Poor service and support in Kit Industry
#26
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From: Montgomery, IL
Originally posted by phoon
"Mike is an artist. He's developing artistic talent, technique and skill, and making progress. He seeks to build replicas of various famous airplanes through the history of flight from the turn of the last century. He's never quite satisfied with his work (no artist is), and he's hoping for greater realism in his next project.
Come on upstairs and take a look at his latest effort. It's in a "skeleton" stage.
And you know what? The amazing part is that Mike's art is kinetic. His artistic replicas actually fly!"
"Mike is an artist. He's developing artistic talent, technique and skill, and making progress. He seeks to build replicas of various famous airplanes through the history of flight from the turn of the last century. He's never quite satisfied with his work (no artist is), and he's hoping for greater realism in his next project.
Come on upstairs and take a look at his latest effort. It's in a "skeleton" stage.
And you know what? The amazing part is that Mike's art is kinetic. His artistic replicas actually fly!"
:idea:
I've printed this out for the wife. I have asked her to memorize and use this inserting my name where required.
#28

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phoon said:
"Item#8: RC Report reported that Sig, the most highly revered kit manufacturer with a long history, has been bought out by a conglomerate, and the high quallity and experienced designers such as Mike Gretz and others no longer work there. "
I've only a 'couple' of issues with me and can't find that...do you know which issue?
Also, some of your comments are noteworthy and will be 'inwardly digested'......
Jerry
"Item#8: RC Report reported that Sig, the most highly revered kit manufacturer with a long history, has been bought out by a conglomerate, and the high quallity and experienced designers such as Mike Gretz and others no longer work there. "
I've only a 'couple' of issues with me and can't find that...do you know which issue?
Also, some of your comments are noteworthy and will be 'inwardly digested'......
Jerry
#29
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From: Claremont,
ON, CANADA
All good posts (well mostly).
I take exception to limiting modelling to hobby or art.
Contrary to it's status in my country, I enjoy competing (scale, Funfly, combat, aerobatics etc.) and in this aspect think of it as a sport.
Many countries classify modelling (at least the competitive portion of it) as a sport and enjoy the associated financial support of their government. And why not? Why should rc competition be classified less than skeet shooting?
I take exception to limiting modelling to hobby or art.
Contrary to it's status in my country, I enjoy competing (scale, Funfly, combat, aerobatics etc.) and in this aspect think of it as a sport.
Many countries classify modelling (at least the competitive portion of it) as a sport and enjoy the associated financial support of their government. And why not? Why should rc competition be classified less than skeet shooting?
#30
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I gotta contact Uncle Sam about buying me a new radio. I'll mention that right after I talk to him about the money he owes me for not growing corn. You see, I just found out that the farmers here are getting paid by the govt for NOT growing corn, and I wanna know where MY money is! I haven't grown corn for YEARS!
#34
RCU Forum Manager/Admin
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I'll throw my couple penny's worth in here. I'd like to make a comment on Dave Patrick models. I purchased the DP Ultimate Bipe/YS 120 combo from them. My complaint definately isn't about the plane/motor, because they are in short beautiful. Fantastically built and flies like a dream. My complaint is about their customer support/service. When I was considering the purchase I emailed them several times and received very prompt and informative responses. But that all ended as soon as the check was cashed. I emailed them 3 times to ask a question after I had the plane and all three went unanswered. I own a consulting firm, so I find this totally unacceptable. What??? They think that I've bought my plane and won't ever buy another one??? In my mind, customer service after the sale is MORE important than before.
For Dave's sake, I hope I never crash this one and need to buy another one!!!
For Dave's sake, I hope I never crash this one and need to buy another one!!!
#35
Banned
Wow...very interesting reading in this one...scared to ask what you fellas think about the RCU Magazine and it's reviews here 
I will say we are new at it. We are tweaking layouts and formulas. We will be very honest in the reviews as the guys doing this stuff are NOT professional writers and we do not pay them to write their reviews. They are modelers just like us and I encourage HEAVILY those who think there is a better review they could do that they simply submit it to me for possible inclusion.
As far as annoying advertisers I would imagine there is a quid pro quo expected when reviewing items for ALL magazines. How often will somebody advertise with them when they just bash their products all the time? My take on this is that if a review is so bad and damaging that we will notify the manufacturer of it and allow them to resolve it. We may not publish it until they have addressed the issues at hand. By the time these things have been addressed it might make for a better product and a better review. We have pointed out in our reviews the things we encountered in either building or flying that we did not like.
I think if RCU becomes more of a "consumer reports" type entity in terms of reviews it will ultimately go farther with the users. There may be a hit in advertising but you guys will all donate to make up the slack, right?
Many of my experiences have been very positive dealing with many companies in this business and even more so recently. I have been lucky so far overall with few highly inferior products crossing my path. Not that many have not needed improvements but few that were total washouts or beyond help. I do understand this isn't always the case though with everyone.
Also as Mr. Christiansen came on to straighten out the erroneous info I would hope all companies care enough to step forward here in these forums and support the buyers of their products and help to correct any misinformation which might be disseminated.
Just my 23 cents worth tonight.

I will say we are new at it. We are tweaking layouts and formulas. We will be very honest in the reviews as the guys doing this stuff are NOT professional writers and we do not pay them to write their reviews. They are modelers just like us and I encourage HEAVILY those who think there is a better review they could do that they simply submit it to me for possible inclusion.
As far as annoying advertisers I would imagine there is a quid pro quo expected when reviewing items for ALL magazines. How often will somebody advertise with them when they just bash their products all the time? My take on this is that if a review is so bad and damaging that we will notify the manufacturer of it and allow them to resolve it. We may not publish it until they have addressed the issues at hand. By the time these things have been addressed it might make for a better product and a better review. We have pointed out in our reviews the things we encountered in either building or flying that we did not like.
I think if RCU becomes more of a "consumer reports" type entity in terms of reviews it will ultimately go farther with the users. There may be a hit in advertising but you guys will all donate to make up the slack, right?

Many of my experiences have been very positive dealing with many companies in this business and even more so recently. I have been lucky so far overall with few highly inferior products crossing my path. Not that many have not needed improvements but few that were total washouts or beyond help. I do understand this isn't always the case though with everyone.
Also as Mr. Christiansen came on to straighten out the erroneous info I would hope all companies care enough to step forward here in these forums and support the buyers of their products and help to correct any misinformation which might be disseminated.
Just my 23 cents worth tonight.
#36
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From:
On the positive side, I've had very good customer service from Midwest. Have built a couple of their planes (Extra twice and AT6). There were a couple of missing parts and they shipped them the day after I called. I had a few questions when building and got prompt, courteous replies from the technical dept. The kits are good, prices reasonable, the planes were great flyers, good customer service both in terms of technical assistance and things like replacement of missing or faulty parts . . . . Seems like a good company to deal with.
vtsmx
vtsmx
#37
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From: New Port Richey, FL
Item #10: After I bought Great Planes Real Flight simulator, I was told it won't run under Windows 2000 Professional Operating system, the flag ship and highest quality Op Sys Microsoft ever produced. No explanation. A year later, it still won't. I can't run it.
I was running Real Flight on Win2k a year ago. NOT G2, but the 'original' Real Flight. There is a patch/update available on their website, or at least it was a year ago.
I was running Real Flight on Win2k a year ago. NOT G2, but the 'original' Real Flight. There is a patch/update available on their website, or at least it was a year ago.
#38

This has been a real interesting thread to read and I found the ARF part a little bothersome because for many others like myself Building is not always possible, I started with electrics? because I have 2 kids (2 1\2 and 6 yr old) and did not have the time or space and I finally did get a kit (Herr x250) and built it (excellent quality) on my desk in front of my PC and when I got into glow I just had no space or time to build a kit with a 53 inch span so I got a ARF. I have moved since and have a little more space to build and have a Midwest kit in the waiting but if it where not for ARF planes many would not be able to (Myself included) be active in this Hobby. I am far from the age of retiring and I'm sure many here are not retired but I personally have little spare time with the children and full time work to build everything I fly. I love this Hobby and many have told me I fly like a natural because of the planes others let me fly and how well I do with them and trim them out for them. I also fly some combat at 80+ mph and I credit it 90% to ARFs. This may not sound too impressive and by no means am I trying to blow my own horn but Last June was my 1-year anniversary. For my first flight ever and without an ARF I would not be able to fly nearly as much or as well as I can now. I do agree building should be a part of the learning curve but not all of us are able to build for many reasons and ARFs are a very good alternative to not flying at all.
Dauntae
Dauntae
#39
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From: Austin,
TX
Daunte, all we are saying about ARFs is don't offer an ARF without also offering the kit.
I'm in the same boat as you. I don't have the time to build sometimes so I buy an ARF. Nothing wrong with that as ARF's are getting pretty good. But it's annoying when I DO want to build something and the only thing you can find it in is an ARF.
I'm in the same boat as you. I don't have the time to build sometimes so I buy an ARF. Nothing wrong with that as ARF's are getting pretty good. But it's annoying when I DO want to build something and the only thing you can find it in is an ARF.
#40
Member
SIG........ you bet .........glad I still have that ZLIN in the box just waiting.To bad they still didn't have all those great scale kits. just a few up grades and they'd be great seller's again but time goes on. kits come and go. Should have bought more of them .
Riley
Riley



