I hope that you are misinterpreting what is going on & that you are just a bit intimidated by these guys, who perhaps don't intend to be hogs or jerks.

However, if they truly are hogs & jerks you have a couple of choices --

1) go somewhere else

2) build a SPAD & fly where you want -- your investment will be a handfull of dollars & theirs could be thousands. Don't try to hit them, but if it happens -- c'est la vie -- you win, they lose big-time. A couple of good mid-airs will deter them, if not change them into human beings.

I will deny offering this advice.

Great topic and it is good that it comes up every once and a while.

The issue is bigger than just allowing new pilots time in the air. It applies to us seasoned flyers as well and (depending on your field layout) how planes and helis share the air.

When I fly, there are guys in the club that I just will not go up when they are up. They aren't rude or inconsiderate. They may be a little loose in following the pattern or other similar flying habits. Watching out for them makes for an unenjoyable flight for me so I'll wait, then go up. No big deal.

There are some highly skilled and impressive flyers in the club as well. I'll wait for them too or at least take up a separate part of the airspace. It is enjoyable to watch an airplane fly in the hands of a truly good flyer and I can't do that when I am in the air as well.

I think those that are doing maidens and other shake out flights also deserve a little courtesy as well. The other club members want to help and also encourage a new plane in the air so we'll wait.

If a newbie is up, then most of us wait. The distraction of another plane taxiing out and taking off can make a new flyer uncomfortable. I have no issue with that. It is great to watch new flyers as they learn more and grow as pilots. Now if a newbie goes up when there are others in the air, then they accept that there is traffic and should be skilled enough to fly the pattern and not be bothered by other planes doing the same.

It may sound like all I do is wait at the field. Well certainly I am not the kind of flyer that flys, lands, fuels, flys, etc. I do enjoy the social parts of the hobby and I do get plenty of opportunty to fly. I do not recall ever leaving the field thinking that I didn't fly as much as I had wanted to.

For the most part, I too am afforded the above courtesies. When I flew the Sopwith Pup, most others waited and watched the less that usual kind of plane in the air. When another flying buddy and I would take up the Pup and Fokker or the two Eindeckers we had, we were given the sky to ourselves. Just last weekend when we went up with his WACO and my Giant Aeromaster (both equiped with smoke), we were also given the whole sky. But when I'm just sport flying around, then it is an "all skate."

A little common sense, courtesy towards your mates, and modest guidelines from the club would go a long way. If your field isn't flying that way, then at least it should come up at a club meeting. Not as a vicious hollering match but just to review whatever guidelines are in place.

Happy Landings....

[link=http://www.wings-of-valor.net/uploads/media/SmokeDreams.wmv]"Smoke Dreams" (40Mb)[/link]

went to the field today although this is the middle of the week had it all to myself. if someone bugs you try to find a day or time thats off peak hours then you have all the time you need usually most fields have the week day regulars they are usually not as pressed for time and not as pushy for flight times obviously depends on work but it pays to be an opportunist

I would echo the sentiment that you shouldn't automatically assume that veteran flyers are intentionally trying to freeze you out. Some of the best flyers at the clubs I belong to are simply not all that social. They love to fly, but they're not so great with people. They hang out and do their own thing, and they don't often take the time to mix with folks they don't really know.

If your frequency is open and the club's airfield isn't closed for a special event, you have every right to fly. Everyone has a responsibility to watch out for the other guy, and as long as everyone is flying the same pattern, it's pretty easy to avoid one another. I have flown on training nights when we've had eight planes in the air at once, nobody hit anybody else, and it was a ton of fun. Mid-airs often occur when there are only two planes in the air, ironically enough.

The trouble occurs when different styles of flight take place at the same time. Trainer flight, sport flying, and pattern flying can co-exist quite peacefully. Helicopters and 3D flyers can take to the sky together with nary an issue. Trying to combine hovering flyers with folks flying ovals is when the tension normally mounts. If the hoverers stick to one half of the field, the oval flyers can try to stick to the other half of the sky and still co-mingle without any incidents.

If I were flying at a field where I pay dues and folks were taking up the whole field and I felt a bit crowded, I'd probably go ahead and take off while flying in "my" area of my own designation. I'd trust that the other folks who flew through that area felt comfortable that they could avoid me, while folks who weren't comfortable that they could avoid me would naturally migrate away toward the other end of the field. Is it possible that some irrational ass could come over and yell at me for poaching a piece of his sky? Maybe, but it would be pretty funny to hear their explanation for why they can fly but I'm not supposed to.

The simple truth is that the sky is a pretty big place. Two pilots could spend all day playing "tag" and never hit each other. Mid-air collisions happen, but they are usually flukes of random chance. As long as all of the pilots are aware of one another and fly safely by avoiding the flight line and pit area as well as calling out take-offs and landings, you can run a lot of different planes flying different styles in the same air space without any trouble.

Last but not least, if the worst does occur, I always take comfort in the knowledge that I never fly a plane that I can't afford to lose. Hopefully these thoughts are of some help.

You still gonna look for another hobby Tazzyboy?

Has anyone noticed that Tazzyboy hasn't been back to this thread? Anyway, just hold your ground and ignore them. You will have to learn to fly with other planes in the air and it's a good practice to do so. I'm an instructor at my field and I prefer to take pilots up when there is traffic. However at our field, people know to yield. I can't figure out why they don't do that at yours.

rednecks last words...hey watch this

Club ettiquite? What's that? [&:]

Being one of the younger members to a club of mainly 50+ year old folks, people treat me as a new pilot. One time, me and Sun_Kissed_Girl and her instructor went out to go retrieve a landing gear that fell off her Nexstar and her instructor yelled, "We are going on the Runway!!!" to the spotter and he approved after talking to the pilots. Well, we got the gear back and were about 400 feet from the pits, and in the middle of the runway headed toward the far side of the runway, when we see this airplane on final comming straight toward us! SKG's instructor yells at the pilot, who barley misses hitting any of us. Then, as we were walking on the side of the runway toward the pits, the same guy is on final AGAIN and headed toward us again. The spotter yells at him and he goes around and we jog back to the pits. Keep in mind this pilot also hogs the sky, does really fast really loud fly bys, and has little respect for anyone else. If I did such a thing, I would've gotten my membership card ripped up, but that guy still flies with us. One time, the club president said there was a heli at the end of the runway, but I could not see it and I was on final on the other side of the runway. I planted the airplane to avoid hitting the heli. I also planted a foamie because I was flying in restricted airspace (but I didn't know that at the time since it wasn't restricted the weekend before) and did not want to endanger anyone. And you have this guy who nearly hit three people with a airplane.

I agree with everyone that every club has a few jerks. No one flys with this guy anymore after he nearly hit the only female member of our club with an airplane.

I am still with the club but I WILL not be flying!!

HMMM, you used Caps on WILL, perhaps somewhere deep in your subconcious your mind is telling you something different
I wish you the best in whatever you choose.

last time I checked texas was a pretty big state. there is sure to be another club to join, if not form your own. in our area there are a few clubs and alot of our members belong to several for the variety of people and styles of flying.

Pretty big state, with LOTS of nothing between the cities.
bigtim, there's really only two clubs in that area, plus some PF action from what I remember. The clubs mix pretty freely, so mostly the same people.

I've flown there when I went back on leave (and at the Midland club too), and never had any problems, everyone was friendly and willing to share the air. The nice thing about west Texas, is that there's lots of it. If you can't cope at the club, pick a spot at least a few miles away, and do your own thing. I did for years when I was growing up there, not knowing that there were any clubs. I wish I had - it would have been nice to fly with other like-minded people, and would have been a huge help.

sounds pretty resonable to me as long as you are at least 5 miles from a active flying field so you dont shoot somone down find a place to hang by yourself or with a couple of friends you like to fly with. fortunitly I belong to a great club the members were great to me when I was just getting back into flying it is the benifit of having somone to teach you the little things you otherwise miss and to help like when your trimming your plane for its first flights something that is nearly impossable for a beginer