RE: Substitute for Ether
 

gustavoPpt...

Use motoroil who has SAE 40 or 50... I has used 10W-40 or 20W-50 or similar.. xxW-xx, this type W are oil who has viscosity for cold start in winter in colder area are not very important for our model diesel engines.. the last Sae 40 or 50 after xxW only.

Get rid of the stuff who has ftalate, it is dangerous and make cancer in your body..

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when you said "motor oil" you did want to say 2 cycle oils.... 4 stroke oils... or any oils?

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ahhhh, today during one run.... I saw the compression screw loosening by "oneself"... then I stop the screw and try to turn them to the best compression position again....and I "win" a burned finger....
does the screw loosening.. is normal? the screw havent a "locking nut" , is only the screw into the engine head.

and sorry by the poor english

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Two alternative..

1. Make center hole in the compression screw to prevent the screw are rotating out.

2. Make a locknut with lever to hold the compression screw locked.

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motor oil (for 4 stroke engine) , not two stroke oil..

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Well THe only oil that I have ever use is sintetic blend for catrol motor oil " four stroke engine!!! " and thanks to the man that give the data about Xilene to up the octane \
Koodos to hem

Mark

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hi boys, today ive tested, or re-tested the same blend... Im starting the engine by hand, OK, today I feel that the engine is no steady, have only power in high compression, no idle (it is a CL engine, w/o carburettor).
when I decrease the compression, the engine begin to swing without sound of explosion... now, I'm not sure if is the fuel or the prop, or both.
I'm using a 10x5 wood prop in a paw 29ds

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Hi guys I am from australia and use to drive road trains in the early days eg-1970 to some of you we use to put camphor blocks in our fuel tanks to boost the power in the motors I was told that it gave off more nitrogen , can someone elaborate on this thanks  btw I just bought a new enya 11cx diesel what a great little motor

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I just learned about road trains last week on TV. I didn't know that you folks were doing such a thing. Very interesting.

I heard about dissolving camphor blocks in tanks of Diesel fuel, but I don't have any experience doing it, nor do I know of anyone that did it in my working life time. I knew trucker folks and even turned around an 18 wheeler in Readers Digest's drivewayat the ripe old age of 26 (1973). I missed my turnoff and panicked, afraid I'd get lost. I'll bet they didn't expect to see an 18 wheeler coming around that famous u-shaped driveway. <G>

Ed Cregger

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Yep road trains are something different 3 trailers 42 foot long each going down the road
just pull your mirrors in so you could't see what was going on down the back
and hope they were all there when you go to were you were going:)

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I cleaned my PAW80, dried it and lubricated it with Hoppe's gun oil from a spray can. Before putting it in storage, I fitted and flipped a 7x3 prop, just for the pleasure of feeling the engine plop freely. Well, guess what, it fired and ran a couple of seconds. I put some more oil in it and repeated the experience. I wonder what is in this oil, or could it be the propellant? I could not find the Material Safety Data Sheet.
All I found is the MSDS for their "Elite" Oil here:
http://www.copquest.com/knowledgebase/index.htm

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I had a similar experience with an .020 and WD40. Someone once said that diesels are like goats, they'll eat anything. http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f...sn/biggrin.gif

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Strange that it would ignite the weapon oil since auto Ignition are at >650° F (343° C) [:o] Maybe ignited by propellant..

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I read with interest Brian Winch in the latest Airborne magazine saying that nitro-methane was a substitute for IPN or Amyl-nitrate. Anyone else tried that?

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Gentlemen,
Will castor oil blend(miscible) with both petroleum based fuels(gasoline, diesel, kerosene, jet fuel) and will it also blend(miscible) with alcohol based fuels(ethyl, methyl, isopropyl)????
Thanks,
larry

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I'm not expert on the topic, but I do seem to recall that castor oil was not miscible with gasoline. That was one of the reasons that the old rotary airplane engines used a separate total loss oiling system instead of using premix gas and oil.


Ed Cregger

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From Klotz

+++++++++++++++

Product details
* Blend of degummed castors.
* Ounce for ounce, the toughest lubricant made.
* Blends with gasoline or methanol.
* Contains Klotz Red for visual identification.
* Distinctive racing bean-oil odor.
* Not recommended for extreme cold.
* Available in 16 oz. poly bottles, 10 per case or 1 gal. poly bottles, 4 per case; sold each.

++++++++++++++

It also blends with Kerosene for use in diesel. Most castor oils will NOT blend with kerosene and in that case, the miscibility of Castor with ether, allows that blend to dissolve in kerosene. But Klotz Benol castor WILL blend with kerosene. But this must be above freezing temps. In that case, the castor drops out of solution.

Don't know about Isopropyl though.

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Today i found the two books from former Soviet era, the book "Piston engine for flying models" from 1951 by A. V. Filipychev and "Young model boatbuilder" from 1955 by S. Lugininov. There are wrote about model diesel engines and fuel. The model diesel engines ran without ether in fuel.

Here are the 3 difference fuels without ether:

3 parts kerosene
1 part gasoline/petrol
2 parts motoroil

1 part kerosene
1 part gasoline/petrol
1 part motoroil

40% kerosene
30% gasoline/petrol
30% motoroil

Motoroil in our days will be 10W-40 or better 20w-50

Why gasoline/petrol in fuel? i belive it will make the fuel more easier to vaporize/more easier to atomize the fuel before igniting by compression.
Also make the fueldrops more smaller to get quickly hotter by heat of compression.

Thinking to take a experiment with the fuel mix in my model diesel engine to learn out how it will start by handstarting.
The question about the fuel is suitable to use the engine when we are talking about handstarting the engine without electric handstarter or the cylinder is preheated before starting the engine.

Now what are you thinking or a answer about gasoline/petrol in fuel?

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Interesting. Gasoline today has a high octane rating. It would have been lower in those days. I tried gasoline alone in a PAW and did get it to start, but was unable to get to run for any period of time.

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Are we sure it is not the first of April? ;)

If gasoline/petrol/benzine made an acceptable ether substitute, the cost and ease of preparation of model diesel fuel would lead to a new wave of interest.

I hope someone tries these formulae, and reports in this forum on their conclusions.

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:) This is not a first of april.

In the book "Piston engine for flying models" from 1951 by A. V. Filipychev is enlighten: When the engine has good compression, it will works well without ether since it is enough heat of compression to ignite the fuel. In case the engine has poor compression or not enough heat of compression in the smaller engine, then the fuel must have ether. The smallest engine was MK-02 at 2.5 ccm in 1948 by V. Petukov, it is a long stroke engine and the engine was made to run without ether.

It will be a worth to try in our modern engines who are not a long stroke engines.;)

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Thanks for pulling up this post. lots of great information.
As they say, why re-invent the wheel?
Andy, have you made any new discoveries on fuel mixes?
The above mentions that "max" compression is required for the initial starts. Is this going to damage the engine?

Has anyone tried a dual fuel set up using a Y connector and two needle valves. The first needle would be to the fuel with the ether for starting, and the second needle would then be used to introduce the no ether fuel as the diesel warmed up. The ether would be leaned out, and the NO ether richened , so to speak. Of course this procedure, if it works, would have to be repeated each time at start up.

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There is no need for a dual fuel setup. Just turn the crank until the rotary valve opens up and then give the engine a very brief squirt of starting ether from a pressurized can meant for starting full-size Diesel engines or automobiles.


Ed Cregger

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Hi folks, i has tested the etherless fuel in my engine. The fuel blend from the book from former Soviet era, the book "Piston engine for flying models" from 1951 by A. V. Filipychev was used as here:

3 parts kerosene
1 part gasoline/petrol
2 parts motoroil

See this movie:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYOdh5b8cNg[/youtube]

Now, what is your comments after you has watched the engine ran without ether [8D]

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Very nice! What is the air temprature? Did you do anything special to start it?