as a newbie, the range of different adhiesives it's mind blowing.

There must be a genraly accepted standard for types of addhiesives required and the places on an aircraft were they need to be used.

Can you somebody explain please.
MOST applications will be as follows:

Balsa to balsa with a TIGHT FITTING JOINT and CA hinges (what typically come with ARFS and many kits) - thin CA

Balsa to Balsa with a sloppy joint OR balsa to lite ply - medium CA

Plywood to plywood - 30 minute (or longer ) epoxy

Pinned hinges (these are the plastic/nylon hinges with a pin holding the 2 halfs together) - 30 minute (or longer ) epoxy or a polyurethane glue. A tip - use a toothpick and put a thin coating of vasoline on the pin area before installing to prevent the epoxy/polyurethane glue from getting into the hinge joint.

Applying balsa sheeting - thick CA or (preferred ) Titebond wood glue or similar glue.

Firewall (typically plywood ) - 30 minute (or longer ) epoxy For strength add tri stock between the firewall and fuselage.

Landing gear mounts (the plywood mount ) - 30 minute (or longer ) epoxy For strength add tri stock between the ply mount and the fuselage.

ANY joints that will be subject to high stress (joining wings together, etc ) - 30 minute (or longer) epoxy.

Hardening screw holes in balsa or lite ply - thin CA (use sparingly and after the CA is dry rethread the screw )

Epoxy is heavy and for most applications (except as noted above) is not usually required.

Thin and medium CA is what is typically used for the majority of building. Sanding a CA joint is difficult since the balsa is substantially easier to sand than the CA. Neatness is a BIG plus when doing ANY TYPE of gluing.

If you find that you start having a stopped up nose or your eyes start watering when using CA, you most likely have a sensitivity to it. In that case switch over to a decent wood glue (yellow glue ) such as Titebond or Elmer's Carpenter glue. The drying time on these glues is usually a couple of hours so clamping/pinning of the part(s) is required.

As you may have noticed, nothing is mentioned about epoxy with less than a 30 minute work time.

Epoxy with less than a 30 minute work time is substantially weaker than a 30 minute epoxy.

Except as noted above, thick CA is almost never needed and due to the longer working time, a wood glue is frequently used for sheeting instead of thick CA.

Polyurethane glues expand quite a bit when drying. The rate of expansion is determined by the amount of moisture in the wood and the humidity. Polyurethane glue has limited but some good uses, however, it is quite expensive and once the bottle has been opened, the bottle life is about 3 months.

Hope this helps.
Old 04-01-2005 | 08:53 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

Superb gents, thank you for your help, all has become clear.

I can not fault this forum. Majic.
Old 04-01-2005 | 10:29 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

Let's not forget polyurethane. Works great in place of epoxy, snads easy, light, strong, etc.

Then of course there is the bird poop and saliva glue you can make yourself.
Old 04-01-2005 | 10:47 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

Good coverages above however a couple item that may have been covered but I missed might help you if you're doing extending building.

The 'aliphetic' (sp??) resin glues (the creme colored wood glues) are great items and for the impatient, here is a tip. I use it as a standard. When applying the wood glue, leave a couple spaces here and there. Apply a drop or two of thick CA. Place the joint together, a shot of accelerator -- or water with a fair amount of baking soda mixed in -- and within a few seconds the parts are "PINNED" and you can move on and do other things while the glue dries. Guessing you won't get it to the field before it dries!!
Especially with bonding doublers, get the wood glue all smeared on the sides except for some spots along the edges and in the central areas. Ready to go, apply the thick CA in those spots, place it together, quickly align and press down for a few seconds, then proceed on building. Everything is secure while I build, plus the inner glue is curing.

BTW I use 5' epoxy a lot and use it with 30' Epoxy just as I described the CA above. My attention spell in building is rather short so I make use of the time I allow for that chore.
Old 04-01-2005 | 06:49 PM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

This is all very good stuff, great info for us newbie's.

Thank's
Old 04-01-2005 | 09:51 PM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

The more I use Polyurethane glues, the better I like them. I've pretty much quit using epoxy. You can use an incredibly thin skin of this stuff on any kind of joint you can clamp (or otherwise prevent from spreading apart when the glue expands) together, spray a little water on it, and you'll have an extremely strong bond with much less weight than you'll ever get from an epoxy joint. I use Elmers Ultimate...Lots cheaper than Gorilla Glue. And I've started using polyurethane varnish for fuelproofing firewalls. Epoxy is just too heavy, and you'll be rewarded for every ounce you can safely shave with better performance.
Old 04-02-2005 | 08:31 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

A lot of good advise given so far......newbies, Pay Attention!

Jerry
Old 04-03-2005 | 04:28 AM
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Default RE: Which Glue, and Where

I try not to use epoxy it smells bad its messy any heavy. I use thin/ thick CA and Titebond. A couple of my planes don't have a drop of epoxy on them as firewalls tailfeathers and landing gear blocks were all glued with Titebond. The trick to use alphatic resin glues is to put a thin layer of glue on both surfaces and let the set apart for a couple of minutes then when you stick the together it is pretty well stuck and drying time is really only a few minutes. Another trick: if you have a perfect fit and your fins will be supported with fillets your tailfeathers can be glued with thick CA. set the stab where you want it push a couple of pins through the stab and into the fuse, slide stab up on the pins just enough to get glue on the surface, slide the stab back down on fuse and remove the pins about 30 seconds later and you are done.

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