WACO YMF
08-19-2008, 08:31 AM
#6901
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RE: WACO YMF
Thanks Ben for the insight. Since the differences are not much, I'll probably build the kit as is and figure a way to switch fom wheels to floats.
x3.
x3.
08-19-2008, 08:49 AM
#6902
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RE: WACO YMF
X3,
Ben is correct, the Pica Kit would take a lot of "bashing" to convert to a UBF-2 (I know 'cause I would like to built a model of one of the ones at CCA and have talked with the Waco Mechanic). The UBF-2s look a lot like the YMFs at first glance, but there are many differences.
1. Vertical Fin and rudder (outline similar but the Vertical Fin/Fuse joint is not covered with a curved fairing).
2. Stab and Elevator are similar to YMF but fairing is different.
3. Fuselage contour (formers), length (20'9" vs 23'4" for the 1935 U/YMF), width, height.
4. Landing gear (I know you want to do floats) is much different than the YMF.
5. Wheel pants have a different shape, Fairings are Fabric covered vs Sheet metal.
6. The wings though are quite similar; a little shorter (29'9" vs 30'), chord is 59" (measured) vs 57" (Paul Matt drawing), ailerons are exactly the same (stock units used on many "F" models).
I am attempting to get some drawings from the owner and if that fails, will go to the NASM to get them.
Some comparison photos (White is YMF Classic NC 14081, Red is UBF NC 12002)
Ben is correct, the Pica Kit would take a lot of "bashing" to convert to a UBF-2 (I know 'cause I would like to built a model of one of the ones at CCA and have talked with the Waco Mechanic). The UBF-2s look a lot like the YMFs at first glance, but there are many differences.
1. Vertical Fin and rudder (outline similar but the Vertical Fin/Fuse joint is not covered with a curved fairing).
2. Stab and Elevator are similar to YMF but fairing is different.
3. Fuselage contour (formers), length (20'9" vs 23'4" for the 1935 U/YMF), width, height.
4. Landing gear (I know you want to do floats) is much different than the YMF.
5. Wheel pants have a different shape, Fairings are Fabric covered vs Sheet metal.
6. The wings though are quite similar; a little shorter (29'9" vs 30'), chord is 59" (measured) vs 57" (Paul Matt drawing), ailerons are exactly the same (stock units used on many "F" models).
I am attempting to get some drawings from the owner and if that fails, will go to the NASM to get them.
Some comparison photos (White is YMF Classic NC 14081, Red is UBF NC 12002)
08-19-2008, 11:16 AM
#6903
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RE: WACO YMF
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
08-19-2008, 12:20 PM
#6904
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RE: WACO YMF
ORIGINAL: LarryN
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
All,
Why not build your own tank in the upper / center wing section like the full size Waco's? Waconut posted center wing section photo's in Post # 6865 that looked identical to an actual center wing section. If you are in a hurry then this would not be a thing to do. If you are taking the time to make your parts look real then it is a perfect add. My dad used to strive to make his models look like real airplanes so that when photographed you could not tell whether or not the plane was full size or a model. He used to like to take two pictures. One showing his model in a position on an aircraft ramp/tarmac with other real airplanes or a hangar in the background and then another picture with my mom by it to show that the first photo was a model.
There are two different model airplane or full size airplane builders. The first builds an airplane to be able to fly it. The second builds an airplane and then starts another one when the completion anxiety hits him from nothing to build. The rule of thumb in building a full size airplane is this; only build an airplane because you simply want to build an airplane. Do not build an airplane for the money or to obtain an airplane to attempt to save money. Building an airplane is something you do because you love to create things. Doing it for the money will only give you first hand experience at earning 10 cents per hour. If you want to own an airplane then go out and buy a Tri Pacer or an old Cessna or a Champ. These will cost you around $20,000 to $45,000 and will get you the same price when selling it 3 years from now. The cost was simply broken down into its operating expenses. If you build an airplane and sell it you will find that you either lost money or gained very little.
If you build for the sake of creation then prolonging the build time is equivalent to staying on vacation an extra 3 days.
Ben
Mr. Lucky
WB #74
08-19-2008, 01:05 PM
#6905
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RE: WACO YMF
ORIGINAL: LarryN
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
You was asking about fuel tank size on my 1/6 scale with the original build size of the fuel tank box I have a DuBro S-12 tank for mine and it is a pretty tight fit, but it does go in. As far as flight time I wouldn't know how long a 12 ounce tank would last with an O.S. FS 91 Surpass since that is the same engine I am going to use in mine, unless the forces of nature enables me to acquire a Saito 100 flat twin which will fit inside the cowling without having to cut any holes for valve covers the only holes requires will be for exhaust and needle valve rods. I would really not like to have to cut any holes in my cowling for valve covers if I don't have to.
As far as building is concerned I am at the road block that I can't get across yet the wing fairings are being a real pain. I sure wish I would have done mine like everybody else and used spackle instead of epoxyµ balloons, at least with the spackle if you need to touch up a low spot youo can throw some on and it stays where you put it with epoxy and micro balloons it likes to run and not stay where it is sopposed to. Dam it all most sounds like I need some cheese to go with the whining!
It is just some advise when you get ready to do your winf fairings.
08-19-2008, 02:34 PM
#6906
Thread Starter
RE: WACO YMF
ORIGINAL: Mr. Lucky
All,
Why not build your own tank in the upper / center wing section like the full size Waco's? Waconut posted center wing section photo's in Post # 6865 that looked identical to an actual center wing section. If you are in a hurry then this would not be a thing to do. If you are taking the time to make your parts look real then it is a perfect add. My dad used to strive to make his models look like real airplanes so that when photographed you could not tell whether or not the plane was full size or a model. He used to like to take two pictures. One showing his model in a position on an aircraft ramp/tarmac with other real airplanes or a hangar in the background and then another picture with my mom by it to show that the first photo was a model.
There are two different model airplane or full size airplane builders. The first builds an airplane to be able to fly it. The second builds an airplane and then starts another one when the completion anxiety hits him from nothing to build. The rule of thumb in building a full size airplane is this; only build an airplane because you simply want to build an airplane. Do not build an airplane for the money or to obtain an airplane to attempt to save money. Building an airplane is something you do because you love to create things. Doing it for the money will only give you first hand experience at earning 10 cents per hour. If you want to own an airplane then go out and buy a Tri Pacer or an old Cessna or a Champ. These will cost you around $20,000 to $45,000 and will get you the same price when selling it 3 years from now. The cost was simply broken down into its operating expenses. If you build an airplane and sell it you will find that you either lost money or gained very little.
If you build for the sake of creation then prolonging the build time is equivalent to staying on vacation an extra 3 days.
Ben
Mr. Lucky
WB #74
ORIGINAL: LarryN
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
All,
Why not build your own tank in the upper / center wing section like the full size Waco's? Waconut posted center wing section photo's in Post # 6865 that looked identical to an actual center wing section. If you are in a hurry then this would not be a thing to do. If you are taking the time to make your parts look real then it is a perfect add. My dad used to strive to make his models look like real airplanes so that when photographed you could not tell whether or not the plane was full size or a model. He used to like to take two pictures. One showing his model in a position on an aircraft ramp/tarmac with other real airplanes or a hangar in the background and then another picture with my mom by it to show that the first photo was a model.
There are two different model airplane or full size airplane builders. The first builds an airplane to be able to fly it. The second builds an airplane and then starts another one when the completion anxiety hits him from nothing to build. The rule of thumb in building a full size airplane is this; only build an airplane because you simply want to build an airplane. Do not build an airplane for the money or to obtain an airplane to attempt to save money. Building an airplane is something you do because you love to create things. Doing it for the money will only give you first hand experience at earning 10 cents per hour. If you want to own an airplane then go out and buy a Tri Pacer or an old Cessna or a Champ. These will cost you around $20,000 to $45,000 and will get you the same price when selling it 3 years from now. The cost was simply broken down into its operating expenses. If you build an airplane and sell it you will find that you either lost money or gained very little.
If you build for the sake of creation then prolonging the build time is equivalent to staying on vacation an extra 3 days.
Ben
Mr. Lucky
WB #74
Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
08-19-2008, 03:41 PM
#6907
RE: WACO YMF
It would be very difficult to build viable tanks into the top wing, by the time you build a structure strong enough to handle the loads there isn't that much volume of room left. At 1/4 scale you could almost do it, at 1/3 I am sure it could be done but I am not sure the effort would be worth the results. Some things are better of just being simulated.
Anthony
Anthony
08-19-2008, 05:32 PM
#6908
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RE: WACO YMF
Thank you for the info and photos. As I dont build for competition, that paint scheme will still look nicee on a future project. While looking for an unusual scheme , to avoid looking like every other waco, I found those cuban wacos and went with my best guess on collors. cuban flag was easyy, fuselage looked like any us warbird of the era so I used silver gray, official usac color. Looked good to me, so i kept it.I am still amazed at how easy the waco flies. AAlmost like a big trainer, as soon as I get over the cost of the project I'm sure I will enjoy flying much more.., THANK TO ALL OF YOU FOR MANY ENTERTAINING AND ENLIGHTENING POSTS. froghair1
08-19-2008, 07:10 PM
#6909
RE: WACO YMF
I stumbled across a web site www.smallparts.com that has all kinds of neat stuff. Example being 0-80 slotted flat head screws that can replicate flat DZUS fasteners. Fine plastic wire mesh for things like air filters and oil coolers.
08-19-2008, 11:48 PM
#6910
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RE: WACO YMF
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
You can do this, but you will need to use a Cline regulator in order to keep the engine from flooding out.
Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
ORIGINAL: Mr. Lucky
All,
Why not build your own tank in the upper / center wing section like the full size Waco's? Waconut posted center wing section photo's in Post # 6865 that looked identical to an actual center wing section. If you are in a hurry then this would not be a thing to do. If you are taking the time to make your parts look real then it is a perfect add. My dad used to strive to make his models look like real airplanes so that when photographed you could not tell whether or not the plane was full size or a model. He used to like to take two pictures. One showing his model in a position on an aircraft ramp/tarmac with other real airplanes or a hangar in the background and then another picture with my mom by it to show that the first photo was a model.
There are two different model airplane or full size airplane builders. The first builds an airplane to be able to fly it. The second builds an airplane and then starts another one when the completion anxiety hits him from nothing to build. The rule of thumb in building a full size airplane is this; only build an airplane because you simply want to build an airplane. Do not build an airplane for the money or to obtain an airplane to attempt to save money. Building an airplane is something you do because you love to create things. Doing it for the money will only give you first hand experience at earning 10 cents per hour. If you want to own an airplane then go out and buy a Tri Pacer or an old Cessna or a Champ. These will cost you around $20,000 to $45,000 and will get you the same price when selling it 3 years from now. The cost was simply broken down into its operating expenses. If you build an airplane and sell it you will find that you either lost money or gained very little.
If you build for the sake of creation then prolonging the build time is equivalent to staying on vacation an extra 3 days.
Ben
Mr. Lucky
WB #74
ORIGINAL: LarryN
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
Another open ended question for the Brotherhood.
I'm building the 1/6 Waco and I had completed the wings before I found the Brotherhood forum. When I built them I wondered about the wimpy wing joiners but I went ahead and used them. Now I see in some of the post where many builders have replaced them with longer ones. Should I cut the wings open and replace them or will they be ok? If there is a history of wings folding then replacing them is a no brainer. [&o]
Progress is slow as I'm cutting a new firewall for the OS 91 surpass and adding spruce stringer behind it. Almost forgot, I'm also changing the tank box area and what size tanks guys have been able to use? I like big tanks so I don't have to worry about running out of fuel.
Thanks
Larry N
WACO Brotherhood #108
All,
Why not build your own tank in the upper / center wing section like the full size Waco's? Waconut posted center wing section photo's in Post # 6865 that looked identical to an actual center wing section. If you are in a hurry then this would not be a thing to do. If you are taking the time to make your parts look real then it is a perfect add. My dad used to strive to make his models look like real airplanes so that when photographed you could not tell whether or not the plane was full size or a model. He used to like to take two pictures. One showing his model in a position on an aircraft ramp/tarmac with other real airplanes or a hangar in the background and then another picture with my mom by it to show that the first photo was a model.
There are two different model airplane or full size airplane builders. The first builds an airplane to be able to fly it. The second builds an airplane and then starts another one when the completion anxiety hits him from nothing to build. The rule of thumb in building a full size airplane is this; only build an airplane because you simply want to build an airplane. Do not build an airplane for the money or to obtain an airplane to attempt to save money. Building an airplane is something you do because you love to create things. Doing it for the money will only give you first hand experience at earning 10 cents per hour. If you want to own an airplane then go out and buy a Tri Pacer or an old Cessna or a Champ. These will cost you around $20,000 to $45,000 and will get you the same price when selling it 3 years from now. The cost was simply broken down into its operating expenses. If you build an airplane and sell it you will find that you either lost money or gained very little.
If you build for the sake of creation then prolonging the build time is equivalent to staying on vacation an extra 3 days.
Ben
Mr. Lucky
WB #74
Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
I look at you guys as real artists. It's easy to make something to full size because we can buy parts that are made for everything. Making a 1/5 or 1/6 scale model you have to know how to make everything in miniature and make it look like the real thing.
I just thought that making all the parts and extending your build time is like reading a real long book. I always hated reading 250 page books. They ended just when they were starting to get good. I always like the "Epic Novels" at 900 pages.
It sounded good didn't it!?
Ben
08-20-2008, 10:25 PM
#6911
RE: WACO YMF
Hello all
I have started covering and things are going pretty good. I would like to order the pinking tape and have it on hand. Can some one tell me the best place to order it? I’m using solortex covering. Also is there any information on were it all goes? I will check on the index page and see if I can find any information.
Thanks for any info you can give me.
I have started covering and things are going pretty good. I would like to order the pinking tape and have it on hand. Can some one tell me the best place to order it? I’m using solortex covering. Also is there any information on were it all goes? I will check on the index page and see if I can find any information.
Thanks for any info you can give me.
08-20-2008, 10:41 PM
#6912
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RE: WACO YMF
Did you Know you can buy shears and cut you own. At any sewing shop. Then you have all the tape you could ever need. That is what I have done and they work great
08-21-2008, 12:46 AM
#6913
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RE: WACO YMF
Dan,
The tape is placed wherever the frame work is touched by the covering. Helps prevent vibration wear.
On the wings - all ribs are taped (and stitched), then the leading/trailing edges, wing tips, any penetrations (strut fittings, flying wires, fuel tank filler caps and vents etc.).
On the fuselage - all stringers, edges around doors/hatches, penetrations (landing gear fittings, control cable exits), were fairings contact over the covering, etc. Any place that will be subject to stress or abrasion or needs to be kept from tearing/elongating (penetrations). The unpainted Waco is YKS-7 NC 17457, the painted Waco is UBF-2 NC 12002. Note the overlaps and tapered ends where the stringer stops at the bulkhead.
The full size Wacos use 2" tape on the stringers and ribs and 4" on the leading edges of the wing. The stab/elevator and fin and rudder use smaller tape. The tape on the ribs and tail surfaces also help the rib stiching from pulling thru the fabric covering. The fuselage tapes are not stitched. If you have a subject aircraft nearby and available, you may want to actually measure the tapes and stitching spacing in various places to be sure (write the measurements and locations down).
Scale Rib Stitch http://home.cablerocket.com/~scaleribstitch/ has premade stitching. Gary at Get Stencils http://www.getstencils.com/ still makes Pink-It out of Solar Tex. I believe Balsa USA, Sig and a few others have premade tape in various widths. Cutting your own tape from the same material as the base covering prevents incompatability.
The tape is placed wherever the frame work is touched by the covering. Helps prevent vibration wear.
On the wings - all ribs are taped (and stitched), then the leading/trailing edges, wing tips, any penetrations (strut fittings, flying wires, fuel tank filler caps and vents etc.).
On the fuselage - all stringers, edges around doors/hatches, penetrations (landing gear fittings, control cable exits), were fairings contact over the covering, etc. Any place that will be subject to stress or abrasion or needs to be kept from tearing/elongating (penetrations). The unpainted Waco is YKS-7 NC 17457, the painted Waco is UBF-2 NC 12002. Note the overlaps and tapered ends where the stringer stops at the bulkhead.
The full size Wacos use 2" tape on the stringers and ribs and 4" on the leading edges of the wing. The stab/elevator and fin and rudder use smaller tape. The tape on the ribs and tail surfaces also help the rib stiching from pulling thru the fabric covering. The fuselage tapes are not stitched. If you have a subject aircraft nearby and available, you may want to actually measure the tapes and stitching spacing in various places to be sure (write the measurements and locations down).
Scale Rib Stitch http://home.cablerocket.com/~scaleribstitch/ has premade stitching. Gary at Get Stencils http://www.getstencils.com/ still makes Pink-It out of Solar Tex. I believe Balsa USA, Sig and a few others have premade tape in various widths. Cutting your own tape from the same material as the base covering prevents incompatability.
08-21-2008, 05:53 AM
#6914
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RE: WACO YMF
hi i've been gone for a bit but back now , and maidend my 1/5 th yesterday no issues at all flys great , by the way it has a g-26 up front lots of power cruse at 1/2 throt , have to work on landings a bit tricky, but no nose overs yet ha ha picsa in a couple of days. good job anthony.
08-21-2008, 08:10 AM
#6916
RE: WACO YMF
John,
Thanks for the info and all the great pic you posted. I see from your pictures it will take a lot of tape. I did cut my own tape for my ¼ cub with the wife’s pinking sheers but I think the cuts where way to big. I will see if I can buy some closer to the correct size if not I will order it from one of your suggestions.
Thinks again
Thanks for the info and all the great pic you posted. I see from your pictures it will take a lot of tape. I did cut my own tape for my ¼ cub with the wife’s pinking sheers but I think the cuts where way to big. I will see if I can buy some closer to the correct size if not I will order it from one of your suggestions.
Thinks again
08-21-2008, 08:22 AM
#6917
Thread Starter
RE: WACO YMF
ORIGINAL: mrdhud
John,
Thanks for the info and all the great pic you posted. I see from your pictures it will take a lot of tape. I did cut my own tape for my ¼ cub with the wife’s pinking sheers but I think the cuts where way to big. I will see if I can buy some closer to the correct size if not I will order it from one of your suggestions.
Thinks again
John,
Thanks for the info and all the great pic you posted. I see from your pictures it will take a lot of tape. I did cut my own tape for my ¼ cub with the wife’s pinking sheers but I think the cuts where way to big. I will see if I can buy some closer to the correct size if not I will order it from one of your suggestions.
Thinks again
Go by your local Michaels Craft Store. Look in the paper craft section. They will have a set of pinking shears for paper crafts that has a small pink cut. These are called paper trimmers. You can get a pair for about 4 bucks.
Now, go to Wally-World, and buy some hair curling paper. This is kind of like tissue, but is stronger. When you cut it and put it on the plane, the detail is the right size, and it doesn't stick out like a sore thumb as it will if you use the same covering material as you are using on the plane. The pinking paper trimmer will not cut cloth, so don't even try to do that with them.
Remember, when adding scale detail to a fifth scale model, you should be able to see the same detail on the model at 10 feet that you can see on the full scale model at 50 feet. If your detail is too visible, it makes the model look fake and heavy.
Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
08-21-2008, 11:52 AM
#6918
RE: WACO YMF
Bill,
Thanks for the info I will run up the craft store and Wal-Mart today and see what I can find. I told myself after cutting all the pinking tape for my cub I would never do it again (never say never) lol lol.
As you know, I’m not far from Fantasy of flight on Polk city I took my granddaughter up in the Biplane they have I think it was a Stearman I’ll try to go out this weekend (weather permitting) and get some pictures that should help me.
Here are some pics so far I’m happy with the covering job not a show piece but not bad for me.
Thanks for the info I will run up the craft store and Wal-Mart today and see what I can find. I told myself after cutting all the pinking tape for my cub I would never do it again (never say never) lol lol.
As you know, I’m not far from Fantasy of flight on Polk city I took my granddaughter up in the Biplane they have I think it was a Stearman I’ll try to go out this weekend (weather permitting) and get some pictures that should help me.
Here are some pics so far I’m happy with the covering job not a show piece but not bad for me.
08-21-2008, 06:04 PM
#6920
RE: WACO YMF
Dan,
Your "Gitin Er Done" if you ask me. Looks good from here.
John,
What an excellant opportunity to photographically document the rebuild of the YKS. Those guys are true craftsmen. I have a question that is going to expose some lack of knowledge (ignorance) here. What is the significance of the green pigment in the dope they are using over the pinking tape. How many coats of dope do they apply to the covering before adding the pinking tape?
Your "Gitin Er Done" if you ask me. Looks good from here.
John,
What an excellant opportunity to photographically document the rebuild of the YKS. Those guys are true craftsmen. I have a question that is going to expose some lack of knowledge (ignorance) here. What is the significance of the green pigment in the dope they are using over the pinking tape. How many coats of dope do they apply to the covering before adding the pinking tape?
08-21-2008, 09:11 PM
#6922
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RE: WACO YMF
Rick,
The quest for knowledge is always enlightening. The green tinted stuff is not dope but the fabric sealer. It is tinted so you can see where you put it easier. The fabric is attached with a clear cement. Full size aircraft require the extra "stick" the adhesive has over dope, which is fine for models. The 6 step procedure (for full size, paraphased from the Poly-Fiber handout) is as follows;
1. Glue on the fabric with adhesive. Tighten the fabric with a calabrated clothing iron (NO HEAT GUNS). Temperature is important.
2. Brush on the fabric sealer.
3. Riblace and the apply any gussets and tapes with sealer.
4. Spray on 2 more coats of sealer.
5. Spray on 3 cross coats of silver to protect against UV radiation.
6. Spray on 3 coats of top coat paint.
I did not mention the specific products but they could be used if desired, may end up heavier than dope. There are products designed for models (Balsa Rite and Stix-It I believe are just 2 of the adhesives). Dope, non-tautening nitrate can be used for the adhesive and sealer, silver dope for the UV coat and your choice of colored dope for the top coat. Remember Butyrate over Nitrate, it won't work the other way.
The YKS at CCA was taken to a local body shop (owned by one of the CCA owners) about 5 miles away to have the dope/paint applied in a profesional spray both (no bugs or dust to mar the finish).
Poly-Fiber web site is http://www.polyfiber.com/ Read Poly-Fibers Tech Questions for more indepth information on full size covering. Randolph dopes website is http://www.randolphdopes.com
Another full scale product is Ceconite (used with dope).
The quest for knowledge is always enlightening. The green tinted stuff is not dope but the fabric sealer. It is tinted so you can see where you put it easier. The fabric is attached with a clear cement. Full size aircraft require the extra "stick" the adhesive has over dope, which is fine for models. The 6 step procedure (for full size, paraphased from the Poly-Fiber handout) is as follows;
1. Glue on the fabric with adhesive. Tighten the fabric with a calabrated clothing iron (NO HEAT GUNS). Temperature is important.
2. Brush on the fabric sealer.
3. Riblace and the apply any gussets and tapes with sealer.
4. Spray on 2 more coats of sealer.
5. Spray on 3 cross coats of silver to protect against UV radiation.
6. Spray on 3 coats of top coat paint.
I did not mention the specific products but they could be used if desired, may end up heavier than dope. There are products designed for models (Balsa Rite and Stix-It I believe are just 2 of the adhesives). Dope, non-tautening nitrate can be used for the adhesive and sealer, silver dope for the UV coat and your choice of colored dope for the top coat. Remember Butyrate over Nitrate, it won't work the other way.
The YKS at CCA was taken to a local body shop (owned by one of the CCA owners) about 5 miles away to have the dope/paint applied in a profesional spray both (no bugs or dust to mar the finish).
Poly-Fiber web site is http://www.polyfiber.com/ Read Poly-Fibers Tech Questions for more indepth information on full size covering. Randolph dopes website is http://www.randolphdopes.com
Another full scale product is Ceconite (used with dope).
08-21-2008, 10:30 PM
#6923
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RE: WACO YMF
Dan,
You can buy pure polyester pinked tape from F&M Enterprise. (http://www.stits.com/index) They make Stits Lite for models. They have it in several sizes. It is heat shrinkable, which makes it nice for wrapping trailing edges and wing tips. It has no adhesive or sizing, so you will have to decide on dope, Balsarite, etc.
Larry's suggestion is also good, except I could never cut it straight enough.
Good luck
You can buy pure polyester pinked tape from F&M Enterprise. (http://www.stits.com/index) They make Stits Lite for models. They have it in several sizes. It is heat shrinkable, which makes it nice for wrapping trailing edges and wing tips. It has no adhesive or sizing, so you will have to decide on dope, Balsarite, etc.
Larry's suggestion is also good, except I could never cut it straight enough.
Good luck
08-22-2008, 10:59 AM
#6925
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RE: WACO YMF
ORIGINAL: mrdhud
All
Thanks for the good words on the covering job It’s defiantly different from the norm (being monokote) I believe I’d pull my hair out trying to cover in monokote.
germrb
Thanks for the info I’ll check out F&M Enterprise
All
Thanks for the good words on the covering job It’s defiantly different from the norm (being monokote) I believe I’d pull my hair out trying to cover in monokote.
germrb
Thanks for the info I’ll check out F&M Enterprise
Dan that is a nice covering job, but I was looking at the pic's and out of curiousity how are you attaching the turtle deck/head rest to the plane, or are you going without it.