Sceadu 30 - cyclic sensitivity vs. training gear vs. RealFlight
01-19-2004, 03:55 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Sceadu 30 - cyclic sensitivity vs. training gear vs. RealFlight
After a couple of [ . . . . .] (insert your favourite word) weeks of practice on RealFlight, my Sceadu 30 is in the air. Only three tanks of fuel so far. I soon realized that this is totally different from flying an airplane. Exciting.
I have noticed that the RealFlight Impala 30 (and most other RF helis) is much more sensitive than my Sceadu. I have to move the stick much further to make the same control inputs in real life. Is increasing the cyclic sensitivity a matter of increasing EPA on channels 1 and 2, and/or using longer servo horns? I have set the heli up according to the instruction manual, but I'm not comfortable with the way the heli handles. I'd like smaller stick movement and a more sensitive feel (I find it easier to make precise control inputs when I just "apply pressure" to the sticks rather than moving them too much).
Could it be... - the training gear? Will the heli become more responsive once I take the training gear off? (not yet
)
Any comments/explanations/info/opinions appreciated
Thanks!
I have noticed that the RealFlight Impala 30 (and most other RF helis) is much more sensitive than my Sceadu. I have to move the stick much further to make the same control inputs in real life. Is increasing the cyclic sensitivity a matter of increasing EPA on channels 1 and 2, and/or using longer servo horns? I have set the heli up according to the instruction manual, but I'm not comfortable with the way the heli handles. I'd like smaller stick movement and a more sensitive feel (I find it easier to make precise control inputs when I just "apply pressure" to the sticks rather than moving them too much).
Could it be... - the training gear? Will the heli become more responsive once I take the training gear off? (not yet
)Any comments/explanations/info/opinions appreciated
Thanks!
01-20-2004, 04:31 AM
#2
RE: Sceadu 30 - cyclic sensitivity vs. training gear vs. RealFlight
The training gear will make a difference. When I took mine off I had the adjust the gyro gain too!
In the hover you should be able to use pressure inputs. When properly set up the heli should almost hover hands off for a few seconds. You then only need the tiniest of inputs to correct it. It may be possible that you are slightly overcontrolling (possibly as a result of G2 where the models are a bit twitchy). I would stick with it for a little while and see if your inputs naturally reduce as you get more used to it.
As regards to the amount of stick movement. EPA will increase the cyclic movement. There are good books around (such as ray's helicopter manual) that show you the best way to set it up. You basically use ATV to set the max possible cyclic movement without control binding and then you can play with EPA to your hearts content.
If you really find that you don't like it then you can also use expo. Expo is usually used in the opposite way to what you are asking. It is usually used so that around the centre point the sticks can be moved slightly further for a smaller servo movement than when the sticks are at the edge. This means that full servo movement is still available but finer inputs can be made around centre. However this can usually be applied in reverse so that a small stick movement will produce a larger servo movement near the centre. This is not normal though. If you have already added a bit of expo, try turning it off.
The instructions are a guide. They obviously got you through your first flight so they have done their job! Everybody is different and likes a different feel to their model. If you don't like it change it until you do. That is half the fun of the hobby. It would be really boring if everyones models were the same!
Well done so far and good luck
In the hover you should be able to use pressure inputs. When properly set up the heli should almost hover hands off for a few seconds. You then only need the tiniest of inputs to correct it. It may be possible that you are slightly overcontrolling (possibly as a result of G2 where the models are a bit twitchy). I would stick with it for a little while and see if your inputs naturally reduce as you get more used to it.
As regards to the amount of stick movement. EPA will increase the cyclic movement. There are good books around (such as ray's helicopter manual) that show you the best way to set it up. You basically use ATV to set the max possible cyclic movement without control binding and then you can play with EPA to your hearts content.
If you really find that you don't like it then you can also use expo. Expo is usually used in the opposite way to what you are asking. It is usually used so that around the centre point the sticks can be moved slightly further for a smaller servo movement than when the sticks are at the edge. This means that full servo movement is still available but finer inputs can be made around centre. However this can usually be applied in reverse so that a small stick movement will produce a larger servo movement near the centre. This is not normal though. If you have already added a bit of expo, try turning it off.
The instructions are a guide. They obviously got you through your first flight so they have done their job! Everybody is different and likes a different feel to their model. If you don't like it change it until you do. That is half the fun of the hobby. It would be really boring if everyones models were the same!
Well done so far and good luck
01-20-2004, 11:17 AM
#3
Thread Starter
RE: Sceadu 30 - cyclic sensitivity vs. training gear vs. RealFlight
Thanks siclick33;
that is what I call an informative and good answer!
You are probably right about overcontrolling; I think most of the training when learning to fly a new type of aircraft is learning to understand what I see, and learning to know what to look for. I haven't got the "feel" yet. I probably see things a little late and then move the stick too far to compensate... (It took several years before I could do things like inverted low passes with my planes without being scared...) There is always something to learn and/or improve.
EPA/ATV: I am not sure that we are talking about the same thing. I think my radio's EPA is what Futaba calls ATV. I don't quite understand what you mean by "use ATV to set the .... and then you can play with EPA ...". I thought they were the same thing. But I understand how to do it on my radio, that's the important thing.
Expo... I tried expo on my Four-Star, but I didn't like it. I would probably get comfortable with expo after a while, but it feels more natural to have linear controls. It makes it easier to apply the right amount of elevator/aileron/rudder at the same time. This might not be a problem at all with helicopters, so I might give it a try, just to see how it works. You are talking about positive expo; moving more of the servo's travel towards the stick center and make it less sensitive at the ends?
You're right about the instructions. They helped me a lot, and I wouldn't have had a chance to get in the air without them.
One thing I found out yesterday, is that the ball links were very tight. Some of them were so tight that I couldn't move the pushrods by hand (swash plate and below. The upper ones were perfect). After loosening them by pinching them with pliers, everything is much better. I haven't flown the heli since I made the adjustments, but I guess the servos will return to center now
that is what I call an informative and good answer!
You are probably right about overcontrolling; I think most of the training when learning to fly a new type of aircraft is learning to understand what I see, and learning to know what to look for. I haven't got the "feel" yet. I probably see things a little late and then move the stick too far to compensate... (It took several years before I could do things like inverted low passes with my planes without being scared...) There is always something to learn and/or improve.
EPA/ATV: I am not sure that we are talking about the same thing. I think my radio's EPA is what Futaba calls ATV. I don't quite understand what you mean by "use ATV to set the .... and then you can play with EPA ...". I thought they were the same thing. But I understand how to do it on my radio, that's the important thing.
Expo... I tried expo on my Four-Star, but I didn't like it. I would probably get comfortable with expo after a while, but it feels more natural to have linear controls. It makes it easier to apply the right amount of elevator/aileron/rudder at the same time. This might not be a problem at all with helicopters, so I might give it a try, just to see how it works. You are talking about positive expo; moving more of the servo's travel towards the stick center and make it less sensitive at the ends?
You're right about the instructions. They helped me a lot, and I wouldn't have had a chance to get in the air without them.
One thing I found out yesterday, is that the ball links were very tight. Some of them were so tight that I couldn't move the pushrods by hand (swash plate and below. The upper ones were perfect). After loosening them by pinching them with pliers, everything is much better. I haven't flown the heli since I made the adjustments, but I guess the servos will return to center now
01-20-2004, 11:58 AM
#4
RE: Sceadu 30 - cyclic sensitivity vs. training gear vs. RealFlight
Sorry if I confused you about ATV and EPA. You are dead right, they are the same.
I got mixed up with my abbreviations. Futaba (which I use) also has a function called AFR. This is irrelevant if you don't have it. Basically i use ATV (or EPA as your radio calls it) to set the max possible servo throw. AFR is then used to adjust the throw that I actually want. It sounds complicated but has some really useful benefits.
JR make a ball link sizing tool to remove the 'stickyness' of new ball links.
I got mixed up with my abbreviations. Futaba (which I use) also has a function called AFR. This is irrelevant if you don't have it. Basically i use ATV (or EPA as your radio calls it) to set the max possible servo throw. AFR is then used to adjust the throw that I actually want. It sounds complicated but has some really useful benefits.
JR make a ball link sizing tool to remove the 'stickyness' of new ball links.
