Started this kit this past weekend. Wow, this thing is tough. The build itse'f is not really tough (although I still have to get the retracts in, wing sheeted, and fuse built. Then, I have to get the stab placed correctly, and the fin installed THROUGH the stab and into a former, and those lovely wing fairings......ughhh, I digress). Anyway, the instructions SUCK! I know this is an intermediate to advanced build, and I've built two kits (one contender and another 1/2 A kit). THe contender was a gold edition as well, and the instructions were pretty good on it. These Texan instructions are the pits! Has anyone else had this problem with this kit? The finished product will be well worth it, but getting to that point might take all year!

We built the stab, fin, elevators, rudder, right and left outboard wing panels in just under eight hours--that was three of us working non-stop, while I did the stab, the others did the elevators. While I did the fin, they did the rudder. While I built one half of the wing, the other half was being built across the table. Pretty cool way to build a kit (if you have the help).

back to the story--this thing might do me in for kits, I don't know. I wasn't going to start it until late spring, early summer, but I was in a building mood, so I dug it out and started. I'm glad I did, but now I'm dreading the rest of it because of the stupid instructions being so vague. The plans are great, but the instructions suck.

have I mentioned how much I hate the instructions?

Thanks for listening.....

The good news is that the more you build, the less you need instructions... Instruction booklets are relatively new - "Back in the day", all we had was the plans with a few notes on 'em, and maybe a pic of the finished model. When it comes to the instruction manual, it eventually is relegated to the "source of last resort" if a builder is stuck...

Some instructions are better than others, even from the same manufacturer, as you found out the hard way... Building is a lot of fun, and I suggest you get some feedback from the folks here before you launch on your next project! No sense in repeating your agony on your next kit...

Cheers!

Jim

Don't despair, I just finished my Gold Edition a few weeks ago and flew it this weekend. I used an OS 61 with the scale header to keep it in the cowl, love the sound. Yes, the instructions are reeeeal vague on a few points, like gas tank installation, but hey....Here are a few tips I have for you:

Flaps: Good idea, but be careful. I built them as they instructed and had a hell of a time getting them to fit in there. The 1/64th ply strip that goes across the top as a cap strip can be a real pain - along with keeping it all straight so you don't have a gap with the flaps closed. I had so many problems getting everything to work, I just tack glued the flaps shut and land fast.

Retracts: If you're using them, plan them early. Although the instructions tell you to figure out the well liners later, do it before you do the bottom sheeting. I had to remove a lot of material to get the retracts to fit in their wells nicely, and there is no instruction or advice given on how to put the gear leg doors on. Also, no provisions are given in the plans to routing the air lines BEFORE you sheet, or have a way to get them in there after you sheet. Yes, they tell you to cut a 1/2 inch hole in the ABS center fairing for them, but divine intervention is required to get a blue and red Robart air line to snake through three ribs with no holes and around corners to end up in the retract wells.

Fuel Tank: Plan early and look long and hard for one that will fit in the space provided - and give you flight time. I could not find the recommended tank that would fit into that space. You will also need to construct a tank floor out of some scrap to keep the tank at the right level for your carb. The "hover technique" shown on the plans is a mystery to me.

Wing filets: No problem, just cut them a bit oversive and sand your way down to a good fit.

Fin/Stab alignment: Trial fit repeatedly until you get everything square. Not having the hole in the stab in exactly the right place can make it impossible to get your fin straight.

Wing/Stab incidence: If you don't have an incidence meter, borrow one. I didn't use the one I have and had a hell of a time getting my plane to land the first flight. Wing had too much positive incidence relative to the fuselage level line, made it want to climb too much.

With all of that said - it is a beautiful airplane. It flies wonderfully and is very aerobatic, and the hard work on the control surfaces is worth the attention you get at the flying field. My modifications will be to fiberglass the wing and paint it, but cover the control surfaces in a fabric covering like the real things. I will glass the wing because getting that center fairing in tight, and then covering are a pain.

Good Luck!!!

skydeuce.
Thanks for all of thetips. I have a question. On the stab--the instructions say something about gluing in the stab supports (or something like that, I don't have the instructions with me right now), but not to glue the stab in at this time. I looked through the whole book and it never tells you when to go back and glue in the stab. Should I go ahead and glue it all in when I get to that point?
Also, how big of a PITA is that hidden elevator clevise going to be? I'm dreading that thing. Did you use the solder on clevice, or use a screw on? I guess once you put that thing in and sheet/cover the fuse, that's it--it's there for good? all adjustments are made at the servo?
I have an incidence meter at my disposal. If I remember right the stab is supposed to have a +1. I don't remember the main wing. Do the saddles not give the incidence by default?

So what was the problem with the flaps? They wouldn't close all the way--had gaps? I couldn't figure out for the longest about that 1/16 ply strip. It said to sand it down to 1/32 on one edge (create a bevel) and then tells you to install it bevel side up, but doesn't say whether the bevel should be aft or fore. I did some reading back and found out that it was aft (I hope). That's how I installed it. What is the purpose of this bevel? It is on the top (away from the flaps) and to the aft of the wing. Is it just for airfoil? What if I didn't get it sanded exactly to 1/32? I think the thing is straight. I put the balsa strip on it to keep it straight, and didn't push any of the rib tips down to make contact--I just filled in any gaps with glue. So, should I just scrap the whole flaps idea now before I do all of the work?

I am putting in two aileron servos in mine. I don't like the bell-crank idea. It's silly to have two flap servos and only one aileron servo. That didn't make any sense at all to me. They should have put the bellcrank on t he flaps, IMO. Oh well. I guess I'll have eight servos in this bad boy.

I will be installing the retracts. That is why I didn't build the center section of the wing yet. I don't have them. I'm buying them off of a friend and he hasn't delivered them yet.

As soon as I get the retracts, I'll build that center section, run the air lines, and sheet the thing up.

How long does it take to build the center section, glue it all together, and sheet the thing? What about the fuse, how long did that take you? I've spent about 8 hours so far, and figure I have at least 20 or so more to get everything framed up and sheeted. Then the covering, then the radio setup--Maybe by Christmas....

Thanks for all of your help! I may be e-mailing you as time goes on if I don't understand something. Would that be ok?

You making a good attempt so far. But as you can see the kit " WAS " intended for the intermediate to advanced builder. As far as building kits goes (and I'm not being mean) you still are pretty much a beginner. I built about three dozen or more kits before getting to any of the TF Gold Addition kits. A believe me there have been much more difficult kits to build then TF's.
Glue the stab on when you have squared it up to the fuse and have checked the incidence. This is some time after you have sheeted the top half of the fuse. Because you will be setting the rudder fin on shortly there after.
On the elevator clevis, you can use what makes you feel will work the best. But if you use a metal clevis make sure it's a snug fit. And you may want to build a access hatch to it to check it from time to time. It's not as hard as it sounds.
Two aileron servos is good, I did that on mine, works great.
The flaps are just time consuming, not that hard, just takes time to make sure it's all lined up. And if any of the wood is warped or questionable, replace it.
You can start the center section now if you'd like. Just stop where they tell you it's time to install the retract rails. And take the time to beef up that area where the rails mount. One good hard landing and the mounts will pull out. A friend of mine didn't do that with his and after the third accurance we added some more material the landing gear stayed in.
They don't show the landing gear door covers because they leave a lot of scale details up to you. And a lot of guys won't even try. Me included! I just wanted it to fly. And it's fun to fly.
I've worn mine out.
Good Luck and Have Fun !!!!

Doug,
there's no doubt I'm a beginner. I'm a beginner to all of this. I've been flying for almost a year now, and I have five planes in my hanger, and the sixth one will be the Texan. In my hanger I have the contender (a low wing, hot landing airplane with flaps), a great planes big stick, a hobbico twinstar, a .10 sized chea pass (house of balsa kit), and my trainer which has been modified to a bolt-on, semi-synmmetrical airfoil wing. I can't wait to get the texan built, but it will probably be this summer before I complete it. I'm a football coach, and we are about to start spring practice, which will comsume all of my time until May. When school is out, I'll have a couple of weeks to get it completed before I have to go back to work. By the time I complete it, I will have surpassed my first year of flying. I'm pretty comfortable at the sticks now, and I fly the Texan on the sim all the time. What are some flight characteristics that I might need to be careful of?
I think I'll put my saito 100 in it, or a magnum 91. I have the 100 in the big stick right now, but I might put the magnum in the stick, and pull the 100 for the texan. What do you think?
thanks for the input.....

Both engines will be fine, but the 1.00 will over power it a bit. I flew mine with a ST .75 and the TF in cowl exhaust. Very adequate power. Also ran a glow driver because of the slanted engine installation. Not required if you get the engine adjusted properly, but sure gave some piece of mine.
When flying the T-6 don't try to land to slowly. Even with flaps a bit of power is safer than trying to walk it in for a landing. To slow and the model can and will tip stall, OUCH !!![:@] That will hurt.
Takeoffs are pretty striaght forward. You will use rudder on takeoff, a bit more with the 1.00. I don't advise you fly it like a sport model. You know crazy crankin and bankin, climbin and divin until you know what she flys like.
Stay with the recommended slow rates on the elavator. The model is a bit pitch sensative even when a little nose heavy. Mine was ! And make sure your control surfaces are as close as possible on the hinge lines. To much of a gap has an adverse affect. A buddy of mine had to much on his ailerons. After we sealed them with some clear tape, control improved.
Above all take your time. And have fun Coaching !!!

Thanks doug, good info! I can't wait to get this thing finished now!

Sorry for the delay getting back to you.

Had a difficult landing with mine this weekend. Thing is pretty darn fast and just won't slow down. I've gone back in and reinforced the front landing gear retract mounting rails with some triangle stock and epoxy, after ripping one out. I will finally hook up the flaps this week too. I'm only flying a OS 61 with a 13x6 on the nose, but she's still real fast.

Doug is right on the money about treating it gently until you get it figured out. I had a pretty good wind going this weekend, coming straight down the runway. Use plenty of runway and don't try to jerk it up into the air from a three point stance. Let the tail come up, gain more speed, and then gently climb out to pick up more speed. Gentle turns, about 15-25 degrees bank until you get used to it. Those wide wings will catch air pretty easy and complete a roll without using your ailerons if you're not careful.

On the wing incidence, it should be pre-set in the saddle at 3/4 degrees down. While you have it in the bones, make sure and check all incidences while you can still make corrections.

With my flaps, I wasn't happy with the way everything lined up. It was clearly my haste in building and frustration with putting that much work into flaps that caused my errors. I will only be using the two outer flaps and not the middle flap section.

The hidden elevator linkage isn't a problem. It's mostly done before you close it all up anyway. I used a metal clevis on a 4-40 rod that had a locking clip built it. I wasn't sure if I wanted to trust fuel line scrpas to secure my elevator for years to come, so I went with something that was a pain to get on, and certainly shouldn't work itself off over time.

Building the wing center section wasn't difficult or time consuming as I recall. I have a deal with my wife that I can't spend entire evenings in the basement, so I do a few construction steps and then call it a night, I'm probably not the best guy to get a building time estimate from. The fuse builds pretty easily. The engine baffle and scale cowl are worth the effort for the appearance. I'll take some photos and post them for you.

For the retract wells, I tried to use really thin ply to make them. A lolt of effort and shaping. I would recommend just using heavy paper card-stock and then fuel proofing it with a thinned epoxy mix. Paper is much easier to shape than wood sometimes.

I agree with Doug, it is a more advanced kit. I learned a ton putting it together and wish I had another one to build. I just bought the Hollywood Zero version of the Top Flite AT-6, so I will get to put all of my red building notes to use someday. There are a few other planes ahead of it though. Good luck, take your time, and enjoy the building experience...

2slow2matter,

I am in the process of building mine and it is a challenge but I love the kit. One caveat on the retracts. Mine are the Robarts for the TopFlite AT-6 with the shock struts. They are about 0.25 inches longer and 0.11 inches forward than the wire struts shown on the plans. It is too much to cut off. So you need to position the retract mounts aft of the shown location. I decided to move the two wing dowels and center plywood ribs inboard by 0.25 inches to make sure I have room. The air cylinders are also longer than shown on the plans. I was wondering if my plans shrunk that much but the trailing edge slots from the die cut balsa matches the plans almost exactly.

About the flaps. The taper on the 1/16" plywood is rearward and upward so that when the flaps close against the trailing edge of the wing only the knife enge of the flap shows. Easier said than done but worth the effort.

Thanks to all about beefing the retract mounts. I will sure do that before I finish. I glued in the bell cranks for the ailerons after thinking about dual servos. I figured that I could save a little weight especially since I have flaps and retracts.

I guess I am a slow builder. It took me about 20 hours to build and shape the tail feathers. I usually use Robart hinge points and haven't used cloth hinges in a long time. I was suprised by hinge points on the flaps and cloth on the flight surfaces. I wonder especially about cutting cloth hinge slots on the elevator and rudder since it cuts right into the balsa sheet forming the elevator structure. I didn't put hinge blocks inside the sheeted horizontal and vertical stabs so I am stuck unless I want to do some surgery on the sheeting.

It is a great project though

Bob

Just thought I would add my 2cents. Mine is now over 8 years old and has 100's of flights. I put a dubro captive ball link on the elevator, used a locking nut and locktight. The first engine was a OS 61 but later changed it to a OS 90 fourstroke which is much better IMO. I don't often use the flaps now and I tend to land fast which is my preference. When I first started flying it I had trouble getting the glide slope and sink rate dialed in but just keep practicing. This plane can really take a beating and is easy to repair, the wing is very strong and has survived a few fus breaks. Having built all the TF warbird kits at least once (except the Corsair) this is the real workhorse. I fly it in wind I wouldnt dare take my other Warbirds up in. I have the Hollywood Zero version waiting to be built and take the AT6 engine/radio/etc but the plane just keeps on going and wont die. Once you are through the build and get comfortable with the flight envelope you may just find that it's the best plane you have, I sure did. As a bonus you wont see many on the flight line!! You may want to get an extra kit while they are still around E-Bay and RCU. Long live the TF AT6!!!
KirkRC

One more thought on retracts in general. Once you figure out what sort of angle you want your wheels to be at - I use a little toe-in for better ground handling, grind your strut so the retaining screw holds better. I used my Dremel and ground a flat spot on the upper part of the strut where the retaining screw contacts it. It provides a better flat surface/flat surface contact, and will keep your struts and wheels from rotating on landing.

Kirk - do you land on grass or pavement? I'm hooking the flaps up this week and will try again for a successful landing this weekend. I fly from a pretty smooth grass strip in Germany which should get better once we start mowing again.

Right now I fly off pavement but the plane flew off grass when I lived in Singapore. On all the TF kits I reinforce the retracts and a few other areas depending on the kit. Mine has robarts but my other 1/7 scale TF warbirds all have Century Jet.
Kirk

Guys,
thanks for all of the input. Sure makes me excited about finishing the project. Will probably finish it up this summer. In the mean-time, I'll probably purchase myself the new hanger9 p40E warhawk ARF to kick around--just to get used to flying a sport warbird. Also, I really like the looks of that plane, and I have my hands full for a while building this Texan. I'll post some pics as soon as I start building again.
I'm waiting on retracts right now. I have a set of CJ retracts coming--never used for 65 bucks. Can't wait to get them. (bought from the same guy I bought the kit from).

2slow: Retracts will be here this weekend !