To TomBates - this winter hasn't been "yucky" for me - cause I learned how to fly in the cold and take off and land on snow - it's AWESOME - I think I might enjoy a snowy runway better than a dry one - just get a "Radio Warm" for your hands and radio, wear long underwear and a hood, and buy skis for your plane and you're set. Best of all - MUCH less competition for a snow-covered field on the weekends!

Was flying my new 70" Revolver (with a .91 OS 2S) this morning in the Bronx - was at the field at 6am. Unfortunately, the snow was patchy - did manage one good landing - had to weave a bit around some grassy areas (keeps it exciting). On the second landing, though, I didn't miss that last grassy spot - the skis caught and it flipped the plane onto it's back, like a turtle. Nut much damage, though. Just two broken control horns and some mud. Hopefully we'll get another 2" of snow tonight and I'll be flying there again in tomorrow morning. Otherwise will be transitioning back to wheels.

btw - Real Flight 4.5 is excellent - WELL worth the $200.

How do the gun guys say it? "I'll quit flyin when you pry my cold dead fingers from around my radio!". 
Seriously bud, as long as you are havin fun with it....keep on keepin on.
Just filled qith cliches, aint I.
I'm not a very good pilot either, but I love being out at the field on a warm summer day, watchin the sun go down in the evening sky.  My club flies at a field in the valley with Lookout Mountain for a backdrop. 
Try to find a way to keep your costs within what you find affordable and enjoy the day. 

I would like to thank everyone again this has gave me second thoughs about giveing up.
One thing MICRODON2 we already had our snow storm for the year down here in Texas so i don't think I'll try to land on snow but thanks anyway.HA HA HA.

As long as you're enjoying what you are doing and you are not spending money that you should be spending for beer, don't give up.[]

Hey - nothing wrong with sacrificing a few beers for that new lightset, if it let's you fly into the dusk...

Don't give up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I learned [kinda] to fly at 64, in 2008. Crashed many times and had some medical problems including severe depression so I quit in Sept of 08 after way too many crashes [packed my stuff into my cargo trailer and didn't even look at it]. After retiring in Jan 2009 I started thinking about getting back into flying. I joined a different club and went flying with the only plane I had that I thought I could fly, a Sig Something Extra [not the best trainer ] but it was all I had and couldn't afford a new trainer so I got one of the trainers at my club to help me tone down the controls and flew on a buddy cord for about six days. Prior to this every time I went to fly, I was so anxious that all I could think about was crashing but this time with a new trainer I felt more confident and was able to overcome most of my problems. I started flying again this last Nov and have flown once or twice a week [except for bad weather] every week. I have crashed my Something Extra but that was because I was trying to learn to fly in some high winds. Although still my responsability, I was making a trun to final with a cross wind when a very large guest picked my plane up and put it on it's back, with more experience I probably could have saved it but I learned and it did not destroy my confidence. I am currently rebuilding the SSE.

Don't give up, if I can do it I feel confident that you can too.

Gary

First... Have a good trainer aircraft... not a $70 cheapee.... Sig Senior or Telemaster or LT 40.... Second... a nice engine... O.s. 46 FX up to 70 Four stroke... Power helps the instructor recover an aircraft going down... Third... At our age you need an instructor that helps you fly and prevents crashes.... an instructor that says I wanted to see if you could save it needs to be using his airplane to teach... (There are a bunch of guys that will let you crash)....

Fourth or should this be FIRST..... Have fun, be relaxed and fly.... Fifth and last... concentrate on your flying... do not look around... do not talk except to the instructor and do not let anyone push you past your abilities .... unless again they want you to fly their airplane...

several good comments have been suggested... have fun and only look at your airplane and discourage those that want to see you crash... there is always one at the flying field... break a few props... fix the airplane and fly fly fly... you will be glad you did... there are so many great guys out there that want to help you... look for them .... you will be glad you did....

I think a lot of people are overlooking why someone would be breaking props and generally crashing. As stated before, its either the instructor isn't teaching very well or the student isn't listening or is freezing when the plane is a couple of feet off the deck. I am an instructor in my club and from what I've read, I know exactly what is being done wrong.

For starters, the breaking of props is because you are coming down on the nose which means you aren't flaring or you are running out of elevator and cannot flare anymore causing you to sink too fast. Anytime I see a trike plane bouncing on its landings its usually because they are coming down on the nose gear as opposed to touching the mains first.

When you are coming in for a landing, your nose should always be positive (not by much). You control your decent with the throttle. While keeping the nose positive, you should start moving into a good glide decent. If you are sinking too fast, just burp the throttle for a second or two and then resume your landing approach. Most people just bring their throttle down to idle and coast in. While this can work, it doesn't always look like a perfect landing.

Generally, your instructor should know when he/she needs to take control of the plane and prevent a crash. Of course, when it comes time to make that final landing, you just have to trust yourself and relax. Too many times have my students crash on their landing because they just freeze up and decide to let it land no matter what. You cannot always save a plane from a student when they are 2 feet off the deck.

When it comes to my students, I make them do semi-slow speed passes down the runway. This is a prelude to teaching them how to use the rudder to control their direction and to feel comfortable with the plane moving so slow since the controls are a little more sluggish. Each pass is done lower and lower until they are about 10 feet off the deck. If they can fly straight down the runway and a 1/4 throttle and aren't making any mistakes, only then are they allowed to make a landing attempt.

My advice is to try a different instructor. I remember the guy who trained me. He would break at least 4 props every flying day and he was supposed to be the instructor. It wasn't until I soloed and learned the proper way to fly before I could instruct others. There are a lot of people with a big heart who will give up their time to train, but doesn't always mean they should be training.

Excellent post, chilie[sm=thumbs_up.gif][sm=thumbs_up.gif]

No visible progress leads to frustration.

There is no reason to force landings if the student is not ready for landings, but that decision is up to the instructor, and the learning speed is as individual as our names.

When to stop trying?

Stop trying to do things wrong? Right now!

Stop trying to advance one small step each day? No reason to think about it.

Trying to learn one small trick, maneuver, how-to or skill is what most of us do in each flying session.
Some have good input and advice from others, some don't.

"Never, Never, Never, Never give up", Winston Churchill

<font class="sqq">&ldquo;Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never - in nothing, great or small, large or petty - never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense&rdquo;, Winston Churchill.</font>

2 Chronicles 15:7 "But as for you, be strong and do not give up, for your work will be rewarded."

Some of the biggest successors in life/history also started as huge failures (numerous times). Our society doesnt do enough to encourge to get past failures.

I have a truckload of flying errors in my basement, infact refuse to give the number but now have this abundant collection of parts. Learning to fly is really an amazing feat. Flying a Glider I often give the controls to an intrested bystander, increadible how some have a natural feel for this, while myself and majority overcontrol to oblivian especially at the start.

My landings are pure crap especially during the maiden of a new model trainer or not, just my weak link.

But alas, finally flying certain models and is a huge difference on the handlings of others that failed at least for me.

Trust me there is a ray of hope, its simply your determination, hang in there and defintely you'll make it.

I ditto the correct instructor would not let you crash and take over the controls long before any misshaps, likely do need another helper indeed !

My fame came with the popular Super Cub, tape fixed this bugger countless times and flew better than ever, its a beginner dream machine.

I will give some sort of progression, but such a vast assorment of models out there varys with every flyer matching their skills..

My favored todate in order of learning...

1. This dang powered mini Air Hogs biplane, hard to find now, but are prolific with powered flyers, will give important orientation, $30!
2. The Super Cub, Later Night Flights, 200 flights of nothing but abuse and still tape fixed, a wonder !
3. Stryker B, no not the fast C, elevons, flying wing gave some feel for ailerons
4. Trojan, amazing low wing, but landing gear weak, still 100 plus flights, gentle bird, loved it
5. Hangar 9 T34 Mentor, Wow, tho balsa, best plane flown todate, progressive settings, with droops, flaps etc, my best lander, amazing
6. Nexstar Mini trainer, rather quick, love it
7. Eflite Alpha 40 Sport, more trainer like, bigger ship, nice handling, pure fun, flys terrific, maybe I'm learning !

Pssst the Mentor is my biggest investment todate, I let it land during warm weather in the grass where ever it wishes, no crimping space into a curb or post here, too nice a ship, huge wheels handels grass beautifully, its my current winner hands down !!

Yes please get a flight simulator, no excuse, even the lowly Free FMS gives loads of feel on the screen, hit reset instead of fixing or replacing the model, if you want cheap this is it, still use mine, other sims better but have at least this one, $25 w/control get It !!!!

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXSJR9

Please keep us posted and hang in there, just patience, I'm still making mistakes and learn something each flight, gotta love it !!

I have had the privilege to teach several men our age to fly and I would say that if you are only flying for six months and you are shooting landings you are doing fine. I've seen men spend years and not get to that point. Take pride in what you can do and if your club is like our two clubs here you currently fly better than most members who sit on the bench and give advice about things they can't do themselves.

'Round here we don't let people stop using a trainer until they can fly it with total proficiency. Yes, I know, the wind blows and the flat bottom airfoil of the trainer is a nuisance but the trainer is more forgiving and is called a trainer for a reason. I do loops, rolls, stall turns and other acrobatics with the student's plane just to prove it can do it. I'd say that without even discussing it with your instructor that is the only plane you should show up with ready to fly.

Now, as to those broken props, you are comiting the same error every single person I have ever trained has done. You stop flying before the wheels are rolling. It must be a psychological thing that everyone suffers. The plane gets down to five or six feet off the ground and you figure you have nailed it and you can relax. The many things the instructor has told you about lining up the landing have been accomplished and you just want to savor success. You figure that with the engine at idle and the correct line up it should just settle in. However, as you have found out by experiment that is not what happens. Without power the plane slows and without you constantly feeding in increasing amounts of up to keep the nose from dipping it will drop the nose and you will break out the nose wheel and maybe break a prop. You will ask around and the guys will tell you to buy a $20 Fults nose gear so it doesn't bend so much. They have given poor advice. The good advice is to keep flying the plane until the wheels are rolling on the ground. I stand next to people and keep saying, Keep flying it. . .keep the nose up , keep flying it. . ., keep flying it. . ." You will have to do that for yourself.

So Luker737.....whats the verdict for now buddy?  Sounds to me like the majority wants you to keep trying.  How do you feel about it?

I would have any guy who can tie his shoes, chew gum and see well enough to drive to the field solo'd in a day............ but not with some lead sled, 6.5 pound ARF "trainer".

That kind of plane can come later. It's too much, too soon for a lot of guys and when disaster strikes it's too bitter of a pill to swallow.

Some guys need to start out with single digit wing loadings and stay with those type of planes until they can land them on a dime, then "move up" in wing loading gradually......if going to heavier models is the plan.

Well guys I went to the field today got my trainer all set up buddy cord and a new trainer. Guess what got the plane up three times and I landed it two times myself had a great day flying. Brought the plane home with no damage and didn't have to replace any props.I just throught y'all woud like to know.

CONGRATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Knew us old guys still had it in us....

Yes! Well done! I know the feeling and I think it is awesome.

Now it all just gets better and better and then sucks a massive hole in your wallet!

Yes, we love to know of your progress. Luker; congratulations!

Now, a little bit of theory never killed anybody.

Check this article out:

http://www.masportaviator.com/ah.asp?CatID=8&ID=20

Besides the new instructor, and the obvious lack of crashing and broken props, what else did you differantly?  Did the instructor tell or show you something differant that made all the differance?  If so, it sounds like it would be something you definatly do not want to forget.  Writing it out here may help you to fully understand what you learned.

Excellent news. I figured you where just trying to learn on the wrong plane.
Id like to hear more details as well.
Cheers.

Oh man, that first day driving home with the plane in the same amount of pieces, it was on the drive out to the field...I remember well how good that felt !

Yes I remember that day also, I was on cloud nine! I had to wait so long in my life to get to that point with everything I had to do like get my daughters raised by myself after their mother left. The day I soloed was a very proud day in my life! The biggest problem getting the huge head I had back into the pickup! I am a lifer now in this hobby and have many planes and plans for more, met many great folks, well enough said got to get back on the Spitfire installing the engine now a big Saito. Well we all can hear it in his words, He's hooked!

http://www.masportaviator.com/ try this web site for "instructing " and read up on how to instruct. save the pages to your favorites. This will let YOU know what to ask your instructor. It will also let you know WHY he has you do certain things at certain times. Takes a lot of frustration OUT of the equation when you know your normal...ok you fly toy planes so normal may be a poor choice of terms[8D]

do the tool bar at the top of this RCU for rcuniverity then begginers then airplane then landing tips.

Fly at a throttle click or three above stall speed and do fly bys at 10 feet above the runway as STRAIT AS YOU CAN DOWN THE MIDDLE over and over with a go around the pattern each time.
Goal is to set up your approach CONSITENTLY this is exactly the same as landing but without the final touch down. It will get you comfortable with how the plane handles at low throttle/airspeed. IT IS QUITE DIFFERENT. You will get there! and in a year or so you could be teaching someone...make that SHOULD be teaching someone

Hey - part of the thrill of flying each day is pushing yourself just a little bit more - which requires risk. But it's also exciting. Feels great when you start nailing a maneuver on a new plane. And it's always a good day when you come home without major damage.

I've been trying to fly since the early 1980's. Got pretty good at it for a while then got away from the flying and just did building.
I have been flying a trainer for the last3 or 4seasons and also flying my first electric.....a corsair.
I manage to wreck one or the other each time I go out to the field. So I am always fixing something, but I'm still flying the same old planes.
Replaced nose gear on the trainer 2 times now. Lots of props broken. But, It is fun. Wood for repairs isn't that costly and props, what the heck, ya need them to fly.
Don't give up.........I'm 78 years old and still enjoying it.
If you crash a plane just remember it is just wood or foam. Nothing to worry about.
Have fun.