Hey, I just got into RC planes (obviously, since im in the beginner's board...) and im just about done building my first plane... but i just have a question, With a GP PT-40 (the kit) with Evolution .46NT (which is a 2-stroke) and an 8-oz tank, how long of a flight time am I gonna have? I dont wanna have to do a deadstick landing on my first flight.


And PS. before you start hammering on me, telling me to go to the local flying club: I have always done things by myself... i have always been a self-taught guy, and i'd feel pretty stupid depending on another person waiting to save my ... buttocks... pressure has always been hard on me so i'd be much more calm flyin alone... 'sides, i've played many flying games and i plan on getting that program...RealFlight, i think.

i know all that stuff about flying calm on your own, but seriously, you MUST join a flying club... unless your made of $100 notes.

Run a tank of fuel on the ground and time it.
That said, and I know you don't want to hear it. If you have access to an instructor swallow your pride and get one.
I tried it on my own because I was having trouble finding some help. 2 stupid mistakes later I am on my second trainer already, I got about a dozen flights with the first one. I am repairing it but it is a major rebuild.
What did I do? The first crash was caused by the aileron servo tray coming loose after my hard landings. A good instructor would have caught that I think.
The second was I forgot to raise the antenna after range check. I think if an instructor had been present he may have said what my signature now say's.
Anyway, I now have found a kind soul to come out and spend some time with me on the buddy box.
Which ever route you go good luck and happy flying!

Fine,

Let us know how long your plane flew before you ran out of fuel

Figure an AVERAGE of a 10 - 14 minute engine run time. This will depend on how much time you spend at full throttle and how much time you spend at lower throttle setting.

As for teaching yourself - Many people have taught themselves how to fly. That being said, expect your 1st flight to last about 30 seconds and expect to have to do repairs to the plane.

I realize you are pretty much of a "do it yourself" person, however, think about the money AND aggravation for a moment.

An ARF trainer costs about $100 - $150. Club dues and AMA dues typically will cost about the same as an ARF trainer (or less).

If an instructor at a club saves the plane from crashing 1 time (and trust me on this, they will save it from crashing), you have just broken even money wise. If the instructor saves the plane from crashing more than once (and they will save it multiple times ), you are money ahead that you can use for another plane, engine, etc once you know how to fly.

As for the aggrevation - some people learn a new skill very easily - almost like they were born with the knowledge and ability, while others trying to learn this same skill take longer and have to concentrate more in order to learn ithe skill. For a lot of people learning how to fly, they become discouraged because it is taking them longer to learn and many of them quit. For these people, they have just wasted their time, money and effort without learning anything.

The choice is yours.

If you do decide to teach yourself to fly, hopefully, you will be one of the people who will seem like they were born with the knowledge and ability.

I wish you the best of luck and keep us informed on how you are doing. The people here really do care.

Barwelle,
Probably 10 to 12 minutes flight time, but learning on your own you won't get anywhere near that much.

Seriously, I've said this before: IF you're a natural and use an instructor, he'll be very impressed and praise you for your talent. Then you'll be off and flying on your own.

But if you're like 99% of the population, try it on your own, and you're NOT a natural, you will crash multiple times, damaging your plane and possibly destroying it.

Which choice makes the most sense to you?

Good luck with whatever you decide. And please let us know how it goes.

Welcome to RCU, it's a terrific place filled with people that like to help, and like to see folks like you be successful and enjoy this hobby.
Dennis-

Barwelle,
Speaking from personal experience, you can learn to fly on your own. However, I would strongly recommend that you find an instructor. I can still remember the overwhelming sense of being rushed when I first flew my plane. It flew much faster than I expected (and I can almost promise it will be the same situation for you). You have to have a very clear idea of what you are going to do AND what you are not going to do. Save yourself some time and money and find an instructor...most really like teaching anyway! Plus you get to meet someone else who's interested in the same hobby!

I have come to regard all these "I'm going to learn on my own" posts as trolls. You absolutely knew before you posted that your thread would draw a ton of "Get an instructor" posts. Yet you chose to mention your intention. If your intent is to learn by yourself, you don't need us to tell you how long your fuel will last.

Ask for what you need, and if you need to know how long a .40 will run on an ounce of fuel, someone will spell it out. Turning around and saying you don't need anyone to help is contradicting yourself, and a waste of bandwidth.

Good luck with your self-instruction. Don't troll.
Dave Olson

See what fun you are missing by not going to a club, geeze Louis !!! 60's burn about an ounce per minute full throttle. A 40 will burn about 2/3 of that. You do the math. Now that number only works if your tank is assembled correctly and you can burn all of the fuel out of it. Start out rich, the plane will lean slightly during the flight. I would say when you have it tuned on the ground, you should fatten it up one click or so to fly it. Unless you have a bunch of sim time, your first flight will probably last somewhere between 30 seconds and 1 minute ! That is the honest truth bro !

I figured that you guys would notice that that was my first post. Also, you would have noticed that I had nothing else that i would've compared it to (like kingwoodbarney's post) such as a .20 or .60. thats why I said not to start hammering me.


Ok, here, i'll restart the thread...

How long will a .46 run on an ounce of fuel? it sounds like it'll run for about a minute 20 seconds, give or take. that right? thanks all.

I run my 40, not much difference, with a 8 ounce for about 20 minutes, but start trying to bring it in after about 15 for go arounds and such. I try to start bringing it in at about 15, You NEVER know how long it will tkae you to get it on the ground. Also, On takeoff your elevator thumb should not even be seen moving by anyone near you. Move it about a quarter of an inch IF that much. I personally would also get good at stable movements in the air before moving on to landing. So fly As much as possible, and make slow movements near the ground. If you can take it off and fly stable nad smooth, then you can land it. All landing is, is low and slow flying. I am MUCH better at landings then takeoffs. For me, Once I am in the air, I am good to go, unless i do something i know i'm not ready for.

I have crashed 2 times. Both were my fault due to too much elevator movement on take off, and causing the plane to pitch up and lose airspeed.

If you can get in the air and get up about 5 telephone poles high. (high as you can see the plane good, but still be high enough to where you mess up you know what your doing)

If you go inverted, invert your mind.

For the sim, I have heard Aerofly Pro is quite a good one.

Hope this helps

Chad

Hmmm... Wow... Your homeowners insurance has $1,000,000 of coverage?
Cool..mine doesn't... I'm glad I have the AMA behind me...



and some good instructors!

The AMA insurance is a secondary insurance. It won't pay until ALL other insurance policies have already paid. That means they pay after your home or renters insurance has paid first.

Rule of thumb is you want enough fuel for taxiing to position, takeoff, fly for 10 minutes, land, and then taxi back. You also want a few minutes extra in case a gust of wind hits when you are trying to land and you want to go around again. That being said to achieve this, an 8 oz. tank is considered standard for a 40 size engine and a 10 oz. tank for a 46 size engine. Since you have an 8 oz. tank with a 46 size engine I would be timing my flight time(starting at takeoff) for 8 minutes and then throttle down to land. When I get a plane that comes with an 8 oz. tank but a 46 is going on the front, I change the tank for a 10 0z. Running the engine on the ground at full throttle until the engine quits won't tell you running time. I have seen it tried and the flight time is always much shorter than the run time on the ground resulting in a surprized pilots looks when the engine has run out of fuel and suddenly quits. The plane flying through the air allows the engine to speed up, more rpms, more fuel being burned. [8D]

I was actually thinkin that i shoulda got a .40 instead of a .46... I dont think i could get a 10 oz. to fit very well without some serious modifying of my fuse, and i dont wanna do that. And, with a .46, i'll probly be going much faster than i would have to without realising it, and a 40 wouldnt let me do that... oh well, too late now... and its only .06 of a diff.

Nah, stick with the 46. It will give you the little extra umph to get out of trouble.

The main difference I notice between a 40 and a 46 on trainers is the extra pull for takeoffs with the larger engine. This helps if the grass is getting a bit tall on grass runways. Hit the throttle on a trainer and it is designed to start climbing. With a 46 you climb faster. Once you have gained enough height to fly around you nrmally throttle down to half or a bit lower. Basic trainer info: Trainers will fly level at about 1/2 throttle, climb at higher settings and decend at lower settings. At this throttle setting there isn't much difference speed wise between the 2 engines. If you spend most of your flight time flying at 1/2 throttle or so then you can easily get in your 10 minute flight. [8D]

Barwelle: There is more to flying RC than justg learning to handle the sticks. The sport is inherently dangerous.. to someone, perhaps not you directly, unless of course, you forget that there is a prop spinning there and put your hand through the thing and lose a couple of fingers (can't happen? Think again... there are many posts from people that have done just that). lose a finger at a field while alone, you may find yourself not able to make it to the hospital.. then what are you going to do? How about losing it on landing and it comes directly toward you. You think you can get out of the way? Think again. It's coming at you at perhaps 20 to 25 mph and about 50 feet away. Without an instructor, before you realize it, it's on top of you. How about losing control when it is over the 'pits' while your son or daughter is there watching you fly and you hit them.

Swallow your pride and get an instructor or do RC cars.

I have the PT40 and while trying to troubleshoot an engine problem, I tried to put a 10 oz. tank in it. It would not fit without binding the throttle and nose gear pushrods. The 8 oz. tank fits nicely between them.
The other thing that you should consider during the build is relocating the steering arm and the pushrod if you have an engine with a remote needlevalve that mounts to the backplate of the engine. The valve will limit the throw of the steering arm if built according to the plans. I'm looking at lowering the pushrod about an inch and connecting the steering arm to the nose gear in the middle of the engine mount so that they connect below the needlevalve. Having this information before I built the plane would have saved me an extra hole though the firewall. Hope this helps.

dicksoucy,
Excellent point. I know that a lot of people think that it's not going to happen to them, but it does happen. We had something happen at our field that made me thing twice about flying alone. A pilot at our field was adjusting his needle valve and he put the hand up against the prop. It opened up a pretty good gash on his hand. He said he would drive himself to the hospital to have it looked at, but we insisted that one of us drive him. It's lucky that we did because on the drive (about a 5-7 minute drive) he passed out from the amount of blood lost. Once at the hospital they had to give him blood to replace lost blood. If he had been alone or had driven himself it could have been a disaster. After watching that happen I won't fly at the field by myself anymore.

fastsky is right. I have a PT40 with a .46FX. More than enough power to get you out of a sticky situation but needs only half or less throttle to fly like a trainer. I kept the 8oz tank in it and get around 5-10min depending on throttle position.

ill have to agree with fastsy's first post.

I would say 5 minutes of flight. Be honest guys, for a begginner it will take a least 3 approaches.
Also, I would not force a landing. This can EASILY rip the gear offf

Under the circumstances this airplane will be operated i.e. full throttle because there will be no one to have him throttle back and as we all know this is the #1 thing that is not going to get done as every newbie knows. Because of this the tank will be no good for more than eight minutes.

The whole issue is completely moot since the flight is not going to last more than one minute and everyone here knows it. A newbie atempting to go it alone with an untested, untrimed, throws off, CG probably off and a poorly tuned engine is an almost certain death warrant.

Barwelle I am sure you are feeling persecuted now but I can only say that no one wants you to fail and disappear which is the usual result. Its the desire to keep you involved and become a successful member of the fraternity is absolutely the reason folks are "Hammering on you".

John

Fastsky: the local club has a grass strip, so for my first few flights, that power'd be good, i guess. after my first few flights, i'll be flying on a hard-packed dirt strip (I live on a farm and we have this patch we drive on all fall/winter/spring to feed the cows, so grass never grows there... ) so i shouldn't need as much... maybe after awhile i would be able to take off with 3/4 throttle!! long time before i try that tho...


Dicksoucy: Good point. That (and RCKen's comment) drove home the fact that i should, atleast for my first few flights, fly on the buddybox at the club.

Dreadhea: Well, its too late now... its nearly done. good idea though!! I was just checking my plane, to see if your idea would work. If i could do it, it would still be a very tight fit... the needlevalve is connected to the backplate with a C-shaped piece of metal that goes under the valve and then straight across to the backplate, so there would be very little room for movement. check yours before you do that. I have an Evolution .46NT, i dont know how close your motor is to that, but just make sure the needlevalve wont restrict it from the bottom too.

John: yea, i feel like everyone is hammering me!! but i'm getting some stuff out of all this. im glad RCKen and Dicksoucy told their tales, i certainly wouldnt want that happening to me. I was thinking of wearing gloves while i did adjustments (I want to break it in on my own, but i wont fly it on my own) but now that I think of it (and with RCKen's tale, thanks, ken) even with tight-fitting gloves, it'll probly make my chances of injury higher.

The only thing i want to say to make me feel like not such an idiot for thinking about flyin on my own... is that the Wrights flew their planes untrimmed, amateurly-tested, with throws that im sure were either inadequate or overadequate, and an engine that was likely 1. underpowered, 2. overweight, 3. unreliable, 4. poorly-tuned for performance in the air. am i right?