TH KAOS MOD'S
05-09-2008, 12:01 PM
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TH KAOS MOD'S
What Mod's would you make to a towerhobbies Kaos to fly better and have a personal look?
I have one NIB I 'd like to assamble, but would like to hear your opinions.
I 've already flown one and was balanced well t for example on knive edege's plane sinks heavy, rolls are awfull wide even with differential setup , plane was flying with OS 46AX and APC 11 / 7.
Some mod's I want to make are enlarge rudder 1" , change ailerons to 1 - 3/4 " , engine to 45° instead of 90°, any ideas ?
Thanks for your help.
Rafa
I have one NIB I 'd like to assamble, but would like to hear your opinions.
I 've already flown one and was balanced well t for example on knive edege's plane sinks heavy, rolls are awfull wide even with differential setup , plane was flying with OS 46AX and APC 11 / 7.
Some mod's I want to make are enlarge rudder 1" , change ailerons to 1 - 3/4 " , engine to 45° instead of 90°, any ideas ?
Thanks for your help.
Rafa
05-09-2008, 02:03 PM
#2
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
ORIGINAL: alcarafa
What Mod's would you make to a towerhobbies Kaos to fly better and have a personal look?
I have one NIB I 'd like to assamble, but would like to hear your opinions.
I 've already flown one and was balanced well t for example on knive edege's plane sinks heavy, rolls are awfull wide even with differential setup , plane was flying with OS 46AX and APC 11 / 7.
Some mod's I want to make are enlarge rudder 1" , change ailerons to 1 - 3/4 " , engine to 45° instead of 90°, any ideas ?
Thanks for your help.
Rafa
What Mod's would you make to a towerhobbies Kaos to fly better and have a personal look?
I have one NIB I 'd like to assamble, but would like to hear your opinions.
I 've already flown one and was balanced well t for example on knive edege's plane sinks heavy, rolls are awfull wide even with differential setup , plane was flying with OS 46AX and APC 11 / 7.
Some mod's I want to make are enlarge rudder 1" , change ailerons to 1 - 3/4 " , engine to 45° instead of 90°, any ideas ?
Thanks for your help.
Rafa
-
The Kaos needs to fly fast to stand a chance at performing decent knife-edge. The 11x7 prop is slowing the model down considerably. Replace it with an APC 10x6 or 10x7. You will not over rev this engine, so don't worry. It is designed to scream. A tuned pipe, or a Jett or Ultrathrust muffler would also help considerably. Using the latter two choices, run the 10x6, or possibly a 10x5. Let that engine yell. Don't be afraid to drop down in pitch a bit. You can always switch back. The Jett and Ultrathrust mufflers are designed and built to run within a certain rpm range. Think of them as a musical instrument with non adjustable pitch. You can jockey the glow plug, fuel, prop and mixture to get the engine to run where the muffler (non adjustable) is tuned. That is where your model will fly its best in knife-edge and point maneuvers. Trimming weight from the ARF is another good way to improve these flight regimes.
If your model is rolling wide even with the differential going the right way, chances are your wing incidence is a bit too positive. The Kaos will fly correctly with 0 to 1/2 degree of positive incidence. Don't be afraid to move the balance point back a skosh at a time, starting with the model balancing on the main spar.
Check your engine's thrust setting. No down or up thrust. This is a zero-zero model.
Ed Cregger
05-09-2008, 02:50 PM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
The Kaos isn't known for it's knife edge characteristics. Not because of the size of the rudder but because of the small side area. Notice that the rudder does a fine job of picking the nose up in knife edge but it still sinks. Just not enough lift.
If you want to modify it to improve knife edge you need side area. Maybe a long turtle deck and forward canopy like on the Ultra Sport.
I agree with Ed on the prop, I run my .46 AX and .46 SF with APC 10x6s and they sing. He's right about the CG too. Keep moving the CG back until your vertical dives are truly vertical. Then trim out the remaining coupling with mixing.
Rolls should be great and shouldn't need differential. Work the elevator a little and you should be able to do rolls in a straight line from horizon to horizon.
Dave
If you want to modify it to improve knife edge you need side area. Maybe a long turtle deck and forward canopy like on the Ultra Sport.
I agree with Ed on the prop, I run my .46 AX and .46 SF with APC 10x6s and they sing. He's right about the CG too. Keep moving the CG back until your vertical dives are truly vertical. Then trim out the remaining coupling with mixing.
Rolls should be great and shouldn't need differential. Work the elevator a little and you should be able to do rolls in a straight line from horizon to horizon.
Dave
05-10-2008, 01:09 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
ORIGINAL: Ed Cregger
The Kaos needs to fly fast to stand a chance at performing decent knife-edge. The 11x7 prop is slowing the model down considerably. Replace it with an APC 10x6 or 10x7. You will not over rev this engine, so don't worry. It is designed to scream. A tuned pipe, or a Jett or Ultrathrust muffler would also help considerably. Using the latter two choices, run the 10x6, or possibly a 10x5. Let that engine yell. Don't be afraid to drop down in pitch a bit. You can always switch back. The Jett and Ultrathrust mufflers are designed and built to run within a certain rpm range. Think of them as a musical instrument with non adjustable pitch. You can jockey the glow plug, fuel, prop and mixture to get the engine to run where the muffler (non adjustable) is tuned. That is where your model will fly its best in knife-edge and point maneuvers. Trimming weight from the ARF is another good way to improve these flight regimes.
If your model is rolling wide even with the differential going the right way, chances are your wing incidence is a bit too positive. The Kaos will fly correctly with 0 to 1/2 degree of positive incidence. Don't be afraid to move the balance point back a skosh at a time, starting with the model balancing on the main spar.
Check your engine's thrust setting. No down or up thrust. This is a zero-zero model.
Ed Cregger
The Kaos needs to fly fast to stand a chance at performing decent knife-edge. The 11x7 prop is slowing the model down considerably. Replace it with an APC 10x6 or 10x7. You will not over rev this engine, so don't worry. It is designed to scream. A tuned pipe, or a Jett or Ultrathrust muffler would also help considerably. Using the latter two choices, run the 10x6, or possibly a 10x5. Let that engine yell. Don't be afraid to drop down in pitch a bit. You can always switch back. The Jett and Ultrathrust mufflers are designed and built to run within a certain rpm range. Think of them as a musical instrument with non adjustable pitch. You can jockey the glow plug, fuel, prop and mixture to get the engine to run where the muffler (non adjustable) is tuned. That is where your model will fly its best in knife-edge and point maneuvers. Trimming weight from the ARF is another good way to improve these flight regimes.
If your model is rolling wide even with the differential going the right way, chances are your wing incidence is a bit too positive. The Kaos will fly correctly with 0 to 1/2 degree of positive incidence. Don't be afraid to move the balance point back a skosh at a time, starting with the model balancing on the main spar.
Check your engine's thrust setting. No down or up thrust. This is a zero-zero model.
Ed Cregger
I have also a GMS muffler that fits ok with both engines, it significantly enhances the performance of engines and gives me much more confidence.
With regard to ailerons you believe it is a good idea to increase them to 1 - 3/4 "? the originals measured 1 - 1 / 4 ".
I also want to buid a turtle deck like Dave mentioned, I know this is going to be a lot of work but I just love this plane
.dbacque what do you exactly mean by "Work the elevator a little " is that something like rainedave suggested ?.
David thanks for you comment also, I will consider your point, anything that helps fly better I'll try it, by the way I havent have the time to continue building any of my scratch projects a kaos & mach one... but wait [X(] I forget I also have a curare and all of them waiting their turn... [&o]
Regards to all you.
Rafa
05-10-2008, 01:25 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
ORIGINAL: rainedave
It would be some work, but you could make a built-up, symmetrical stab like I did for my Super Kaos Jr. I was told by a current pattern plane designer that it would help tame the tail wag.
David
It would be some work, but you could make a built-up, symmetrical stab like I did for my Super Kaos Jr. I was told by a current pattern plane designer that it would help tame the tail wag.
David
-
What tail wag? <G>
Ed Cregger
05-10-2008, 07:47 AM
#7
RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
Alcarafa, I have the Tower Kaos & flew it for a year with an OS .40 LA. It was an OK flier with the .40 but ended up at full throttle most of the time. Over the winter months i got bored and decided to recover it and install a OS 55AX. It flies fantastic with the 55. The only mods i made to the plane were to finish off the nose section & blend in that area twds the spinner. I also moved the canopy fwd approx 1.5" because mine did the Kaos tail wag with the canopy in its stock location. After moveing it fwd the wag has dissappeared. I use the plane as a practice plane to fly my IMAC sequences at a field where my larger gas models are not as welcome. I am not a seasoned pattern flyer, but for a $99 ARF with a little work it sure flies great. Hope you get as much enjoyment out of yours as i do mine. I will have it with me at the Vintage R/C event in North Carolina this month......Gene
05-10-2008, 08:22 AM
#8
RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
ORIGINAL: alcarafa
What Mod's would you make to a towerhobbies Kaos to fly better and have a personal look?
I have one NIB I 'd like to assamble, but would like to hear your opinions.
I 've already flown one and was balanced well t for example on knive edege's plane sinks heavy, rolls are awfull wide even with differential setup , plane was flying with OS 46AX and APC 11 / 7.
Some mod's I want to make are enlarge rudder 1" , change ailerons to 1 - 3/4 " , engine to 45° instead of 90°, any ideas ?
Thanks for your help.
Rafa
What Mod's would you make to a towerhobbies Kaos to fly better and have a personal look?
I have one NIB I 'd like to assamble, but would like to hear your opinions.
I 've already flown one and was balanced well t for example on knive edege's plane sinks heavy, rolls are awfull wide even with differential setup , plane was flying with OS 46AX and APC 11 / 7.
Some mod's I want to make are enlarge rudder 1" , change ailerons to 1 - 3/4 " , engine to 45° instead of 90°, any ideas ?
Thanks for your help.
Rafa
This link might be helpful http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_37...tm.htm#3735219
05-10-2008, 09:07 AM
#10
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
ORIGINAL: alcarafa
Ed txs for your comments , I do have a OS 55AX NIB would this be a better choice ? could I run a 10x6 prop with it also?
I have also a GMS muffler that fits ok with both engines, it significantly enhances the performance of engines and gives me much more confidence.
With regard to ailerons you believe it is a good idea to increase them to 1 - 3/4 "? the originals measured 1 - 1 / 4 ".
I also want to buid a turtle deck like Dave mentioned, I know this is going to be a lot of work but I just love this plane .
dbacque what do you exactly mean by "Work the elevator a little " is that something like rainedave suggested ?.
David thanks for you comment also, I will consider your point, anything that helps fly better I'll try it, by the way I havent have the time to continue building any of my scratch projects a kaos & mach one... but wait [X(] I forget I also have a curare and all of them waiting their turn... [&o]
Regards to all you.
Rafa
ORIGINAL: Ed Cregger
The Kaos needs to fly fast to stand a chance at performing decent knife-edge. The 11x7 prop is slowing the model down considerably. Replace it with an APC 10x6 or 10x7. You will not over rev this engine, so don't worry. It is designed to scream. A tuned pipe, or a Jett or Ultrathrust muffler would also help considerably. Using the latter two choices, run the 10x6, or possibly a 10x5. Let that engine yell. Don't be afraid to drop down in pitch a bit. You can always switch back. The Jett and Ultrathrust mufflers are designed and built to run within a certain rpm range. Think of them as a musical instrument with non adjustable pitch. You can jockey the glow plug, fuel, prop and mixture to get the engine to run where the muffler (non adjustable) is tuned. That is where your model will fly its best in knife-edge and point maneuvers. Trimming weight from the ARF is another good way to improve these flight regimes.
If your model is rolling wide even with the differential going the right way, chances are your wing incidence is a bit too positive. The Kaos will fly correctly with 0 to 1/2 degree of positive incidence. Don't be afraid to move the balance point back a skosh at a time, starting with the model balancing on the main spar.
Check your engine's thrust setting. No down or up thrust. This is a zero-zero model.
Ed Cregger
The Kaos needs to fly fast to stand a chance at performing decent knife-edge. The 11x7 prop is slowing the model down considerably. Replace it with an APC 10x6 or 10x7. You will not over rev this engine, so don't worry. It is designed to scream. A tuned pipe, or a Jett or Ultrathrust muffler would also help considerably. Using the latter two choices, run the 10x6, or possibly a 10x5. Let that engine yell. Don't be afraid to drop down in pitch a bit. You can always switch back. The Jett and Ultrathrust mufflers are designed and built to run within a certain rpm range. Think of them as a musical instrument with non adjustable pitch. You can jockey the glow plug, fuel, prop and mixture to get the engine to run where the muffler (non adjustable) is tuned. That is where your model will fly its best in knife-edge and point maneuvers. Trimming weight from the ARF is another good way to improve these flight regimes.
If your model is rolling wide even with the differential going the right way, chances are your wing incidence is a bit too positive. The Kaos will fly correctly with 0 to 1/2 degree of positive incidence. Don't be afraid to move the balance point back a skosh at a time, starting with the model balancing on the main spar.
Check your engine's thrust setting. No down or up thrust. This is a zero-zero model.
Ed Cregger
I have also a GMS muffler that fits ok with both engines, it significantly enhances the performance of engines and gives me much more confidence.
With regard to ailerons you believe it is a good idea to increase them to 1 - 3/4 "? the originals measured 1 - 1 / 4 ".
I also want to buid a turtle deck like Dave mentioned, I know this is going to be a lot of work but I just love this plane
.dbacque what do you exactly mean by "Work the elevator a little " is that something like rainedave suggested ?.
David thanks for you comment also, I will consider your point, anything that helps fly better I'll try it, by the way I havent have the time to continue building any of my scratch projects a kaos & mach one... but wait [X(] I forget I also have a curare and all of them waiting their turn... [&o]
Regards to all you.
Rafa
I have never flown a pattern ship that had too much power, if you know what I mean. I was going to put an OS .55AX (have two of'em) in my Kaos ARF that I am presently assembling, but decided to use a well used .46 - .52 sized two-stroke engine. I have a Saito .82 that is just begging for a turn too.
Something just told me to do so, since I'll be installing some 2.4 GHz gear and using this model for a radio testing platform. Don't wanna bash my new .55's if I make a stupid technical mistake, or dumb-thumb it into the ground. I'm saving my .55's for something else. Probably another Kaos ARF, knowing me.
I would think that the OS .55AX would be an excellent choice for this model. You'll find yourself filing or grinding the metal engine mount a bit to get the .55AX to fit, but that's no biggy. The .45-.52 sized engines fit without filing/grinding, if you have an aversion to that kind of work.
Ed Cregger
05-10-2008, 10:21 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
ORIGINAL: alcarafa
dbacque what do you exactly mean by "Work the elevator a little " is that something like rainedave suggested ?.
dbacque what do you exactly mean by "Work the elevator a little " is that something like rainedave suggested ?.
I was out flying my 19 year old Super Kaos 40 this morning. It always makes me smile.
Dave
05-10-2008, 04:46 PM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
Hey alcarafa:
The only mods that I made to the TH Kaos was to strip off the cheap covering. When I received the Kaos all the seams were coming up and the covering was a mess. Hit it with a heat gun and it all came off. The rest is history.
The only mods that I made to the TH Kaos was to strip off the cheap covering. When I received the Kaos all the seams were coming up and the covering was a mess. Hit it with a heat gun and it all came off. The rest is history.
05-11-2008, 01:27 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
[/quote]
Which Tower Kaos do you have? There was the kit, shelf paper ARF, MonoKote ARF and the current red and white wonder covering (you wonder what it is) ARF. All of them are different.
This link might be helpful http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_37...tm.htm#3735219
[/quote]
It's the KAOS latest version red and white, thanks for your comment and link to the thread its very helpful.
Regards.
Rafa
05-11-2008, 01:43 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
Frank Thank you for your comment in fact I'll strip my Kaos, I dont like the covering material neither, black & yellow strips come off very easy and after some time like you mention is a total mess. I have some transparent red ultracote and some white and silver for my own scheme looks like a good combination.
This is the second TH Kaos I have and think is a decent plane for the price payed and it performs very well.
I have decided to use a OS 46 FX with Macs pipe and APC 10 x 6, also will convert it to dual ailerons servos and ...maybe.... just maybe [>:] if I get crazy enough I will install mech retracts how about that ?
Take care and happy landings.
Rafa
This is the second TH Kaos I have and think is a decent plane for the price payed and it performs very well.
I have decided to use a OS 46 FX with Macs pipe and APC 10 x 6, also will convert it to dual ailerons servos and ...maybe.... just maybe [>:] if I get crazy enough I will install mech retracts how about that ?
Take care and happy landings.
Rafa
05-11-2008, 01:54 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
Ed I've been flying with Spektrum 2.4 ghz DX7 for almost two years now, dont be afraid on using 2.4 ghz technology its awsome fast and you'll forget about frecuencies or tags, just start up your engine and fly like I say " full colors" for me 72 mhz is compared to B/W TV to Color TV is so different added to this is the simplicity off mixes and performance of 21st century radios.
Thanks.
Rafa
Thanks.
Rafa
05-14-2008, 05:30 PM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
Alcarafa,
Here's something different to consider. Here is a picture of my Tower Kaos that I converted to a tail dragger. The motor is a YS53 4-stroke getting ready to turn an APC 11X7 prop. I haven't flown it yet, but I'm getting the itch to fly it pretty bad...
Here's something different to consider. Here is a picture of my Tower Kaos that I converted to a tail dragger. The motor is a YS53 4-stroke getting ready to turn an APC 11X7 prop. I haven't flown it yet, but I'm getting the itch to fly it pretty bad...
07-12-2008, 01:23 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
Hi guys I have finished the mod's on my TH KAOS, set up ended with SPEKTRUM DX7 & DS821 Digital servos, 6 v 2500 mah battery, striped and covered again with transparent red ultracote , silver and white monokote, Os 46 FX with MACS pipe and APC 10 / 6 propeller. Also changed all the hardware supplied with the plane except engine mount.
This lady flies fffffaaaasssssssssttttttttttttttt !!!!! specially at sea level where I live.
I followed set up for servos, ailerons, rudder and elevator from another post here in the forum, and it really is smooth as silk.
HERE ARE THE PICTURES OF THE MODS FROM MY TOWER KAOS, YOU CAN NOTICE I UPGRADED THE HARDWARE, COVERING, CHANGED THE TAIL ON BOTTOM, THE NEON GREEN ON BOTOM OF WINGS IS A GOOD WAY TO SEE HOW THE PLANE IS FLYING WHEN PLANE IS ROLLING.
Hope you like it
Rafa
This lady flies fffffaaaasssssssssttttttttttttttt !!!!! specially at sea level where I live.
I followed set up for servos, ailerons, rudder and elevator from another post here in the forum, and it really is smooth as silk.
HERE ARE THE PICTURES OF THE MODS FROM MY TOWER KAOS, YOU CAN NOTICE I UPGRADED THE HARDWARE, COVERING, CHANGED THE TAIL ON BOTTOM, THE NEON GREEN ON BOTOM OF WINGS IS A GOOD WAY TO SEE HOW THE PLANE IS FLYING WHEN PLANE IS ROLLING.
Hope you like it
Rafa
07-15-2008, 01:21 AM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
LAST POST SHOWS ALL PICTURES OF THE MODIFICATIONS I MADE TO MY KAOS, IM REALLY PLEASED WITH THE RESULT AND IT FLIES SO GOOODDDDDD !!!
REGARDS 2 ALL YOU.
RAFA
REGARDS 2 ALL YOU.
RAFA
07-15-2008, 01:07 PM
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RE: TH KAOS MOD'S
The plane looks great! Best of luck with it. Nice colors on it [&:]
Worth noting though.... the black Mac muffler you have on there is just that.. a light weight muffler with decent flow characteristics. It has no tuned pipe effect - not a tuned muffler.
Worth noting though.... the black Mac muffler you have on there is just that.. a light weight muffler with decent flow characteristics. It has no tuned pipe effect - not a tuned muffler.