Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine - Part II
09-29-2005, 12:08 AM
#1
Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine - Part II
Folks, I received the engined pictured below in an old Pitts I am going to renovate. On first examination this is going to be a bigger project than I realized. First off I have no paperwork at all and know nothing about this engine. Please bare with me as I work through this and learn.
The engine appears to have no iginition battery. At least I haven't found it yet. So I'm assuming that is a magneto mounted on the front? don't know, as you can see there is a black something on the side of the cowl that wires into the engine. There is also a smoke system on this plane. The switch (top one) is mounted in the cowl and wired with the engine also. There is also some sort of plug in connector like you would plug into the back of a portable radio located below the smoke switch on the cowl and this connector/jack is also wired into the engine.
Can someone start me out here and give me an idea how you stat this thing; when it is hot; etc. I'm going to call horizon tomarrow, but not sure they can help over the phone. But I do really need to try and find a manual for this thing or find out if I need to change it to electronic ignition.
The engine appears to have no iginition battery. At least I haven't found it yet. So I'm assuming that is a magneto mounted on the front? don't know, as you can see there is a black something on the side of the cowl that wires into the engine. There is also a smoke system on this plane. The switch (top one) is mounted in the cowl and wired with the engine also. There is also some sort of plug in connector like you would plug into the back of a portable radio located below the smoke switch on the cowl and this connector/jack is also wired into the engine.
Can someone start me out here and give me an idea how you stat this thing; when it is hot; etc. I'm going to call horizon tomarrow, but not sure they can help over the phone. But I do really need to try and find a manual for this thing or find out if I need to change it to electronic ignition.
09-29-2005, 01:39 AM
#2
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RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
The original ignition appears to have been left in place while experimenting with electronic ignition. Wonder, which one works? Wonder if they both work?
Bill
Bill
09-29-2005, 02:14 AM
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RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
The bracket on the front of the source coil holds a Hall sensor...It looks like a C&H bracket, but the rest is too crude to have come from them...If you connect the red wire from the source coil on the front to the red wire coming from the spark coil the engine will run..The black wire on the source coil is for a ground connection to kill the engine..Almost looks like an early Reichmuth setup, except that Dan used two sensors....
The spark coil is normally behind the source coil with the spark plug wire behind the carb..It doesn't show in the picture, maybe it's been replaced with something else..
Horizon will be no help..
You should check the carb diaphragms before trying to start it..If it's been sitting for a long time it will need a diaphragm kit..
The spark coil is normally behind the source coil with the spark plug wire behind the carb..It doesn't show in the picture, maybe it's been replaced with something else..
Horizon will be no help..
You should check the carb diaphragms before trying to start it..If it's been sitting for a long time it will need a diaphragm kit..
09-29-2005, 03:38 PM
#5
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
What you see is the CH Electronics Jump Start. It allows you to plug in a 6 volt battery and start the G62 with a spark advance near 0 degrees before top dead center. The Hall effect sensor plugs into the 3 wire connector on the ignition module. There is a red wire connected between the magneto coil and the high voltage spark coil. The connector on this red wire is opened and connected to the two red wire connectors coming out of the ignition module. There is a red(+)/black(-) twisted pair coming out of the ignition module that connects to a 4 dry cell 6 volt battery pack. Usually this power cable has a socket mounted on the plane with a corresponding connector on the battery pack. Once you start the engine you remove the battery pack and the engine is running on the magneto. There is a black wire coming off of the magneto coil which, when grounded through a switch, will kill the engine.
This system is far superior to starting a G62 by hand or using a spring starter.
RC that's the way it looks when it comes from CH and it doesn't look crude at all to me. It's only $59.95
After looking back at the second photo in the first post, I noticed that a more positive ignition kill method is used by opening the red wire between the magneto coil and the spark coil with a switch.
splais, you were really fortunate to get the Jump Start with your engine. I use one on my Giant Aeromaster/G62 and love it.
Ken
This system is far superior to starting a G62 by hand or using a spring starter.
RC that's the way it looks when it comes from CH and it doesn't look crude at all to me. It's only $59.95
After looking back at the second photo in the first post, I noticed that a more positive ignition kill method is used by opening the red wire between the magneto coil and the spark coil with a switch.
splais, you were really fortunate to get the Jump Start with your engine. I use one on my Giant Aeromaster/G62 and love it.
Ken
09-29-2005, 10:12 PM
#10
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
Thank you all. It sounds like Bigbird pegged it for me, and tkg, I'll give you a call. Just for fun here is a pic of the plane it's in. I think you can see why I took on this project. She looks great from the top side. bottom side needs some work and the electronics/engine stuff is pretty dated.
10-03-2005, 09:37 PM
#12
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
Please forgive what seem like dumb questions. the way this plane is built I have to remove the engine and firewall to access the fuselage were all the "stuff" is (don't ask). I haven't gotten around to that yet.
so these two pictures show some things I'm still trying to figure out. On the picture of the swtiches I can't figure out what that switch below the plug-in connector hole does. also don't know what plugs into the hole. Maybe nothing. they both may be inactive as this plane has seen a couple of different setups. But anyway does anyone have an idea.
There are two other things that may relate. There is a single white wire runing from the "C" slot on a futaba R129 receiver. that's correct, just a single white wire, no ground wire. I can't tell what it runs to yet.
On the picture of the engine there is a black wire that runs from that pickup unit attached to the crankshaft case. It runs into the firewall. anybody have any idea what it is for. thanks.
PS: While I'm at it, the engine prop backplate is missing the two prop pins. From what I can find it appears these pins are not required. do you agree
so these two pictures show some things I'm still trying to figure out. On the picture of the swtiches I can't figure out what that switch below the plug-in connector hole does. also don't know what plugs into the hole. Maybe nothing. they both may be inactive as this plane has seen a couple of different setups. But anyway does anyone have an idea.
There are two other things that may relate. There is a single white wire runing from the "C" slot on a futaba R129 receiver. that's correct, just a single white wire, no ground wire. I can't tell what it runs to yet.
On the picture of the engine there is a black wire that runs from that pickup unit attached to the crankshaft case. It runs into the firewall. anybody have any idea what it is for. thanks.
PS: While I'm at it, the engine prop backplate is missing the two prop pins. From what I can find it appears these pins are not required. do you agree
10-03-2005, 10:10 PM
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RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
The white single wire was for a dsc cord came with the futaba 9vap plugged into tx and charg jack and allowed you to operate al servos set throws etc without turning tx on. the 9vap also has a tach built into the tx sensor on right side of case worked for 2 3 and 4 bladed props. Sold mine 2 yrs ago after 18 yrs of use .
10-03-2005, 10:26 PM
#14
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine
ORIGINAL: splais
On the picture of the swtiches I can't figure out what that switch below the plug-in connector hole does. also don't know what plugs into the hole. Maybe nothing. they both may be inactive as this plane has seen a couple of different setups. But anyway does anyone have an idea.
There are two other things that may relate. There is a single white wire runing from the "C" slot on a futaba R129 receiver. that's correct, just a single white wire, no ground wire. I can't tell what it runs to yet.
On the picture of the engine there is a black wire that runs from that pickup unit attached to the crankshaft case. It runs into the firewall. anybody have any idea what it is for. thanks.
PS: While I'm at it, the engine prop backplate is missing the two prop pins. From what I can find it appears these pins are not required. do you agree
On the picture of the swtiches I can't figure out what that switch below the plug-in connector hole does. also don't know what plugs into the hole. Maybe nothing. they both may be inactive as this plane has seen a couple of different setups. But anyway does anyone have an idea.
There are two other things that may relate. There is a single white wire runing from the "C" slot on a futaba R129 receiver. that's correct, just a single white wire, no ground wire. I can't tell what it runs to yet.
On the picture of the engine there is a black wire that runs from that pickup unit attached to the crankshaft case. It runs into the firewall. anybody have any idea what it is for. thanks.
PS: While I'm at it, the engine prop backplate is missing the two prop pins. From what I can find it appears these pins are not required. do you agree
Ken
10-04-2005, 08:38 AM
#15
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine - Part II
Thanks, both.
R Plante: So if I understand what you are saying, a person could plug something into the charge jack that allowed you to do what you are saying. In other words, I don't need to worry about that wire right now.
Big Bird: you are probably correct, but this is going to be a long project. the plane is fabric covered/sheeted and custom painted. There are a number of things that will need reconstruction after I find out if I can match the paint. Right now I want to get the plane flight worthy enough to fly and see if a complete restoration will be worth the trouble. Relating to your comment "The single black wire from the source coil will kill the engine if touched to the crank case. It can be used with a kill switch or servo operated micro switch." Perhaps that wire runs to the second switch shown in the picture that I can't seem to find a use for. But there is no return wire to close the circuit. that wire just runs around and into the fuselage front. If this was some kind of kill switch it seems another wire would have to come back out to the engine. Also related to this is the fact that the C&H Jump Start has a switch on the side of the cowl that serves that purpose.
Other unrealted info - this plane had Futaba S130 servos on it. A little research showed that these servos go back about three generations. this project looks like it is going to be kind of fun. First time I every tried doing something like this. Learning all kinds of stuff. the plane has a Bennett smoke system in it to boot.
I got to add a PS to this. I guess I am going to have to demount the engine before a test flight to check things out. I forgot about another ground wire runing from the crankcase back through the firewall. I suspect that amybe this and the black wire mentioned above go to that other switch and act as a kill switch. Still can't figure that round plug-in above the switch.
R Plante: So if I understand what you are saying, a person could plug something into the charge jack that allowed you to do what you are saying. In other words, I don't need to worry about that wire right now.
Big Bird: you are probably correct, but this is going to be a long project. the plane is fabric covered/sheeted and custom painted. There are a number of things that will need reconstruction after I find out if I can match the paint. Right now I want to get the plane flight worthy enough to fly and see if a complete restoration will be worth the trouble. Relating to your comment "The single black wire from the source coil will kill the engine if touched to the crank case. It can be used with a kill switch or servo operated micro switch." Perhaps that wire runs to the second switch shown in the picture that I can't seem to find a use for. But there is no return wire to close the circuit. that wire just runs around and into the fuselage front. If this was some kind of kill switch it seems another wire would have to come back out to the engine. Also related to this is the fact that the C&H Jump Start has a switch on the side of the cowl that serves that purpose.
Other unrealted info - this plane had Futaba S130 servos on it. A little research showed that these servos go back about three generations. this project looks like it is going to be kind of fun. First time I every tried doing something like this. Learning all kinds of stuff. the plane has a Bennett smoke system in it to boot.
I got to add a PS to this. I guess I am going to have to demount the engine before a test flight to check things out. I forgot about another ground wire runing from the crankcase back through the firewall. I suspect that amybe this and the black wire mentioned above go to that other switch and act as a kill switch. Still can't figure that round plug-in above the switch.
10-11-2005, 05:31 PM
#16
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine - Part II
A followup. Got the Zenoah running and had her first couple of flights done. Had removed all the extra wiring and switches, re-did all the plumbing, used the Jump Start and she ran like a top the two times we flew her. I don't think this motor had run for some time, but that didn't seem to hurt her. The only thing I noticed is that it was running a little dirty on the exhaust for using H1R synthetic. Don't know if that was just gunk getting cleaned out, a little to rich, or just the way a Zenoah is. But got to admit that the Zenoah is nice running engine and not all that hard to start.
10-11-2005, 06:14 PM
#17
RE: Need Help with Older Zenoah 62 Engine - Part II
Congratulations! That Jump Start is really easy to use. I'll bet you really like it.
Maybe that engine isn't fully broken in. All gas engines that I've had have put out black nasty specks until they are broken in. I'll assure you that it's not the Belray H1R. The exhaust should clear up after a few more gallons.
Ken
Maybe that engine isn't fully broken in. All gas engines that I've had have put out black nasty specks until they are broken in. I'll assure you that it's not the Belray H1R. The exhaust should clear up after a few more gallons.
Ken
