BadAzzMaxx

If my memory serves me right, The timming on the ZDZ 60 ignition should be set at 2-3mm before topd dead center.
Things might have changed sense I had one.

Milton

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

This is an excellent comment concerning the Rcexl ignition modules!!! Instead of being "auto-advancing" they are actually "auto-retarding"

SPEEDY

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

I know the latter ZDZ engines were refitted with a Walbro carb. I have converted mine using a Walbro WT-540 with the internal accelerator pump. The WT-540 has a 13.7mm intake diameter and easily handles the heavy breathing of the ZDZ 60 with it's rotary drum intake. My ZDZ 60 came with a "BING 48" carb on it. It works great with this engine and I really had no reason to swap it with the WT-540 but I am a "motorhead" and wanted to give it a try.

w8ye

My Feedback: (16)

This timing advance and retard can be miss leading to the tiro

The RCEXL ignition at rest with the engine not running is at full advance. When you set the ignition timing on a RCEXL system, you are setting the total full advance. You can do this by measuring just the sensor itself with the RCEXL sensor testing device or by connecting the powered ignition unit and observing the spark event as the magnet leaves the sensor when turning slowly.

If you flip the prop through fast it will retard the timing.

So with an engine running at idle speed the ignition is at some 12 degrees before top dead center and at 4000 rpm you have 28 degrees before top dead center. This is controlled by a small computer chip iside the ignition module.

There are some ignitions that will, in addition, retard the timing from full advance at sustained high rpm for racing applications but this is beyond the scope of the current discussion.

DemonDean

My Feedback: (4)

Thanks Milton for the response. I think in the link I posted to the Falcon ignition, they use 6mm.
This however convets to, using the magnet method, right around 10 degrees before TDC.
So are we saying that another ignition should work corectly being set to 28 degrees before TDC.

Dean

BadAzzMaxx

The Rcexl will work at 28 deg before top dead center, but do not know if your ignition is the problem or not.

Milton

DemonDean

My Feedback: (4)

Sorry Speedy I missed your post. Yep this one also had a Bing 48 on it. Can't find a rebuild kit for that one either. Now has a WT-71, this model is also discontinued.
So I went looking for your model. Guess....turns out that the one you used is crossable to a WT-834-1. Might give that one a try. I do think that the carb is most of the
problem. I Pm'd Milton and he gave me info on two different Rcexl's to try. The Falcon ignition seems to be working, good spark etc. Just comes in at 10 degs before TDC when
set to 6mm like the instructios say. Very hard to start...no problem drawing fuel. I'd really appreciate any comments or help you care to expand on....

Dean

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

Dean,
You can buy all the original equipment replacement parts for the BING carbs right here:

http://www.bingcarburetor.com/otherapps.html

They are located in Kansas!!

Bing International L.L.C.
1704 South 525 Road
Council Grove, KS 66846


Toll free 1-800-309-2464
[email protected]

They will reply promptly and know what they are talking about. Great guys!


I have a few NIB and good used FALKON ignition modules too.

Agape Racing Has conversion kits to convert the sparkplug cap on your FALKON module to a Rcexl type cap.

http://agaperacingandhobby.com/viewc....php?groupid=5

Hope this helps! If all else fails send me your engine.....I'll get it to run like a Swiss watch ( or a Rolex! ).
SPEEDY

DemonDean

My Feedback: (4)

Thanks.....

Sent out an email to Bing. See if they still have the re-build kits.
Did you ever do the TDC measurement using the Falkon ignition. Timing wheel.
If so what did your TDC come out to??

Dean

w8ye

My Feedback: (16)

RC Extremepower also has all the conversion parts needed for the conversion of the ignition on your ZDZ engine

http://www.rcextremepower.net/ignitions.html

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

Between 6 and 8 degrees BTDC. 10 degrees is a bit much and probably why you are having hard starts.
Are you eyeballing TDC or using an indicator? Does not take much to be off a couple degrees when just eyeballing it.
Also...I use a 7" diameter degree wheel. The larger the wheel to more accurate the setting.

DemonDean

My Feedback: (4)

Thanks Speedy, I'll give that a try. Yes I do have all the dial indicators and such.
I'll go back and place the sensor to 6-8 degrees . I'll have to wait for the rebuild kit as this Bing has
not been used for years. I don't remember seeing those degree settings, only the
millimeter measurement off of the edge of magnet to the sensor.
Anyway thanks again....

Dean

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

What make/size prop are you using and what type of flying are you doing?? Are you using high octane gas (93 octane). The ZDZ's are high compression engines and need 92/93 octane to run properly. I run-in my ZDZ engines on Penzoil Air Cooled or Lawnboy ashless at 32:1 and then after a full gallon run time I switch to STIHL HP ULTRA synthetic at 40:1 and never use anything but a NGK plug in any of my gassers.

Another suggestion is to make sure the sparkplug seats properly between the funky cap that fits between the threaded sparkplug hole in the cylinder and the tapered seat on the sparkplug. I have changed my ZDZ's to a flat seated sparkplug with a washer and converted to the Rcexl type plug cap. I noticed that the original tapered seat type plug did not seat properly and I was getting an air leak in this area causing the compression to drop and making the engine go lean and run hot and erratic.

Take a very close look at this. This might be your problem. Find a nice quiet place and rotate your prop up on compression and listen for the slightest hissing sound. Put your ear right down on the sparkplug area. If it hisses you have found your problem!! You can also use the soapy water trick and look for bubbles.

SPEEDY

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

Will be hiding out somewhere at the beach for a few days for some well deserved R&R.

Goodbye cruel world. Hello Heaven!!!!

SPEEDY

DemonDean

My Feedback: (4)

Hey Speedy....Great ideas.
I like the one about getting rid of the funky spark plug cap. How did you replace the wire on the Falkon ignition?
It looks to be only a good quality coax, like for antennas. Could probably splice in a new piece. And what, where did you get the spark plug boot?

Received a reply from Bing (like you said) but they needed more model information. Hopefully tomorrow I'll have the part number to order a rebuild kit.

Later and thanks for the help so far.....

Dean

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

Just got home from a week of some beautiful Fort Lauderdale,Florida sunshine. I am burnt from head to toe. Good thing I covered up the fragile areas !!!

The conversion kit you will need to replace the plug cap if staying with the 5/8" hex sparkplug is here:

http://agaperacingandhobby.com/viewi...?productid=129

You will want to do away with the tapered seat plug and switch to a flat seat type plug and completely throw away that FUNKY retaining cup that fit inder the old style tapered seat plug. Throw that whole mess in the trash can!

Here is a neat plug chart for NGK plugs. USE IT!! READ IT!! STUDY IT!!

http://www.spark-plugs.co.uk/pages/technical/ngkjpg.htm

Here is another important step. Make sure you get a NGK plug that will give you the proper thread length to get the electrode to the proper depth into the combustion chamber. Too long and you may bottom the electrode into the top of the piston. Too short and you will have poor performance. The positioning of the sparkplug electrode in the combustion chamber will make a BIG difference in how your engine runs! Also notice the different heat ranges designated with a number. The hotter the plug the lower the number. #6 and #7 are the most commonly used heat ranges. I lean towards the #6's when running higher lube mix ratios such as 32:1 or 40:1 on regular octane gas. If you are running high octane gas ( i.e. high compression engines such as the ZDZ ) with 50:1 lube you might want to try a slightly colder plug such as the #7's. For the SPORT flyer the 6's are standard choice but when you get into more demanding engine performance a little tweaking here and there means a lot.

Let me know if I can be of further assistance.


SPEEDY

w8ye

My Feedback: (16)

RC extreme Power also has the coversion parts for your ZDZ ignition

http://www.rcextremepower.net/ignitions.html

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

Please note I am not promoting AGAPE RACING. Jim is just the guy I buy from.

R/C Extreme Power is good and so is Jody at ValleyView RC.

I'm sure there are more. Your choice.

SPEEDY

w8ye

My Feedback: (16)

Milton of RC Extreme Power started this thread. The other guys are good too.

Speedy-Gonzales

My Feedback: (202)

Sorry about that Milton!!!! No harm intended. Like I said I am not promoting any specific distributor. Just the product.

SPEEDY

BadAzzMaxx

No harm, I was just trying to let people know that converting some engines to RCexl ignition is not as hard as it used to be.

Rcexl has done a great job in the last couple years bring us good products we have needed for years.

Milton

Campgems

Ijust put a Rcexl conversion on my Zenoah G-62. Iguessed I was going to gain a little overall weight even though the flywheel weight was going to be less. Turns out I was wrong. Iweighed the stock rotor, coil, and pickup. Total weight is 349gm. The package for the conversion, pickup, rotor,ignition unit, and a couple extra wires, thena 4.8V 2000 mah NiMh batteryand the new weight is302 Gm. 47 grams , 1.58oz less weight. Not bad at all.

Add in that it was a painless conversion, I'm happy

Don

Tony Hallo

Most people claim 1/2 pound, your results and mine agree, with a sub C NiCad the weight is the same. When I converted my GT 80 some time ago the weight was the same with the exception of the spring starter that I had already eliminated.

GizmoMadMax

is there a ZDZ 80 RV KIT?
this is a 10 year old engine and ignition

http://www.flyinggiants.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=63954

thank you.

GizmoMadMax

I talked to TroyBuiltModels.com by phone today regarding my problem child ZDZ80RV, older version, 11 years old; and they said, my Original BING carb can be replaced with a new Walbro WJ71. so it sounds like they are still makeing them.

Does everyone recommend the Walbro over the BING carb?

does anyone know where i can get a BING rebuild kit?