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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Pilott, May I answer your points:
1 You are right, it should be that unbiased comments be treated equally, that's an issue for Marc. to address. 2. Build threads are just that, the build begins in the factory, and that is precisely why failure of the structure which is the subject of the build thread needs to be addressed and this IS the only place to do it ! What is the most vital aspect of any build ? structural integrity/ airworthiness, I would argue ! Right ON topic. Anything else is secondary to these aspects. 3. I most certainly did not say that because stabs failed on ONE model (actually there have been two, if my info. is correct ) that the model is a complete failure, to suggest that is absolute nonsense. Many Lightnings ARE flying with great success. What I DO say is that a complete stab. failure, such as I witnessed, and particularly on a new model, needs close and careful consideration and based on my past personal EXPERIENCE of C-ARF they would have blamed the customer for the problem had we not persued it here on RCU. AG certainly blamed me for all of the hydraulic problems on the Mig 29, but all I tried to do was solve the problems, which was done, but only after a considerable expenditure of time and money and with the help of some very capable people who were also unable to get it to work to an acceptable standard of reliability using the original design and components. People whose abilty is enough to redesign the system and get it to work with total relaibility. Please see my comments on the Mig 29 threads if you need convincing. I don't own a Lightning, nor will I, but I have examined the failed structures and they did not impress. I DO however own a CARF Eurosport and a Mig 29 both of which were seriously deficient in SOME critical aspects of construction, and if uncorrected, would have caused early loss of the models. Other aspects of these models were absolutely fine and they both fly very well, but the weakest link etc .................... I do know that at least some of the incoming emails/PMs ARE from people who DO own Lightnings and who have dicovered problems such as cracking around the rear fuselage. So, not all of them own Lightnings but almost all, perhaps all , have experience, like me, of CARF structures. I believe that the comments are MOST credible as, most importantly, they are exactly in line with my own real world experience with the Euro and Mig. I belive there has been a succesful resolution of this issue so hopefully we can wind it up in the very near future, but if my input has helped to get this conclusion, even in a small way, then I feel it has been worthwhile. I stand by every word. Regards, David Gladwin. |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
I belive there has been a succesful resolution of this issue but if my input has helped to get this conclusion, even in a small way, then I feel it has been worthwhile Now, back to a build thread, I think there was one here at some point!............. |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
David, my presumption was incorrect, in as much as i believed you were referring to the other lightning thread..... however, obviously not... anyway I examined the stabilisor before my crash , and after your post and it seemed solid as a rock.... on examining the same unit after the crash , my conclusion that it looked sound and secure in all respects, i can see that it is possible to screw up and weaken the structure by too large an aperture for the servo arms and there is the possibility of external damage by touching the elevator horns on the ground at forty miles an hour , but I do believe that the construction and design is sufficient for a jet model............thats my 2 cents worth......... happy landings down under ,, regards to Wilma.............Malcolm
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Man! that looks like alot of Fun debating whos right or wrong... but i agree with schroedm was'nt there a thread about building a lighting somewhere ? If any of you guys have some pictures I would appreciate seing the installation of radio and all other goodies that are siting up front. Thanx ! By the way i actually have one of my own and even with a possibly "flimsy" Stab cant wait to try it !
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
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Beat this!.....[X(]
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Mark
Absolutely superb looking gear installation, is this your Lightning? I must go and do some more work on my Eurosport! Not quite as much room under the canopy though! John |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Thanx ! absolutely beautiful ! I promise ill try to do better :D the only problem I can spot is with your receiver... It really looks like that snag could give you some problems because that looks like "FUTABA" radio gear ? LOL
Now please dont be offended its just a joke like a GM guy making fun of a FORD owner.... |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
ORIGINAL: schroedm Beat this!.....[X(] |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
schroedm,
Great looking install, is that primer your using on the inside? ;) Also, I don't think your going to have much luck filling the fuel takes with that setup. Its hard to tell, but maybe your vent line is seperate from the fill line after all. Ken |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Whooooaaaahhhh, hold on! Unfortunately that is not my Lightning but Mark Hinton's - he's a bit of a specialist when it comes to installs ;)
It all works 100%, I can assure you of that! Now then Sandor, what on earth are those things you have hidden in your wings :D :D :D (they Look nice btw!) Rgds, Mark |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
How about Cockpits...[sm=red_smile.gif] anyone ever tried to fill that up with 2 pilots ? thats what i have planned.
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
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Well, this looks the nuts too!! Bluebox F15 cockpit - virtually a perfect fit and adds just the right amount of weight up front!.....
rgds, Mark |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
saaaaaaaaaaaaweeeeeeeeeet !
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Here is a full build thread:
http://www.jetpilots.org/knowledge_bank I have about 150 flights on mine now and love the plane. Just finishing a Flash, and I have a second Lightning in Jolly Rogers I am working on. Let me know if you have any specific quiestions. There is also an extensive article in the current issue of JetPower. |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Hoooolyyyyyyyy $-it, Where is the moderator for this supposed to be build thread?????? I wanted to read a build thread and had to wade thru this Cra.... 4pages of STUFF that SHOULD NOT have been on its on post???!!!. Where is the rest of the building steps and procedures that should be on a BUILD POST ? Ray Blair
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
ORIGINAL: Bandito Hoooolyyyyyyyy $-it, Where is the moderator for this supposed to be build thread?????? I wanted to read a build thread and had to wade thru this Cra.... 4pages of STUFF that SHOULD NOT have been on its on post???!!!. Where is the rest of the building steps and procedures that should be on a BUILD POST ? Ray Blair go to c-arf.com and download the manual.....:D here its just showing off;) |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Sandor, I guess your right. I had'nt thought of it that way. On need to download the manual , I have 2 kits sitting in my model work-room when I get the chance to get started, thats why I was interested in the "build thead" that was DESTROYED by some-one wanting to discuss a completly different subject. I am not saying that the Safty subject should not be discussed, just not on this tread. " Live and Let Live" thats my position...... Ray Blair
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Today was the mayden flight of mine,Mine is mounting a P160 with Kero starter. .Regrads from Spain victor sanchiz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfcnmjf9EIU |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Congrats. for the maiden Victor. What happened with the nose gear?
I see you are performing your english:D Saludicos Jesus |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
hola jesus,un fallo en la compuerta dejo salir el tren pero se engancho con la compuerta lateral y esto izo que el tren no se escondiera pero despegi la compuerta por completo,yaesta todo reparado y listo para el domingo.salu2
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RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
ORIGINAL: victorsanchiz Today was the mayden flight of mine,Mine is mounting a P160 with Kero starter. .Regrads from Spain victor sanchiz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfcnmjf9EIU Congrats on the maiden. Thanks for the video. I am awaiting mine which will be flown with a Titan. What were your throttle settings throughout the flight? Does it cruise comfortably, say at half throttle? What about full throttle, is it fast, good verticals? Which factory control throws did you use? Saludos Alex |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
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buenas,para volar normal con mitad gas vuela muy bien,atope es una bala,es una pasada lo estable que es,una verdadera maravilla,con gas atope sube en vertical como un misil asta cansarte,he puesto los mismo recorridos que pone en el manual,bueno espero que pongas fotos,porcierto que decoracion comprastes?.
salu2 |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
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ORIGINAL: victorsanchiz buenas,para volar normal con mitad gas vuela muy bien,atope es una bala,es una pasada lo estable que es,una verdadera maravilla,con gas atope sube en vertical como un misil asta cansarte,he puesto los mismo recorridos que pone en el manual,bueno espero que pongas fotos,porcierto que decoracion comprastes?. salu2 Ahhh I liked what I read. I asked because, earlier on there were some discussions as to whether the Titan was enough power for the plane. From your experience it seems to be plenty enough. Did you use Ray Labonte's or Marc Froehn's control throws, as per the manual? I ordered the Jolly Rogers scheme. Here are some pics my builder sent me. |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
Any news on the kevlar skid and the carbon fibre sheet safety uppgrade parts? Have anyone received theirs yet? I haven't heared anything. Will ask my rep to check it up next time I see him... ORIGINAL: schroedm Factory statement as at 2pm 13/9/06.... "Since there is a risk of touching an unhedral tail plane to the ground during take off or landing, there is a chance of damaging the tail plane’s structure so that it can fail in flight. We had this very unlucky incident with one of our customers. This customer has been very professional, has given us the chance to carefully and completely investigate the incident and come up with a solution for all of you. The customer will be taken care off in privacy after full investigation is concluded. Since not only the tips of the stab, but also the elevator control horns have a chance to hit the ground during take off and landing, depending on the surface structure of the runway, we have created a Kevlar skid which should be glued into the ventral fin to make sure that this skid will hit the ground first when the plane rotates, to protect the stab and the elevator control horns in case of overrotation. A servo gear damage caused by hitting the ground with the elevator control horn can result in elevator flutter which can create such huge forces on the tailplane that no reinforcement would make it stay together. The case of enlarging the slots for the servo arms on the bottom skin of the stab (over the factory cut size) also can add to a possible risk of damaging the tailplane during take off further. Therefore we have quickly created a safety package of a nicely milled carbon fibre sheet, which is glued to the outside of the stab bottom skin in the area of the rear stab spar, to stiffen the skin in case any holes or slots have been added or enlarged. We remember a similar fix of a very popular twin boom trainer, where an additional carbon skin was glued to the surface of the booms. This was, and also in our case is, only a safety precaution for existing and flying airplanes. Until last weekend we have not had a single structural failure of a Lightning, and we fly 5 airplanes in our factory team with many hundreds of flights on each of them. We know of at least 80 Lightnings already flying out of the almost 200 produced. So please don’t be worried about a general design problem or a manufacturing defect. But be cautioned to check your tailplane after every landing for damage, especially if you feel that you had hit the ground, and please contact your Rep so that he can send you the tail skid and additional carbon skin free of charge. This will be a piece of mind package for all who worry now. Last but not least, we of course apologize to Rob that he lost his plane in that incident, we thank him that he stayed very very professional, and gave us a chance to investigate and comment, finally improving a product and its handling advices, where we all know that we are somewhat at the limit of the possible, boring 20 kg through the sky with 200 mph+. We are as glad as the pilot that nobody was hurt." For existing customers, please contact the rep through whom you purchased your Lightning to ensure you get the precautionary safety package. Please contact your rep also if you have further questions. Kind regards, Mark |
RE: Composite-ARF Lightning Build Thread
ORIGINAL: SAP_2000 Any news on the kevlar skid and the carbon fibre sheet safety uppgrade parts? Have anyone received theirs yet? I haven't heared anything. Will ask my rep to check it up next time I see him... Anybody know anything? |
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