i burned a gallon of nitro last summer and fall in my goldberg eagle 2, and plan on burning lots more this spring and summer. as i am learning more on my trainer i will be building a sig 4 star for my second plane. before i fly it i would like to know what maneuvers i sould be able to do. right now i can fly in a circle and do loops.

Any thing your eagle 2 can handle. Loops, rolls, spins, rolling circles, and also turn around manuvers like a split s or a hammerhead turn.

Stick 40

Inverted flight, Immelman, figure 8, roll, Cuban 8, hammerhead, split S, are a few that can be done on a 4 channel trainer.

You should be able to fly with complete confidence as far as straight and level as well as landings. If you learn to do loops and rolls then that is a plus. You should be able to do touch and go's with pure presicion. Your Eagle 2 as well as the 4 Star are limited in what they will do, however they will teach you to be a RC pilot. Good Luck, Dave

Dave's advice is good. There is a distinct difference between keeping a plane airborne and flying well.

Google aresti for some moves to try. The humpty bump is a good one to practice your uplines and downlines which require rudder input to keep on track.

Also - three mistakes high is a good place to be when figuring stuff out.

Good luck!

somegeek

when i have tried to fly inverted i have to fight the plane becouse i have to go full down elevator and it still goes nose down plus ti aslo tries to roll back upright on its own to do the dihedral. i flow it strait into the gown trying to keep it inverted. (i geuss at some point i should have quit fighting it an rolled it over. to save it from the ground.)

Your description of needing full down elevator while inverted makes me think the model may be too nose heavy. If you have an instructor or other skilled pilot available, ask if they will fly it and see if the battery needs to be moved back to adjust the CG.

A note of caution. If you do adjust the CG rearward, the elevator will become much more sensitive. It will almost seem like you've gotten a new plane. You might even consider asking for a buddy box flight, or two, just so there is a safety net in case it seems too sensitive at first.

So sorry to here about your "unplanned inverted landing". Don't be discouraged, you're in the steep learning curve, now. This is where the real fun starts. Assuming you still have an airplane, here are some things you can check. Make sure the wing and horizontal tail incidences (angles) are correct. Engine thrust angles come into play as well. The more you learn, the more fun you'll have! It's also a question of balance.

Trainers with dihedral don't typically fly that well inverted. If you learn to fly a trainer with dihedral inverted and do it well, you will do great when you move to a mid-mount symetrical wing plane.

somegeek

Even harder to fly inverted is a trainer with perm flaps installed .

Take a look at this. It describes the pattern sequences used in competition for the beginner NSRCA level (Sportsman category).

http://nsrca.us/documents/judging/PPT_Sportsman2007.pdf

Of course, the very first thing you really need to do, as already pointed out, is to fly straight and level with "hands off" the transmitter, then land straight and down the center line. Basic maneuvers are covered in the above link (loops, rolls, and so on).

CGr.

Probably not. Trainers by design (typically) have a flat bottom air foil that produces a lot of lift. This is why when we trim them for 1/2 throttle, they will climb with higher throttle settings. And yes, they are set nose heavy for stability. They have small control surfaces to counteract the overcontrolling student.

Combine these design factors and you end up with a plane that really doesn't want to fly inverted, and when it is, it will very much want to produce downward "lift".

This is why aerobatic planes typically have little or no dihedral and symmetrical air foils.

The 4 Star will be an excellent next step.

I normally advise my students to learn to recover the trainer from all attitudes, but don't expect to learn aerobatics with it. Its just too frustrating for the beginning pilot. Lessons learned in recovery apply to all planes.

Brad

Not just trainers will climb with added throttle. Trim is adjusted for one throttle setting only. Any changes in throttle will result in some level of altitude change ( more throttle = climb, less throttle = descend). Trainers are most pronounced with this because air speed equals lift and trainers have more 'lift' built in the wing design.

Rolling circles?????

Don't even TRY to do rolling circles. This is a very difficult maneuver to do - even if you have a plane that's designed to do them!

Most trainers will barely do them at best.

Buy as others have said: Loops, Rolls, Immelmans, Split "S", Stall Turns (Hammerheads), and cuban eights. If you can do those, you can do most things.

For learning aerobatics, recognize there are only a few basic maneuvers. Everything then becomes a combination of those basic maneuvers. The basics are:

Straight and level flight (upright and inverted)

Straight up lines and down lines.

Circular loops (not just yanking the elevator)

Aileron rolls (without deviating from the flight path)

Spins

Stalls

Master the basics, then worry about the combinations.

Brad

You burned a whole gallon of fuel last year?

Wow! You got off pretty cheap! I must have went through at least 20.

I like watching new guys in our club fly. They create manuvers that were never even thought of before!



If you like doing manuvers get yourself a sig something extra for your 3rd plane. A fun filled plane to fly!

CGRetired

The link you provided is really neat--printed so I can give copies to our club members at the next meeting. Also will use this when I make a presentation to the new flying club forming at the high school. thanks again
Gene

Not all trainers are created equal. But moving the cg back can make most of the fly better as the novice pilot's skills improve. At the most nose heavy setting, the pitch or climbing is most sensitive to airspeed and throttle setting. This is good if you are looking for self-recovery, but soon most pilots find the ballooning rather annoying.

When the cg is moved back, much of the up trim is removed. This does make flying inverted much easier, and though the dihedral is destabilizing, it is easy to maintain inverted flight with practice, including turns.

My favorite trainer, the Sig LT-40 is even capable of doing outside loops while balanced at the middle of the cg range even with modest power. With the cg moved to the rear of it's range, spins and snap rolls are even possible.

While doing all this practicing, experiment with different props as well. Generally, most trainers respond well with larger diameter and lower pitch props due to their slower airspeeds.

The flight characteristics of trainers can be further changed with modifications to the airframe. Changes to decalage, airfoils, or even different wings can move a trainer from a basic airframe to a more advanced model. But with the explosive growth of RC, a good flying trainer is easily sold if ready to fly.

My pleasure, Gene (Irish.. ).

There is another one I am trying to find that has a little moving RC aircraft performing the maneuvers. It's pretty neat. If I find it, i will post it.

Dick ( CGr )

Ok I feel like an idiot, but what exactly is a spin and or rolling circle? Is a spin like a tight barrel roll but verticle? Is a rolling circle just a barrel roll?

Thanks

Jon

Thanks CGRetired.
Finding things like videos to show the young people at the school is more than difficult. Anything would be appreciated.

A roll is, of course, aileron roll, left or right. Full aileron to one side then the plane rolls 360 degrees (or more if you are not that quick to recover).

A loop is, of course, pull elevator and the nose goes over 360 degrees and back to level flight (yeah, again, more if you are not that quick to recover).

A rolling loop (rolling circle) is a loop with rolls. So, pull elevator then during the elevator loop, aileron rolls take place. Easier said (MUCH easier said) than done. This probably does not describe all the stick action required to do it, but my intent was to show what it is rather than how to do it.

A spin, could be a flat spin, climb to altitude (3 mistakes high is what I always say), then somehow get the plane to stall while it is pointing horizontal, then get it to somehow turn to the left or right without inducing aileron roll. So, the plane remains flat as it rotates about it's center line to the left or right and drops as it is 'flat'. Recovery is rudder in the opposite direction of the spin while adding throttle. It should stop spinning and start flying... should is the operative word here.. [&o] . Again, this is not to show how it is done.

There may be other spins, but that describes a flat spin. I've never done it, nor have I ever done a rolling loop... at least not on purpose..

CGr.

Thank you sir, I have tried to do that on the sim, I need more pratice and the right plane on the sime to use as pratice.

Jon

Yeah.. practice that stuff on the Sim. It's a heart break if you crunch one in while trying to so some odd-ball maneuver. It's much easier to hit the space bar than it is to pack up the trash bag and head for the hobby shop to buy a fresh bottle of CA.. [&o]

CGr

Spins are easily described, but depending on the plane, hard to perform. They are by definition a stalled maneuver. Whether it is flat depends heavily on the balance of your plane.

To perform a spin, slow the plane down and continue adding elevator to hold the nose level. Eventually, one wing tip will stall before the other. This will cause a sudden drop in the nose and the plane banking to the side of the stalled wingtip. Because you are holding up elevator, the plane should begin to rotate toward the side of the stalled wing tip. This induces the rotation around the center of gravity that defines the spin (autorotation).

Adding rudder in the direction of the spin may increase the speed of rotation.

To get out of the spin, release the elevator, rudder and add throttle. Point the nose down if necessary to gain airspeed to exit the stalled condition.

Brad