RichardGee

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I generally fly the pattern, continuously reducing throttle until on final at, probably, 3000 rpm. This provides a gradual sink rate.
When I have the Gee Bee a foot off the runway, I chop it and flair onto the mains. This seems to work well.

On a very rich DA150 at a fairly acute angle, mine said 104 mph on radar. I am confident top speed is considerably faster. Some of the guys are using a 28x14 prop, which would provide higher speed than my 30x12. However, I too am very pleased with whatever speed is being generated by my engine/prop combo and always worry about the possibility of flutter at super high speeds.

dwr

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Well the beast is ready to gojust have to wait for the weather to cooperate. I guess this is the week we get our dose of winter weather. Maybe friday??. Richard, when you wheel the thing on do you feel like it is going too fast? Sure seemed that way to me on the flights I had last summer but then it would roll out ok.

RichardGee

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I never felt like my Gee Bee was landing too fast. I did have a difficult time getting it to line up exactly where I wanted it on the runway as it has some odd handling when rudder is deflected - tends to pitch down with rudder inputs, requiring elevator correction.

I do not slow it enough to 3 point, but really never tried to do that. I decided a wheel landing was the safest way to avoid a stall or aileron reversal - a duplicate of full-scale practice with this plane. YES, it does require a decent length runway to wheel land OR the ability to set it down exactly where needed so as not to run out of runway.

I also have the luxury of a grass runway next to the asphalt. Most of my landings have been on the grass. My impression of the plane is that if you can fly it down to the runway, it actually has good ground handling manners.

Anxious to hear how things go when you fly yours again!

dirtydingus

Hi Guys,

On the issue of props. I have tried a bunch and my conclusion is that anything other than a 30x12 is spinning your wheels. I run a 28x14 Bolly only because of the sound (has a nice rip at full throttle). I lost a bit of vertical but thats fine, it still has plenty of power. This conclusion came after spending $500 on different sizes and brands of props. Also as I mentioned in an earlier thread, the CA Gee Bee flys better at the 100mph range. Anything over that and you need both hands.

I am not sure about aileron reversal in this plane, but I do know that on one occasion just before touch down in a three point attitude, the plane banked 90 deg. the wing contacted the ground and cart-wheeled. Luckily it was on grass that day and only sustained minor damage. If you can call three days work, minor damage. It happened so fast, almost like a snap. When most planes tip stall they fall off to one side or the other. This did not seem to fall. It was like it was it was forced. (MESS WITH THE BULL...)

It's good to hear you Guys are still out there. Get some video. Jim

RichardGee

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Jim,

IF ONLY the purpose behind propping my DA/Gee Bee were to get it to "rip," I would be golden THAT is precisely my quest for different propping as we do have noise constraints at our site. And while I love the sound of my XOAR 30x12, others do not express similar appreciation for its bark[].

I also agree that the 30x12 seems to provide the perfect scale speed and look. Always cognizent of flutter, I truly do not want to go any faster either. Guess I will have to manage the throttle more closely in the future...

Your 3 point landing experience sounds exactly like what happened to Delmar (I believe on his 3rd landing) when he slowed the Gee Bee in an attempt to flair and 3 point. He attributed the aircraft's response to aileron reversal and almost rolled the plane up in a ball! He said it was only his immediate rudder input that prevented total disaster! The result was only a scuffed wingtip.

Byron Originals used to recommend 3-pointing their R2. They even provided flight video of the chief test pilot executing this landing attitude (made it look easy)
I believe Adrian Page also recommends 3 pointing his 1/5 and 1/4 scale R2's, but his are so lighly built, this is probably OK. I would beg to differ on the heavy Byron (Iron Bay) version.

Anyway, it is clear that wheel landing a Gee Bee is the safest idea, but certainly requires a higher speed, longer runway, and pre-planning to properly execute. If one lacks any of these, probably not a good idea to be flying an R1, R2 or Z. My $0.02

dirtydingus

RichardGee,

The Bolly prop does not rip in the normal sense, it is a very fine approach to a rip. Not the normal obnoxious racket. You can hear it on the RCU report.( Monster planes USA )

dwr

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Hi Richard and Jim. Well the Gee Bee made a couple great flights today. No problems and no drama. But I must confess that I was not on the sticks. A friend made me an offer I couldn't refuse so
he got the airplane. I did have some seller's remorse as he did a flyby. Since he was getting used to the airplane most of the flights were at half throttle. That thing really cooks at full throttle even with the 3W100. It gets way out there in a hurry. Ken is a great pilot and flys a variety of large planes. He had no problems with it. He does have time on a Great Planes Gee Bee. Well, keep em rightside
up. Only on the ground tho. DWR.

crazydz

Hi Gee Bee'rs I'm getting ready to start my 33% Wendell Hostetler R2. Having Kit Cutters do the kit and I'm looking forward to the project. Reading all your blogs has really got me fired up. As I get into it any up front tips? Thanks guys and I'll be watching the postings for all your stories and helpful input.

RichardGee

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I would recommend you contact Wayne Parrish (beginning of this thread) as he has built and flown both the CARF Gee Bee R2 and the Hostetler 33% R2.

dirtydingus

DWR,

WHAT THE HELL WERE YOU THINKING?

hotrodblazer

DWR, At least ask the new owner if he would be interested in joining this thread. He can give us his flight impressions, and keep us posted on any developments.
Any lessons learned and shared here can help us all.
Thanks Danny

dwr

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Hi Jim, hey, I never did claim I wasn't crazy. I'll let Ken know about the thread. Here are some pics. The B17 belongs to a WWII vet that crewed in a 17 during 1943. Not a good year to fly in one of those things over Germany. Ken is on the sticks on final approach on the maiden flight. 50 lbs. and 140" span. First flight for him on the Gee Bee same day.

GaGeeBees

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Question for you Gee Bee experts. I picked up a big Gee Bee at a swap meet and need help identifying the manufacturer. I figure if anybody knows, you guys do. The fuse is all fiberglass and the wingspan is approximately 84". I know this isn't much info but does anybody have an idea where this might've come from? Here's a pic:

rcnut101

Thats probaly a Byron/IronBay GeeBee, Looks good from here!

RichardGee

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Hard to tell with just one view. Can you provide side and top views as well?

FYI - Byron's built to a scale 75" wing or 80 inch "sport" wing. Are you sure yours has an 84" span?
Also, your gear do not appear to be Byron as the Byron's did not have the dual 'V' struts. They were a single oleo strut like that used in some of their warbirds.
However, other elements of the plane to appear 'Byron-like'

The Byron/Iron Bay has a fiberglass fuselage, cowl and rudder, foam stab, and built up, sheeted wings

What's it weigh and what's it have for power?

GaGeeBees

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I'll get it out this weekend and take some additional pictures. Thanks for the quick responses guys.

rcnut101

For some reason, northwest hobbies keeps poping in my head, There was some one in NC selling one not long ago, I really need to get my rear going on my GeeBee!!!

RichardGee

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2 more successful flights on Saturday. This plane is turning out to be the next best thing to 'cardio' exercise, as my heart generally races throughout flight #1 of the day. Things are considerably calmer after that.

No issues, except to explore and get more familiar with its quirks -
Loops require LOTS of rudder input to prevent the proverbial cork-screw.
Hard pull outs after diving maneuvers, whether a Cuban 8 or loop, are a no-no, as you can actually feel the airplane's tendency to want to snap. You need to allow PLENTY of altitude for gentle pull-outs!

I flew it without any rudder/throttle mixing and found this to be my own personal preference. I prefer to feel how much P-Factor is affecting the plane with throttle changes.

Also found that once the plane is trimmed to fly straight and level at high speed, a sudden reduction in throttle causes the aircraft to crab to its left, despite the built-in right rudder. Only when the airplane is under power does the engine right thrust and right rudder give straight flight. Power off, and the plane drifts to the left.

And last observation: I am now flying at all times at high rates. I found that LOTS of rudder input is needed on landings and low (starting) rates was not enough for me. Ailerons were also too sluggish (for me) on starting throws. However, high rate elevator resulted in "porpois-ing� on landing approaches, so I added 40% expo on elevator, which seems to be just about right.

The XOAR 30x12 really barks, as mentioned previously, but does provide scale diameter and performance, so I guess my fellow club members will just have to accept that this is a Gee Bee, not a Cub. I am currently collecting donations should the decision be made that I must switch to a carbon fiber prop.

Gee Bee's RULE![8D]

flyierjon

Congrats Richard... I can't wait to get one!! How much right rudder is built in, and is noticeable? Does the full scale have built in right rudder? How bout a video of it in action!! Ohhh and how much ground clearence do you have with the 30 inch prop??

Jon

RichardGee

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Video is absolutely the next step. I will get one together and posted very soon.

The 30" prop is almost exact scale size for this plane and provides adequate ground clearance (I have not measured).
I really would not be comfortable with a 32" prop.

The right rudder is accurate and duplicates the Benjamin/Wolf R2. Some notice it and comment, others do not, but it is quite easy to see.

If you can find any in flight shots with the chase plane directly over Delmar flying his Gee Bee, you will notice the right rudder built into the vertical fin. The model duplicates this exactly.

RichardGee

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OK gents - FINALLY, some video of my Gee Bee.
Note::: This is my first use of Windows Vista and Windows Movie Maker. The music I REALLY wanted to use gave me YouTube copywrite FITS!!![>:] (excuses, excuses...)

The video is of my first flight of the day[:-]

As time permits, I will attempt to make a FAR more professional video (including in-flight cockpit video[8D]), but, hey, better some video than none at all.

ENJOY!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jemTfMES3X0

GaGeeBees

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Great video and excellent flying. Looks like it wants to tuck toward the wheels a little in knife edge. Was that cross wind on the landing? It almost looked like you were flying an intentional slip on the approach.

dirtydingus

Great job RichardGee.

The plane tips up on its wing easy, doesn't it? It has bit me a few times also. But nice landing anyway.

Your prop sure does sing when you get into the throttle. That is a 30x12? If so, it seems your DA has more power than some. Mine will just start to rip a 30x12 but yours is tearing the hell out of it. How many flights now? Jim

RichardGee

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Hey, Hey Jim!

That was flight #11. #12 was MUCH BETTER, but I didn't get in on film (you should have seen the fish I caught later that day as well) I kid not, flight #2 was better simply because I was less nervous and landed it on the grass without mishap.

My DA does indeed rip with the XOAR 30x12. I have been "encouraged" by some other club members to try a quieter prop, but quite honestly, I LOVE the sound and performance with this prop.

The 150 has about 5-6 gallons through it. I am running Pennzoil (air-cooled) 50:1 and premium gas. To be honest, when I ran a friend's Amsoil Saber 100:1, I really think the DA ran even better... a bit cleaner through the mid-range.

Of the 4 landings I have made on the asphalt runway, 2 have resulted in scraped wingtip. I have no mishaps landing on the grass.
The problem with the Gee Bee is that if it gets ahead of the pilot on landing AT ALL, it's just too late.

If a guy were sitting inside the cockpit, the slightest deviation to the left or right would be sensed/felt. Viewed from the side (landing) it is fairly difficult to react to an impending problem on landing. Grass is the savior!

I LOVE THIS PLANE

RichardGee

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You are very observant... yes, there was a slight crosswind and the Gee Bee R2 reacts to crosswinds like a weathervane!
And yes, this Gee Bee does tuck quite aggressively towards the wheels in knife edge. I may yet mix some up elevator with rudder as the Gee Bee also pitches down with rudder deflection, even when flying straight and level. Some elevator mix may help in both flight attitudes.

I tend to avoid mixes until I REALLY know an airplane inside and out, and by that time, the mix just helps lesson my workload. I want to know the plane well enough not to require any mixing. A couple more flights and I may feel I am at that stage with this airplane.

My second flight was better in all respects, but the crosswind was more pronounced and quite a bit of rudder deflection (+ up elevator) and opposite aileron was required on landing.. the 'crabbing' was much more pronounced. My slip was 'intentional' simply to keep things lined up.