RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

So that way is ok to do and should work with our circuit we are using....is that what your saying

brett

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Hi Rob,


I am not understanding number 5.

6 - so you would like to have more than one curve (table) loaded into the pic?
3- so you want to run the pic at 8 mhz?
2- That is in the excel table. I don't see where the pic or the engine cares where BTDC is.
4 why not?
1- how low are you wanting to go?

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Rob,

For number 4 Flashlight not being able to be on the TCI board why can't you come off the collector side of the TIP162?

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

I think Rob means, could be wrong but

2: be able to adjust the point of pickup, as now the pickup is fixed and must be place 40 degrees before the magnet, if you could have that part adjustable then you could fine tune better

5: i think this acts like dual timming to switch to on the run, for tight or long tracks etc

1: hand starting RPM would have to be about 200 rpm i would guess

brett

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

5 - a TCI-ignition use a 45/55% dwelltime to load the ignitioncoil.

A CDI-ignition use only 50uSec to unload the C

6- yes, sometimes you want to use differend tables for differend fly (?) conditions.
2 - now you can only calcute back from 40 degrees,, I think 60 degrees is better, also to calculate the ignitiontime.
4 - a flashlight needs a very short puls, into the TCI the flashtime is the same as loadtime coil and is no more a flash.
1 - I think 800 rpm (big engines) is better, 1800 for big engines is almost 20% of the rpm.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

My Motors idle at 2200 - 2500 Rpm so the lower the better for Point number 1

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

I've make a new powerboard and it produce 800Volt/10-15W.
I build it up and connect it to power, it start asone a Iconnect the power.
The transistor (BUT12A) don't heat up.
Only the scr-part don't funtionate well, the puls from the timerboard is reduce to 1 Volt.....[&o]

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Did you get 800 volts from one transister or two like the flip flop circuit ?

Rob you should try the Sports Device DC - DC circuit.....


http://www.sportdevices.com/ignition/inverter.htm

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

I think one problem here is some of us are using the CDI and the auto advance for mini bikes which run on a different rpm and spark curve and some are using it for model airplane use which is not as demanding. So I think there need to be 2 separate topics.For the mini bike guys the auto advance from Sport Devices would probably be more suited.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

From sportdevice didn't work here for some reason.

@ Charlie, it doesn't matter where you use the CDI for, minibike and flyght are both 2 stroke and behave the same.
I use the CDI for a 40 years old moped 50cc 2 stroke and for my airboat.

BTW, powerboard 3 is online.
http://www.electronics.gompy.net/cditci/

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

sure it does. one engine the rpm range is 1800 to 8 or 9000 and the other is at or around 12000 + rpm.So you have two different rpm ranges and different spark curve needs. One has a static timing of 28 degrees and one has 40 degrees. two totally different setups. There is no way one curve and one setup can work with both.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Charlie, you are exactly right! Both needs are totally different. What R/C flyers are looking for in a timer control is when power is turned on, the delay is set back to about 5-10 degrees BTDC. Then as rpms increase over the hand starting rpm of 300, the advance follows rpm increase till it reaches max settings of anywhere from 28 degrees to 36 degrees BTDC.
That's how CH Synchro Spark works and it is foolproof. Thanks TKG !!!! wonderful product!

Some of the things in the c-code could be eliminated..like the low speed test...if it works at 7000 rpm, it surely should work at a slower speed. The Master clear and brownout are all internal routines (as I recall from the docs for the chip)..and that space could be better used for timing tables etc.. Charlie is on the right track.. We just need someone with a little expertise in making changes..
I wish I could do it, I'd make it useable for all with a simple patch to hex for changes and then reburn to the chip..easy enough.
I used to edit hex files in memory (computer memory) in basic with a series of peeks and pokes.. Surely we can do this same thing. Establishing the guidelines is the main problem I think.. Again, my two cents worth of info.
Yet another new board made..my original design in a newer smaller board..runs 2+ hours on a 4.8 volt 700mah pack...no transistor heating, great spark. I'll be adding the schematic as soon as I redraw..taking me forever...I have a PCB file in PDF format..just need the parts layout and schematic done..hang in there..
John

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Form 0 to 100% can be 0 till 100 but also from 400 till 16735.....the value doesn't matter.
The pic have to know wat value belongs to 47% and from wat table do I take the value, table 1 or table 25.
Programming isn't easy [8D]

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Hi John,

I will be talking with someone who does embedded software to see if he will/can help me. At least we now have some common ground we can work on. I agree with you comments.for starting it needs to retard the timing to around 5 degrees and then advance as rpm increases. I will share what ever I come up with. I would like to be able to just rewrite to eeprom with a new table instead of having to compile the whole code. I will see what this guy says and post it here.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

this does not effect program memory.So it does not take away from how much of a program can fit in a pic.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

[quote]ORIGINAL: gr8flyer55

Charlie, you are exactly right! Both needs are totally different. What R/C flyers are looking for in a timer control is when power is turned on, the delay is set back to about 5-10 degrees BTDC. Then as rpms increase over the hand starting rpm of 300, the advance follows rpm increase till it reaches max settings of anywhere from 28 degrees to 36 degrees BTDC.
That's how CH Synchro Spark works and it is foolproof. Thanks TKG !!!! wonderful product![quote]

You don't need a chip to do this, with simpel electronics you can do the same.
At HobbyKing you can buy a CDI for only 25$ with this *technoligy*

This *routines* don't take any memory or other resourses, they are allready into the pic.
The code we use right now is peanuts, 20 lines wiil be normal the starting lines without the program.
The programm can be 2 KB, our few lines are 0,01 KB.
This is not everything wat the pic can handle http://www.picbasic.nl/downloads/DCF16NLD_V-2.bas

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Hope this file uploads.. a pdf of my newest PCB..
Measurements are 1 inch x 1.750 inches..
Schematic soon with overlay and parts list to follow.
I have it also in Adobe Illustrator format if anyone needs that version to edit..

Update: added schematic

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

I didn't understand the difference between available (2048 bytes) program memory and rom instructions built into the chip.. better understanding of it now.. thanks
I was making a comparison between commercial product and our developing project here.. just to get a grasp on the subject...not knowing what I was talking about I guess was my error.. I'd better stick to something I know about.. Ha!
sorry for the confusion.
Interfaced the timer with my new boards..working like a charm. Etched 4 more boards..running out of ferric chloride..time to stop..

John

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

The new board (CDIPWR3) I make today works great a very strong spark from a tiny coil.
Maybe with some changes of components it wll be work even better.
Why it not spark befor......a wire inside the coil was broken when I take the coil out a other project.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

I reactivate the chloride with (salt acid ?????? Babelfish) I realy do't know how you call it.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

thats messy stuff. I had to switch to sodium persulfate. Much cleaner.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Charlie.. where do you get that sodium persulfate? Pharmacy? About 10 years ago, I bought the Ferric Chloride at Radio Shack..5 bottles at one time.. can't find it there anymore..must have discontinued it. I'm stuck right now.. no chemicals. Oh well, my PCB factory closed due to lack of materials.. I'm laying myself off...Ha!

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

hydrogen peroxide + salt acid

http://nl.babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_txt
http://www.circuitsonline.net/artikelen/view/14/print

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Hi John,

I got it at Mouser. You mix 1 cup of powder to 1 Qt of water and it lasts a long time. You have to heat it.It works best if you agitate it.

RE: New CDI - opensource project JMJ and Bigboat
 

Charlie - John, if it was a pylon racer with a weedwacker motor in it then they also would be up in the rev range,

the stardard wacker motor only does 9000 because or the exhaust and port timing

RPM = Power

if you are building a system you would not build it for say 9000 if thats is all your motor does, that is like our local concil only putting 2 lane hiway
when we need 6 lanes in 1 years time

also Robs motors Zenoah PUM260 run between 15,000 and 20,000 rpm


John in my Silicon Chip Mag there are PCB manufacturing that can do 1 offs etc and get online quotes, once you have the premo board setup it maybe cheaper

DID you get my PM John

http://www.pcbcart.com/

http://sesame.com.au/

rcsradio.com.au

brett