X-treme Composite Altair 200
#26

My Feedback: (8)
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,366
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Leesburg, VA
Ryan, If I know Adrian he probably flies to Japan and hikes to the top of Mt. Fuji with his valve covers. There in a small cave is an old man that hand paints the valve covers and only does 1 per month. Adrian has to fly back several months later and climb back up to get his painted valve covers....Hey Adrian, was I close??
#27
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
ORIGINAL: ual767
Ryan, If I know Adrian he probably flies to Japan and hikes to the top of Mt. Fuji with his valve covers. There in a small cave is an old man that hand paints the valve covers and only does 1 per month. Adrian has to fly back several months later and climb back up to get his painted valve covers....Hey Adrian, was I close??
Ryan, If I know Adrian he probably flies to Japan and hikes to the top of Mt. Fuji with his valve covers. There in a small cave is an old man that hand paints the valve covers and only does 1 per month. Adrian has to fly back several months later and climb back up to get his painted valve covers....Hey Adrian, was I close??
Close, but no cigar. Yes, I used to hike for days to reach his cave. However, after I have given him so much business, the old man has since moved to the tallest building in the heart of Ginza with a helipad.
#28
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
ORIGINAL: Ryan Smith
Adrian,
Do you get your valve covers painted overseas, or do you do them yourself? Do you know what kind of paint is used?
Adrian,
Do you get your valve covers painted overseas, or do you do them yourself? Do you know what kind of paint is used?
I have them done in Hong Kong with different colors - metallic red, Ferrari red, Lambo Yellow, ProLine Pink & OS blue
#29
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
Engine installation took longer than I've expected. Also, I've noticed the bellypan didn't fit correctly with the wings on. Apparently, the factory have installed the two mounting pins too low on the back of the pan causing the trailing edge of the wing to push against the back of the pan. I was a bit surprised with the issue, since I didn't encounter the same problem with the Astral or the ProLine. Anyway, I corrected the problem by enlarging the two holes on the fuse, and it's now a perfect fit. In addition, per my good friend/ fellow Altair pilot Ken Hirose's suggestion, I installed two extra mounting pins on the front of the bellypan for a more secure fit.
Throttle servo installation was pretty straight forward, but it took me a while to get the throttle cable to fit smoothly with no binding. Header and pipe installation weren't tough, but just time consuming to get both the angle and alignment correctly. However, the Nishioka pipe mount did give me some trouble. Since the mounting point is right in front of the bulkhead, it doesn't give you much room to reach inside to install blind nuts, not to mention your hand has to be in an extremely odd angle to hold the blind nuts.
Actually, the most time consuming part was to cut the plastic spinner into shape to accommodate the prop. Since the new APC 18.5x12 WPN prop has a pretty thick hub, it took me close to two hours between trimming, fitting and measuring to get it right.
Next step, ele/ rud servos, linkage and cable installation. Hopefully, will be done by Wednesday night.
Throttle servo installation was pretty straight forward, but it took me a while to get the throttle cable to fit smoothly with no binding. Header and pipe installation weren't tough, but just time consuming to get both the angle and alignment correctly. However, the Nishioka pipe mount did give me some trouble. Since the mounting point is right in front of the bulkhead, it doesn't give you much room to reach inside to install blind nuts, not to mention your hand has to be in an extremely odd angle to hold the blind nuts.
Actually, the most time consuming part was to cut the plastic spinner into shape to accommodate the prop. Since the new APC 18.5x12 WPN prop has a pretty thick hub, it took me close to two hours between trimming, fitting and measuring to get it right.
Next step, ele/ rud servos, linkage and cable installation. Hopefully, will be done by Wednesday night.
#31

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 796
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Oakland,
CA
ORIGINAL: riot3d
Close, but no cigar. Yes, I used to hike for days to reach his cave. However, after I have given him so much business, the old man has since moved to the tallest building in the heart of Ginza with a helipad.
ORIGINAL: ual767
Ryan, If I know Adrian he probably flies to Japan and hikes to the top of Mt. Fuji with his valve covers. There in a small cave is an old man that hand paints the valve covers and only does 1 per month. Adrian has to fly back several months later and climb back up to get his painted valve covers....Hey Adrian, was I close??
Ryan, If I know Adrian he probably flies to Japan and hikes to the top of Mt. Fuji with his valve covers. There in a small cave is an old man that hand paints the valve covers and only does 1 per month. Adrian has to fly back several months later and climb back up to get his painted valve covers....Hey Adrian, was I close??
Close, but no cigar. Yes, I used to hike for days to reach his cave. However, after I have given him so much business, the old man has since moved to the tallest building in the heart of Ginza with a helipad.
He also used to contract with Yoda to do this...
#32

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 796
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Oakland,
CA
ORIGINAL: rcpattern
Where do you get the cool exhaust extension you are running?
Planes looks great,
Where do you get the cool exhaust extension you are running?
Planes looks great,
They come from Japan - I have (had) a friend there that has become a personal shopper for us.
I'm not quite sure how much longer he'll remain a friend since Adrian sends him out on errands just about daily.I don't remember the shop name... Adrian probably has it memorized/bookmarked.
#34
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
Elevator is done, it requires two 9650 servo. As for horns, adjusters, clevises, push rods & rod ends, I'm using the old trusty MK's, Central carbon rod & titanium ends. Since there wasn't much room in the stab, it took me two evenings to get everything fitted.
To tell the truth, I was never a big fan of using two servos on the tail. However, I must admit the last time I used such application was back in the days of the old analog era.
Next step, rudder cable ...
To tell the truth, I was never a big fan of using two servos on the tail. However, I must admit the last time I used such application was back in the days of the old analog era.
Next step, rudder cable ...
#36
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
Rudder cable is also done.
Last few steps - complete wiring/ battery connection, install instrument panel, head rest, pilot and canopy, check cg, incidence, test cdi. Next weekend ... test flight.
Last few steps - complete wiring/ battery connection, install instrument panel, head rest, pilot and canopy, check cg, incidence, test cdi. Next weekend ... test flight.
#37

My Feedback: (8)
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,366
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Leesburg, VA
Back to the Altair:
I got to see Adrian's Altair project in progress and it really is a beautiful plane. Xtreme has really come a long way in the finishing of their kits. No seam in the fuse and very nice paint quality. Hope to make it out there to see it fly soon. With the rest of the Hong Kong WC team flying it, I imagine it is an awesome plane in the air.
I got to see Adrian's Altair project in progress and it really is a beautiful plane. Xtreme has really come a long way in the finishing of their kits. No seam in the fuse and very nice paint quality. Hope to make it out there to see it fly soon. With the rest of the Hong Kong WC team flying it, I imagine it is an awesome plane in the air.
#39
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
The plane is pretty much done, so to speak.
Wiring are all complete, and it took me awhile to decide what type of battery to use. I know the most safest way will be to use two separate battery - one to power the servos, and the other to power the cdi unit. However, I settled on one 4.8v, 2,000 mAh niMh for ease of operation. Of course, I will monitor the battery drainage religiously after each flight, and may switch to a different battery configuration down the road.
Since a 4 stroke engine generates a lot of vibration - even with a soft mount - special attention must be taken when installing head rest and pilot figure. For head rest, the trick is to insert a few pins onto the base before gluing it down onto the cockpit deck. As for the pilot figure, install two 2-56 blind nut onto the base of the figure. Then, fasten it with two 2-56 screws from the bottom of the cockpit along with epoxy. I have been using the same installation method for a long time. Even though, it is a bit time consuming, but I have yet had one head rest or pilot came lose in mid flight. Since you are drilling holes on the cockpit deck as anchor points, don't forget to drill two more tiny holes behind the head rest for ventilation.
Wiring are all complete, and it took me awhile to decide what type of battery to use. I know the most safest way will be to use two separate battery - one to power the servos, and the other to power the cdi unit. However, I settled on one 4.8v, 2,000 mAh niMh for ease of operation. Of course, I will monitor the battery drainage religiously after each flight, and may switch to a different battery configuration down the road.
Since a 4 stroke engine generates a lot of vibration - even with a soft mount - special attention must be taken when installing head rest and pilot figure. For head rest, the trick is to insert a few pins onto the base before gluing it down onto the cockpit deck. As for the pilot figure, install two 2-56 blind nut onto the base of the figure. Then, fasten it with two 2-56 screws from the bottom of the cockpit along with epoxy. I have been using the same installation method for a long time. Even though, it is a bit time consuming, but I have yet had one head rest or pilot came lose in mid flight. Since you are drilling holes on the cockpit deck as anchor points, don't forget to drill two more tiny holes behind the head rest for ventilation.
#40
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
The final and most time consuming step is canopy installation.
Over the years, I have tried different glues on canopy. From R/C-56, to slow cured epoxy. Unfortunately, none of them works for me, until my friend Alex Lau recommended this super glue from Japan. This thing is a one part glue that dries completely in 24 hours. After it's dried, the only way the canopy will come lose again is by cutting it open physically.
I know different installer uses different method to install canopies, but I've always used my own and have had good luck with it. I first use low stick 3M painter masking tape to mask the contour area right below the canopy to prevent glue from over-spilling during application. Then, lightly roughen the two contact area before applying glue. After canopy set in place for a few minutes, I placed work towels over it, and wrap it around tightly with masking tape and let it dry for 24 hours.
The final weight came out to 4.95 kg:-
Fuse - 3,870 g
Wing - 1,080 g
As mentioned before, I'm using the wider canard type gear, which is 30 g heavier than the supplied one. In addition, I can further reduce weight by using lipo. However, I'm not going to change anything until after I've trim out the plane.
Since I have had no prior experience on the cdi, I took the plane to the field yesterday to get used to operating on the engine. Initially, I was having some trouble getting the engine to run. Right after it's started, it would quit within seconds, it didn't matter whether I open or close the needle. Then, I remember Alex told me one of the area I should always pay attention to is to make sure the spark plug cable is firmly connected to the plug.
As soon as I took off the bellypan, I could tell the cable is lose. After I've reconnected the cable, and tap it firmly onto the plug, the engine started right a way. I ran the engine for a few minutes on 18.5x12 wpn, 30% heli with regular oil, it settled on 1,700 idle and 7,500 on full throttle. First impression was initial throttle response is slightly slower than regular 170, but I'm using a special Akiba throttle curve. Therefore, may have to readjust it a little. Otherwise, it runs very smoothly.
List of equipment used:-
Engine - YS 170 with YS mount & cdi
Prop - APC 18.5x12 wpn
Fuel - Coolpower 30% heli
Header & pipe - Hatori # 822 & # 821
Rx - R6008HS
Ail - S9154 x 2
Rud - S9156
Ele - S9650 x 2
Thr - S9650
Battery - 4.8v, 2,000 mAh niMh
Hopefully, the weather will cooperate this weekend for test flight.
Over the years, I have tried different glues on canopy. From R/C-56, to slow cured epoxy. Unfortunately, none of them works for me, until my friend Alex Lau recommended this super glue from Japan. This thing is a one part glue that dries completely in 24 hours. After it's dried, the only way the canopy will come lose again is by cutting it open physically.
I know different installer uses different method to install canopies, but I've always used my own and have had good luck with it. I first use low stick 3M painter masking tape to mask the contour area right below the canopy to prevent glue from over-spilling during application. Then, lightly roughen the two contact area before applying glue. After canopy set in place for a few minutes, I placed work towels over it, and wrap it around tightly with masking tape and let it dry for 24 hours.
The final weight came out to 4.95 kg:-
Fuse - 3,870 g
Wing - 1,080 g
As mentioned before, I'm using the wider canard type gear, which is 30 g heavier than the supplied one. In addition, I can further reduce weight by using lipo. However, I'm not going to change anything until after I've trim out the plane.
Since I have had no prior experience on the cdi, I took the plane to the field yesterday to get used to operating on the engine. Initially, I was having some trouble getting the engine to run. Right after it's started, it would quit within seconds, it didn't matter whether I open or close the needle. Then, I remember Alex told me one of the area I should always pay attention to is to make sure the spark plug cable is firmly connected to the plug.
As soon as I took off the bellypan, I could tell the cable is lose. After I've reconnected the cable, and tap it firmly onto the plug, the engine started right a way. I ran the engine for a few minutes on 18.5x12 wpn, 30% heli with regular oil, it settled on 1,700 idle and 7,500 on full throttle. First impression was initial throttle response is slightly slower than regular 170, but I'm using a special Akiba throttle curve. Therefore, may have to readjust it a little. Otherwise, it runs very smoothly.
List of equipment used:-
Engine - YS 170 with YS mount & cdi
Prop - APC 18.5x12 wpn
Fuel - Coolpower 30% heli
Header & pipe - Hatori # 822 & # 821
Rx - R6008HS
Ail - S9154 x 2
Rud - S9156
Ele - S9650 x 2
Thr - S9650
Battery - 4.8v, 2,000 mAh niMh
Hopefully, the weather will cooperate this weekend for test flight.
#41
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
Test flight was a success this afternoon. I only had time to put in 2 flights, before the infamous Bay Area cross wind started kicking up big time. First flight only needed some minor trimming, plane tracked well, but did need some up ele with both rud for knife edges. Up/ down line were fine, with just a hint of down ele needed on the down line. I flew half of the P-09 pretty confidently on the second flight, and was satisfy with the few snaps the plane performed. I'm using most of the recommended throws by Naruke, and found the ele was too sensitive to my liking. However, the ail throws was just about right.
This is my first experience on both the cdi and the Futaba R6008HS, I've found the initial throttle response was a bit slower than the non cdi. However, I'm using a special Akiba throttle curve that actually retard the speed of the throttle servo. Therefore, I will probably adjust the curve slightly. Nevertheless, it has a very linear feel to it, you could definitely tell after some minor adjustment you will be able to take full advantage of the torque curve.
As for the R6008HS, very smooth, and you could definitely tell it's more responsive than the other rx.
Hopefully, I will have the opportunity to get the plane to trim out to my liking in the next few weeks. Will report again ...
This is my first experience on both the cdi and the Futaba R6008HS, I've found the initial throttle response was a bit slower than the non cdi. However, I'm using a special Akiba throttle curve that actually retard the speed of the throttle servo. Therefore, I will probably adjust the curve slightly. Nevertheless, it has a very linear feel to it, you could definitely tell after some minor adjustment you will be able to take full advantage of the torque curve.
As for the R6008HS, very smooth, and you could definitely tell it's more responsive than the other rx.
Hopefully, I will have the opportunity to get the plane to trim out to my liking in the next few weeks. Will report again ...
#42
Member
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: ORANJESTAD, ARUBA
Hi Adrian,
Just wondering how is it going with the Altair-200.How is shehelding up?.
Can you tell us how is she flying?,are you satisfied with the flying qualities of the airframe?.
No sign of trouble with the leadingedges of the stabs and wings?.
How does she handle the P-09 and F-09?
Sorry for all the questions but i`am interested in your feedback now that you`ve played with her for a while..!!.
Regards.
Just wondering how is it going with the Altair-200.How is shehelding up?.
Can you tell us how is she flying?,are you satisfied with the flying qualities of the airframe?.
No sign of trouble with the leadingedges of the stabs and wings?.
How does she handle the P-09 and F-09?
Sorry for all the questions but i`am interested in your feedback now that you`ve played with her for a while..!!.
Regards.
#43

My Feedback: (1)
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 221
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: sugaland,
TX
HI,Adrian
what a beautiful plane you got there ! can you tell me more about the engine mount you got , it look very simple with the oil damber , where can I get it ? any website I can go on to ??
thank you very much for your reply ,
tuan lam
what a beautiful plane you got there ! can you tell me more about the engine mount you got , it look very simple with the oil damber , where can I get it ? any website I can go on to ??
thank you very much for your reply ,
tuan lam
#45
Really??? Sorry to hear about this. It has been another incident described somewhere in this forum. Reason? Flutter or constr. failure?
#46
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
I have been busy with personal business, and will have an update within the next two days. However, everything has been taking care of by the factory.
Adrian
Adrian
#47
Senior Member
<span style="font-size: larger;"><span style="font-family: Comic Sans MS;">Actually, the incident in Singapore is left without any conclusion. Probably none can be made at the moment. Maybe it delaminated on its own maybe it did not but was caused by a knock. Who knows.
I spoke with one of the guys from Xtreme Composite, this its the owner, about the issue of the leading edge delaminating. I mentioned it must be difficult to manufacture composite planes and keep it light. I caasually mentioned that to ensure the Hstab does not delaminate it would be great to have a backing layer but that would be so hard to do as the stab is thin. Well ... the reply is that they have a new process that is like having a backing on the joint from the inside. Not bad huh?
</span></span>
I spoke with one of the guys from Xtreme Composite, this its the owner, about the issue of the leading edge delaminating. I mentioned it must be difficult to manufacture composite planes and keep it light. I caasually mentioned that to ensure the Hstab does not delaminate it would be great to have a backing layer but that would be so hard to do as the stab is thin. Well ... the reply is that they have a new process that is like having a backing on the joint from the inside. Not bad huh?
</span></span>
#48
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
<meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"><meta content="Word.Document" name="ProgId"><meta content="Microsoft Word 10" name="Generator"><meta content="Microsoft Word 10" name="Originator"><xml><w:worddocument><w:view></w:view></w:worddocument></xml><div align="left"><pre style="text-align: justify;"><span roman="" new="" times="" style=""><o
></o
></span></pre></div></meta></meta></meta></meta>
></o
></span></pre></div></meta></meta></meta></meta>
#49
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name="ProgId" content="Word.Document"><meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 10"><meta name="Originator" content="Microsoft Word 10"><xml><w:worddocument><w:view>
</w:view></w:worddocument></xml></meta></meta></meta></meta>
</w:view></w:worddocument></xml></meta></meta></meta></meta>
#50
Thread Starter

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: oakland,
CA
Sorry about the last two posts, I'm currently on the road and tried to write this post on a word document. I was hoping I could cut & paste from word onto here but with no success. I will try to figure something out tonight when I get to the hotel.
Adrian
Adrian


