Shoot me an e-mail, or give me a call sometime to fly CL. I live in Lawrenceville/Snellville, and have been looking for people and a place.

Lou
Just wanted to add my 2 cents worth. I started flying c/l in the early 60's with the Cox .049 engines and 1/2 A planes that I had to build myself. No such thing as ARF back then. Progressed up to the larger craft (40 to 52 inch spans) and flew these into the 80's. Ringmasters, Noblers, and all I could get at the time. I wore out a McCoy .29. Flew it for 20 years. By the mid 80's, family, jobs, and education took most of my time and money. But now kids are gone and I once again have time on my hand. I got into R/C about 8 years ago and do enjoy it a lot, but I still miss my C/L days. My hanger has 4 R/C craft but I am going back into the C/L business. I never thought the circles I flew were boring. Every flight was a blast and i never could figure out why I could still control the plane with the cables as twisted as they were at the end of a flight. Inside loops, outside loops, overhead figure 8's, vertical and horizontal 8"s. Basically everything I could throw out there. I guess it all depends on how a person sees the sport. I can never remember a flight being "dull" or "boring". Don't get me wrong, R/C is a lot of fun too, but why limit ourselves to one avenue of the sport? I think C/L is a GREAT learning tool for all ages, and should help build the knowledge and confidence to advance one's skills in any aero sport.
RWCherry
Mt Sterling KY

oh, 2 B Flying

Replying to Steve H. because he resurrected this thread and because he presented a special point in his statement, "....that at least some of these folks won't be crabby when they hear a model airplane engine, maybe it will bring a fond memory to their minds,... ." IMO this is significant to the promotion of the sport/hobby of model aviation.
Back in the '70s RC was the 'snob arena' for many of those wanting to get into model aviation. Those modelers with a firm base in modeling that got into RC were mostly just climbing another hill in the activity that they loved. The newcomers of course had to keep up with the 'Jones' and since the newbies had no base in CL/FF, they rather looked down on the 'lesser' disciplines.
The real problem is simply a result of the society that we have developed in this country. Look at the homes we live in, the cars we drive, the parents that MAKE their kids play sports where the main game is between the parents themselves, the clothing that young people 'must have' and their general lifestyle. Definitely no kid will be "cool" when flying model airplanes especially of the 'lesser' disciplines. However RC has its problems with growth in that area. I can't remember just how many kids that I soloed in the past 10 years that tried to move up far too fast and quit when they found that being the best on the field was much more than a simple "I fly RC".
For those that look down on CL, as others have stated in this thread, they simply have no clue as to the discipline and both physical and mental dexterity displayed in CL stunt, racing, and combat, plus the art-form of CL Scale. So CL modelers never dismay because of the unlearned boors that love to look down at any thing, regardless of what it may be.

Have I flown CL. Yes Why did I quit? I couldn't get any better with my CL Stunt and family and jobs precluded additional practice. So I just had to climb that RC Hill and I couldn't support both activities.
Did I compete? Yes. The picture below was a portion of my basement rack during the transition days. All CL and FF.

I still do up to .19 with kids in my backyard. I am still going to build another stunter and try the pattern again.

Now one suggestion: CLers, you really need to make mufflers the order of the day in all your CL disciplines if you really wish to get CL back to the use of those limited spaces where people will see what you do. I know the dyed-in-the-wool competitor will fight this, however sometime the overall growth of the sport must be considered. Just my thoughts.
I financed the Jetero RC field (www.jetero.com). We advertised that CL groups were welcome to build a couple circles there however engines of .15 and above must have a muffler. 9 years now and no CLers have wanted to take the offer.

Hi Scubyfan

Whilst I empathise with your frustration, no offence intended but your employment of the verb transitive lose in the present participle "losing" begs the question, where have you been for the past 30 years?

The answer in two words is "it's 2004". If that doesn't make the answer abundantly clear, amplification is pointless.

I flew/fly C/L and fly R/C, I am not into absurd superiority arguments. Although today I fly predominently R/C, both are fun. But the reasons C/L is an anachronism in today's society are so obvious they shouldn't require any elaboration. Whether C/L deserves to be in this position or not is completely moot and unworthy of debate. Like Free Flight, except for it's own generation and a very few of their introduced progeny accompanied by the odd fanatical afficionado, C/L is virtually dead and is doomed to inevitible extinction for all practical purposes upon the demise of its own generation. They, just like R/C is now, were both of and came of age in their own era. If it gives you any satisfaction, R/C will invariably go a similar way. You can witness this already in the age demographic representation at R/C clubs. The PC and other 'cooler' techno-titillation has replaced it with the emergent generation.

Is C/L fun. Heck yer! So stop living in the past, get over it, get on with it, and enjoy it while you still can in the company of like minded others.

If it helps you understand and accept why, perhaps you've observed that cars aren't hand started by crank handle any more and people travel intercontinentally airliner rather than steamship?

While many are debating/arguing over whether CL or RC is more fun, the guys that seem to have just as much fun and just do their thing, are the FF guys (wet powered, e-powered, and rubber powered).

George

May I suggest that's merely self-comforting illusion?

They may not bother clashing egos arguing about superiority under the guise which is the most "fun", after all why fight a battle against overwhelming odds against which the ego can't possibly win, perhaps something the control-line crowd ought consider? But they certainly do whine every bit as much, just about different issues, as unlike quite a few obstinate control-liners they have by and large realised that their passion is passe in terms of its appeal to any body of demographical significance.

Their pet whines are arguing pedantically about the ever appended competition rules and losing their old/finding a new a place to fly, the latter something with which most of us can empathise. It seems they and their 'pilotless missiles' are even more persona non grata in the era of NIMBY than the rest of us.

I see that you are from Australia and thus [8D]have a strange view of the world. Well, I sympathize because I am from Texas and my view of the world is thought strange by many. [:-] (By the by, on another forum, someone said Australia is an island off the coast of Texas. I doubt that is correct, but with plate tectonics, one never knows.)

So far as moving right along with progress; there are still people who race horses rather than jet aircraft, people who hunt with bow and arrow rather than magnum rifle, people who paddle their canoe rather than using a motor, etc. It would really be a boring world if everyone was a clone of you (or of me for that matter, I suppose.)

Well, it is a fine day, and I am going to take a couple of control line airplanes down to our circle in the churchyard near my house. I'll fly them, and, believe it or not, I will have fun!

Well I am back from flying Frank Ehling EASY's designed in 1949, and I have a serious question.

It appears to me that many large cities in the USA have many more places you can get model train stuff, than places where you can get model airplane stuff. How come model trains are as popular as they are? How retro can you get?

Jim

Heck, all this time I thought I was just having fun.

sigrun, I think SOME of us are taking our hobby way too seriously.

George

Hi GCB

Presumably you read what I wrote? If so, then you should have comprehended that I wasn't inferring that you weren't, nor that anyone enjoying whatever aspect of the hobby/sport/interest isn't or shouldn't be.

You are right, some people do personalise and identify with the issues raised in this thread. Fortunately I'm not one of them, merely, if you'll forgive my lack of false modesty, an astute observer. The views stated earlier are simply observations of what is occurring/has occurred, neither assigned as good nor bad, right or wrong, superior or inferior by me. Only interpretation by the individual appropriates them that perspective as can be amply witnessed within this thread.

Control line is like slot car racing, Elvis and old sports cars... it'll always be there.

sigrun,

I guess where you see clashing egos, I see differences of opinion. Where you see pet whines, I see guys trying to make it fair for all (and flying sites here ARE disappearing here).

I guess I tend to give people a lot of slack. They don't have to do things my way to be acceptable. They do their thing, I do mine, and we all can have fun.

I think we tend to view things somewhat differently...that's OK.

George

to me, this is not a matter of "better" or anything like that, just different, and having it's own sets of skills. i am a glider guy down deep ( of course all cl planes are gliders for a bit :}) but a buddy talked me into trying cl combat. what a hoot. far different than a quiet day of making lazy thermal turns. and there is nothing like 3 or 4 guys in a circle on a rat race, eh? after doing this for a while, i find that even tho my passion is still for soaring, there are a few unique areas where control line has helped me.

a) had to learn to not get dizzy (that is a skill, by the way)
b) i can come up with a plane design from scratch, and build and try it in a weekend easily with cl, (very theraputic in this day of canned arfs to scratch build your own designs)
c) i got over my fear of the ground. when flying gliders if i got within about 50 feet of the ground i got pretty tense, and was never good at turns low-n-slow. now i am ok with turning the planes as low as i want to and still have the wingtip miss the ground!
d) i got ok with fast planes. taught me better reactions
e) gave me a chance to give a lot of kids some time flying a model. it is alot easier to give a bunch of kids some time on a simple cl model than an rc- buddy box, and they do better with it right off the bat as well. nice for a kid's first try at something to go well! my 12 year old son was soloing in just a few sessions. nice confidence booster for him.
f) even tho i can use a stooge and solo fly, it is a good excuse to make some new friends and have a buddy go out with you, since hanging out with buds is more fun than solo anyway.

so we have seen a resurgence of CL here in northern new mexico. last year was kind of quiet, but the previous few years we have had good attendance, and our club (mostly rc people) hosts at least one and most years two events a year for CL.

shoot - now i wanna go fly, and the ground is covered in snow :{ hmmm. skiis on the combat planes? no, i know! maybe indoor control line is the next big thing!

r.

I just saw an ad, "Excellent trainer has EVERYTHING in one box. Assembles in 30 minutes." I hope, someday, to see this ad, "Excellent CONTROL LINE trainer has EVERYTHING in one box. Assemble in 30 minutes." Until that happens, CL will grow very slowly[]. The original ad is on page 3 of the Jan 2005 Flying Models.

Jim

Unfortunately, I don't think UC will grow very much. Those who did it in their youth are dying off at a rapid rate. UC has little appeal to newbies compared to RC (my opinion only). In fact, RC as we have known it may not survive - no more building - ARFs and electric park fliers are the rage - and flying sites are growing few and far between. AMA is on a decline as well as PAMPA (the UC stunt org.).

Paul

There is a desire in our society for alternatives to sterile technology, and a nostalgic return to the satisifaction of simpler achievements. Control Line should be able to capitalize on that, and bring the younger generation into the sport.

As far as old age and the death of the sport, yo-yo's (don't laugh) suggest an alternative. In their community, the typical yo-yoist complains of the fad - those periods where the toy becomes hugely popular, then almost disappears for a decade. Yet, each fad period creates a new generation with a lasting memory. That helps encourage the next generation during their fad period.

In our own sport, we complain that young people get involved, then quickly lose interest. I don't believe that's necessarily a bad thing. It plants a seed that may produce a return to the sport in the future. Done right, this might perpetuate a lasting hobby. We may be seeing the effects now, as those youths involved in previous decades have matured and returned.

I submit that it will always be important to attract younger members to the sport.

citom:

well said. i agree with your points. i had not thought much about innovation in control line, but sure should have! i was the first in our club to successfully fly a control line electric with my own brushed motor controller, and except for the lack of a brushless controller specifically for control line, i would be building and flying control line electrics and exploring that new frontier.

r.

Jerichod. There are at least three competitive electric stunt models in the country. One was flown to 6th in Advanced at the Nats. I have judged another in competition. It was only the airplane's third flight so it did not score up to its potential; however, it flew the pattern with no problems. Electric control line is here. See Mel Duval's post on the Stuka Stunt works CL Forum.

Jim

Hello,
Until a couple months ago, i thought (like most people) that CL is boring. I thought "Whats so fun about spinning around in circles?" My father grew up flying CL, and free flight. He got into RC, but he still sticks with his first love, CL. He tried to get myself and my brother involved in it when we were young, making all sorts of planes for us, but we never really liked it. I started flying RC about 4 years ago, and had not flown CL since 3 years before that. A couple months ago, my dad persuaded me to go with him to a CL contest in Dallas. We brought a little 1/2a F-86 for me to fly after he had flown his stunter. Well, once i got back on the handle, i realized how much fun it was. The little '86 would only fly for 2 minutes or so, but it was 2 minutes of pure fun. Like i said, i had not flown CL in a very long time, but i picked it up very quickly again, and by the 3rd or 4th flight i was able to do loops and hold level flight easily.

Also, i think that the reason more people arent involved in CL is because there is not much publicity. There are no RTF CL planes out there. You cant go to RadioShack and buy a RTF CL plane (however bad it may be). I think that most people today are only interested in the "cutting edge" of technology. CL has been around so long that most technological improvements have been made, so there arent many brand new ideas for CL as there are for RC. Well, thats it for me.

Alex (14 year old who loves CL)

you guys may think a little that c l is going away but look at me i am 15 years old and i just love control line. I build my planes I understand how engines work ect... Radio control I fly sometimes like if I have a crash or just for once in a while thing. But I am a teenager and I just love control line, my parents think I am adicted to it. Well its maybe true but at least i stick to it. I live in Canada BC and in a of vancouver island we are only two person that fly control line, me and my best friends father. I try to start clubs for control line but no kids (teenagers) like it. I ve tried once for RC and just went crazy. I say to bring control line back and running more like before we have to make it sound less "sissy" sounding. Get the people to try it with the plane they ve byed and everything. Then like for what happened to me it just gives me a adranaline rush makes me go very happy.

every time i go flying then come back home nothing can make that day bad. Cause i got the thought for when i was flying and the fun stays with me. Control line is going away but for me its all there is.
And also if you want to make someone more intersted you can also tell them that its cheaper there is no radio system to buy and also that this hobby is less popular than RC so the prices aren t has high. So that means more airplanes for less money

Thank for reading

LeBlanc

Well LeBlanc,

You sure have your logic straight, and the feeling you get flying is the same one I've been getting all my life.

So tell me, what is it that attracts you but not other teens? Do you like airplanes in general or just models? What would it take to get other teens to think models are cool? Could that even be done? Do you build yourown of buy them ready to fly?

Looking forward to you answer.

Well RRyan I think that its popularity that makes teens not fly CL airplanes, cause since it sound sort of "sisssyich" the teens just dont want to loose the real them they dont want other people to think that there bad so they just don't fly! For me my friends don't mind who i am, I am very lucky for friends there not like the people you see today there different. So when I go flying they dont mind helping me out but there just not interested cause "it looks funny" ( me for my face when I fly[>:]). I've tried to get them interested but there just into other things already. But I've got two friends who are starting to get interested so what I am going to do is get them a trainer that they can build. With the engine ect... For what really helped me out getting me really into the hobby is that "WHAT I'VE BUILT FLYS" just makes feel like a king!

Before my goal was to become a comercial pilot, but so that I could learn the basics I've started to build and try to understand how everything works. But with time, I just started to like this so much that thats almost all I think about.
My favorite part is actually building the airplane. That way I get to know the model better and also keeps me busy on rainy days.

I think that it is possible to bring back CL to teens because there is so much to learn!! It s fun stuff to know, you actually have to apply your knowledge to know what you are doing, unlike school sometimes we learn some stuff and never use it anywhere!!

The way I would bring back teens to CL is to help them out, show them it s cool thats there is teens that actually do this. When I mean help them out it may mean to help them financialy. The sport is still very expensive, but I am lucky me and my family are like a little rich so it helps a bit. Get them an airplane to build ( not a built up wing and fuse would help ), like the CLP-28 from brodak very good trainer all you need is just plain model dope handle lines engine ect...

We could show the teens that models are cool by letting them build there airplane first then show them a very and nicely airplane to try to get them more enthousiast about it.

And to finish yes I do build my airplanes, I only got one ARF its the Flite Streak and it s ok

Thanks for reading
LeBlanc

I don't mind the replys keep the questions coming!!

LeBlanc,
Without a lot of preaching and so forth, at your age it is very important to be liked and popular. Some of the people who do not have the skills, desire, or means may put it down just because THEY don't know how to do it. This is normal and, believe it or not, most of us went through it.
You MAY find that girls will come around asking questions about it.
Good luck with your airplanes. If you have questions, someone here will have answers.
Keep us posted on your progress.

George

Ha-ha! Good luck on that one! A very nice reply, but I wouldn't push it too far. I think that's why it's important to realize that young people will not be consistent with the hobby - they can't be! It doesn't mean they won't come back some day.

I'm doing it now because I've sent one off to college, and may have a little more time now, although her little sister still disagrees.

My son got some flack for flying model airplanes while in highschool He explained that he was flying CL racing airplanes which flew 110 MPH. That was OK with his friends.

Jim

I have been flying CL since 1960 - took up RC in 2002 - I still fly CL and enjoy.
For those of you who think CL is boring try flying combat with a good 35. Just so you know, that means that you will be about 1/2 foot off the ground at 110+MPH. It tickles me a lot more than a good fast roll with my Northstar.

Fred