Jaguar Down-under
 

Saw Gary Belfigio's Jaguar in RCJI. Do any of you Aussie guys out there know anything about this model or Gary's e-mail address. I've been trying to find a ducted fan jag forever. I've worked on the full size, but now I want to fly one of my own.

Jaguar Down-under
 

Dipsy,

Didier Pasquet from Christen Diffusion is working on a Jaguar kit.
You can contact him at http://christen.diffusion.online.fr/
I don't exactly know what has been done yet but it probably worth waiting a bit...!

Florent

Jaguar Down-under
 

G'day Dipsy,

If it's the same plane, Gary scratch built this plane by scaling up a plastic model of the Jaguar. The first flight was at the Leeton jet meeting in 1994 with Jon Hull as test pilot. Gary did a great job building it and from memory it was only a little nose heavy, but better to be that way on first flight.

I don't have a current email address for Gary.


Regards
Bruce

Aussie Jag
 

Is this the one? these pics are from Mangalore 02

Jag
 

Another Jag pic.

Jaguar Down-under
 

G'day Marty,

It appears to be the same model but, he may have built another one since most prototypes are used to sort the bugs out. If it is the original Gary has kept it in very good condition.

Marty, did you enjoy your time at Mangalore???.


Regards
Bruce

Jaguar Down-under
 

G'day Marty,

I just had a look at the inside photo, certainly appears to be new airframe.

Regards
Bruce

JAG
 

Bruce, I had a great time! It was a great to catch up with old friends and new. Now we just have to charter a plane to bring the Aussies over for Florida Jets in February. I know TJT Australia's Chris Mounkley will be coming over with I think Norm Thompson, also David Gladwin suggested he would be attending. It would be great to see more Aussies in Florida in February : )

Jaguar Down-under
 

Thanks for the photo's guy's, at least I know that someones made a jag fly. I've come over all inspired now !!
Marty do you fly anywhere near Toronto. I may be emigrating in the next year, wasn't sure how popular model jets were in Canada. Possibly going to work at Trenton on CH-149's if the the nice man at IMP likes me.
Dave

Trenton
 

Dave- Trenton is about 15 min. drive from me, I live in Belleville and my club is the 'Bay of Quinte'. You may have heard of the Bay of Quinte jet rally, that our club hosts! its the oldest annual R/C jet rally in North America. We have great flying facilities, huge concrete runways nearby at Picton airport an ex WW2 air force base which is just awesome for jets. Hope to see you at the field soon....

Cheers-

Jaguar Down-under
 

Marty, whens your next jet meet? My wife and I are coming out to visit freinds in Toronto and Pickering sometime next year. I don't need much of an excuse to visit Canada. Unfortunately my ties to Ontario aren't all happy. We lost a Nimrod into the lake a few years ago during an airshow. Lost some great blokes that day.
Do you fly much during wintertime?
Dave

winter flying
 

Dave- The 'Bay of Quinte' jet rally dates are yet to be confirmed for 03, but this years 02 jet rally was 14-16 of June and I would expect similar dates for 03. So if you plan on visiting, June would be best for Canadian jet activity. Here some pics. of 'Bay of Quinte' 02 although mostly rained out we still had fun- http://www.TJT.bz/newsdetail.php?news=18&page=0

Winter flying is not too common here as the winter weather is not always cooperative. I am actually getting myself a park flier soon so at least I can get a quick flight in occasionally weather permitting. That said we do get the odd winters day warm/clear enough for jet flying, unfortunately coordinating the good weather with weekends is rare...
I always keep my batteries charged though! on the odd chance, of a clear warmish Sunday : )

Jaguar Down-under
 

Loved the tiger markings on the f-16. I used to serve on a tiger sqn(230sqn RAF Aldergrove), it was a blast when we went to airshows. I think floats would have been more appropriate for your 'roo'!

Tiger Meet
 

Dave re- tiger, It looks great in the air highly visible! do you have any pics form the Tiger Meets? I would love to see some of the elaborate tiger paint schemes.

The ROO flies great in the rain - natural water injection rocks!

Jaguar Down-under
 

http://www.natotigers.org/ is the official web site for us tigers, but its only under construction at the moment.

http://www.onzeluchtmacht.nl/gallery/gal_tiger.htm has a load of tiger pics

http://cavok-aviation-photos.net/Tigermeet2001.html even more.

There are loads of sites in 'google. just type in tiger meet.

The tiger I put on the Puma for Fairford 97 (I think) was put on after we landed. It took twelve hours of solid work. Each stripe was individually put on. It was worth the effort, we came second to a KC-135 that had a massive tiger on it. Earned myself a lot of smarty points that weekend!!

jaguar down under
 

Don't know about that Jag in RCJI but was built by Geoff Sparks who does not have an email address and he has built 3 or 4 of them thru the years. The latest one is turbine however Gary's was made by Geoff also. Will try get some contact details, ok.

Jaguar Down-under
 

Cheers Jason
If you could find out I'll have your babies!!!!
Dave

Jaguar Down-under
 

g'day guys, i've just had a look at the jag letters for the first time, first time to r/c u actually, and i must say i'm rather flattered about some of the jag comments. some truths about the history of the model(s).john hull did in fact test fly #1 at leeton at around the time brucem says(is that bruce mondenitz from toowoomba?) it was handled very well by john but a sticky main gear leg caused it to roll on landing no damage though.jason r is exactly right, gary belfiglio did own this aircraft but it WAS built by me,gary did not scale up a plastic model i did.i built #2 some time later, maybe 96, both these with os 91/ramtec,gary's take off weight about 18~19 lbs mine ~16lbs.they flew quite ok.i went to indonesia and worked for four years, while i was gone my jag was put on the hard rubbish clean up!!! thanks mum!!somebody picked it up but it hasn't been seen again since.on return i started #3 and it was belted hard on its test flight~not by me!!anyway a bit more glue and some sticks of balsa fixed it.thought it prudent to trust in thrust so a pst j600 was installed~great little engine, well worth looking into if you're in the market for that size motor~it flew well with the pst but too scale~underpowered!!a big ask of a 5.5 kilo motor too lift off at ~11 kilo~24lbs with a split duct, so a jetcat p 80 has been installed but as yet not flown, a few more tune ups and it will go at adelaide jet action march 14~16. i will post some photos when i get time have a few during construction too. a few quick stats length 2100mm~83'' span 1470mm~57'' and the span is stretched by about 200mm in the root, the real thing has a TINY wing to reduce gust response` they are supposed to fly fast and low~just the way we like it yeah!! i have moulds of the inlets, exhaust duct,conformal fuel tanks, can cut the wings and stabs,formers etc so a short kit would not be out of the question~most of these are for the df version some adaption would be needed for turbine but it is my intention to develope this model. anyway seeya later for now and if anyone is after more info don't hesitate to get in touch

Jaguar Down-under
 

G'day Blackcat (Jeff???),

Welcome to RCU, It is a great site.
Sorry about getting the story wrong, I just went and pulled out the video on the '94 Leeton and there it is, If you would like a copy of the first Jaguar Flight, I can do it up as a Mpeg File and send it to you on a CD. This might ease the pain of your Mum throwing out #2 & what she thought was rubbish.

Regards
Bruce Mondientz
Toowoomba

Jaguar Down-under
 

yeah its jeff, i think the last time i saw you was at amberly raaf base i never hear of any jet fly's there anymore, a video would be great bruce cheers i'll keep in touch

sparkes

Jaguar ?????'s
 

Jeff,
I began designing a large (>100") turbine powered Jaguar about 5 years ago. The drawings were about 1/2 done when life got in the way and everything has been sitting in the closet ever since. I will be getting re-started on this project in the next month or two and it sounds like you might be able to answer some questions I still have about my design.

Q#1.
The full scale Jaguar has a significant amount of down thrust in exhaust nozzles (around 4-5 degrees). Did your model have down thrust in the exhaust? and if so, how much?


Q#2.
Roll control. Did you use spoilers and tailerons (like the full scale), or did you install ailerons.
I am hoping to use tailerons and spoilers for mine, but the complexity (and limited space in the tail cone) may preclude this.

I absolutely love the look of the Jag, and think it will make a great model. If you have any suggestions or warnings I would really like to learn from your experience. :D

Thanks,

Jaguar Down-under
 

Hey sparks welcome,
I'd definately be interested in any stuff you have on a Jag ( I'm happy to pay any postal charges of course). If you want any technical stuff let me know, the airframe sgt I work for is ex 6SQN (Flying Canopeners) and knows a s**tload about the big cat. And another guy I work with spent five years doing Jag major servicings at RAF St Athan. Judging by the pics though you did a fantastic job on your own. I have an OS 91+RAMTEC Fan waiting for it.

Dave

P.S Any word on whats happening with Warney

Jaguar Down-under
 

G'day Jeff,

Can you send me an email with your postal address so I send you the C.D.


Regards
Bruce

[email protected]

jag stuff
 

g'day again guys i'll attatch a photo this time of the elevator pivot blocks as built . they have since had the following mods.
1) servos were changed to hitec 9545 digitals 13kg at 6v about 180 oz in
2)the brass bushings have been upgraded to twin ball bearings by pulling out the stab, lapping the aluminium(note the spelling usa dudes!!) rod is solid 10mm(3/8'') until i could push the bearings on from inside and then packing a thick slurry of milled carbon around the outside of the bearing as a carrier~the rod and bearings were installed tonight and the slurry tomorrow, all this because of a little slop from the original setup that i couldn't stop thinking about!
so i guess this may answer 1 of kevin w's questions~ this jag #3 has all flying stabs as elevators only(massed balanced), conventional ailerons, flaps, rudder no spoilers. so as you can see the setup could be for roll control in the tail but i have no experience with any model setup like this.the other two had fixed stab and elevator
rudder is a similar setup but with closed loop, 2-56 rod (about1.5 in long) and 4 swivel linksrudder servo sits behind ele rods.i'll post some more pics of the control setups when time permits~is r/c u strict on 75kb for pics? i'll have to reduce some to get on if so

Jaguar Down-under
 

one more of the rudder

Jaguar Down-under
 

Jeff,

Thanks for the pics.
That is a nice compact arrangment you have for the elevator linkages. I like the way you made the horns.
That is very similar to what I have been planning for my Jaguar, but I think I will also investigate the possibility of using the spoilers for roll control. I plan to build a small (about 3' ) glider to test much of these ideas before actually using them in the big one, so hopefully there won't be too many surprises :eek: on the first flight.
I'll keep you updated on my progress.

Jaguar Down-under
 

Kevin
Since you are putting spoilers on your jet, are you going the whole way and fitting slats to ?

Any chance of some more pic's Jeff, and are you making a scale u/c ? They're a tight fit on the full size and you wouldn't want your hand in the way when the bay doors close ! Since your into the Jag, you may be interested in the plans I've just started work on....The Buccaneer?
Dave

Jaguar Down-under
 

Dave,

Nothing is in concrete yet. Until I have built and flown the glider to test the different control system ideas (spoilers vs. tailerons or combination of the two) I am not sure exactly which method I will use to control this sucker.
Slats would be nice, but with all of the other challenges associated with this airplane ( i.e. very complicated scale gear, full span flaps in a very thin wing) I think I will avoid making it even more complex than it needs to be.

Jaguar Down-under
 

Kevin
Don't be put put off by the look of the gear, it's a lot simpler than it looks. It just pivots about an angled hinge, and what looks like a big jack is just a drag strut. The main bogies are tucked away using a fixed strut and some simple geometry.Watching it all tuck itself away from five feet away is pretty cool, especially when you reduce the hyd pressure and do it in slo mo.
You're not wrong about the wing, I couldn't believe how thin it was the first time I worked on it.
One thing that may be of interest, the full size aircraft tend to leave the pylons on even if they are not carrying stores as it helps the handling characteristics. The display aircraft has the outbourd pylons left on.

Dave

Gear
 

Dave,

Thanks for the encouragement.

I think I already have a relatively good understanding of the gear geometry, but I would definately welcome any input you might have!!
I have studied literally hundreds of photos of the gear in various stages of transit, but the biggest help so far has been the plastic models and the Discovery Wings channel broadcast last month on French aviation (dont' worry, I am doing either the GR-1 or the International :D ). The program had several scenes of the gear retraction sequence of a Jaguar on stands including relatively close shots of the mains as well as the nosegear. It was like a godsend for a guy who has never even seen one of these things but wishes to reproduce it, I stayed up all night just to be sure I caught it on tape.

The main problems I see with the gear now (now that I understand how they work) will be in manufacture of the complicated parts, and in locking mechanisms.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it appears that the main gear on the full size Jag do not have positive locks. From what I have seen there are two hydraulic rams, one to push the gear up and the other to push it down, and the only down lock appears to be from positive pressure in the hydraulic ram. I do not see any kind of over-center linkage at all. I do not wish to get into hydraulics (ala Fiberclassics Mig-29), so I think I will have to comprimise some "scale" for functionality in the operation of the main gear.

The other problem is that the angles of the main struts and associated attached mounting lugs do not lend themselves to being reproduced by standard machine tools (at least not the ones I have in my garage). I have a feeling that several parts of the gear will have to be investment cast from raw aluminium (notice spelling since this is a "limey" aircraft).

I realize that I have MUCH work to do before this airplane takes to the sky, but I think it will be well worth the effort to see a 9 foot Jaguar making a low pass at 195mph!!! (estimated speed sanitized for the AMA lurkers) :D
I welcome any advise, pictures, or encouragement you might have.

Jaguar Down-under
 

Kevin
I have a sheet of drawing that you could have, and I will speek to 'wolfie' my boss, but I sure the down lock on the mains is hydraulic via the big drag strut. The actual retraction jack is at the back of the leg. Hydraulically it's one of the simpler aircraft I've worked on, well laid out and easy to understand.
Send me an e-mail at [email protected] and I'll be able to go into more depth.

Dave

Re Jag / Jags
 

Hi there all.

My name is Rick and I have a Jag just like Jeff's and just like the one that Jeff built for Garry,

Well to be accurate the one I have was built by Jeff as well,
It has not been airborne as yet. as I need to finish it.

Jeff did the building & glassing but I need to do the finishing

The new Jags #3 (Jeff's) & #4 my Jag are far more to scale then the original Jag.

Regards to all :) :) :)

Jaguar Down-under
 

Hi Rick
Which version/colours are you going to finish it off in ?
Even though I'm biased towards the RAF versions, I really like the look of the M model the French used for carrier trials.
Hope it goes well.
Dave

Jaguar Down-under
 

Dipsy,
Regarding the colour I am not sure as to what I will do however I am positive the Jag will go Great.

after it is painted i will post some pics

Keep in touch


Rick.

PS Marty, Did you enjoy mangalore and have a good trip home.

Jaguar Down-under
 

The RAF jets are painted in a funky new overall grey.

Jaguar Down-under
 

just wrote a heap of notes on control setups that this computor wiped before posting i'll get back in a couple of days guys this screen is jumping all over the place

Jaguar Down-under
 

Kevin
Sent you a couple of e-mails
Dave

Jaguar Down-under
 

Here's a great link for Jag detail guy's.

http://jaguar.hyperlink.cz/photo.htm

Dave

Jaguar Down-under
 

g'day chaps. a few more musings on the jag. i've just returned from adelaide jet action and the jag's first flight with the jetcat 80. it went superbly power wise,a much more appropriate engine for this particular model, however, during the conversion it lost a little weight in the nose~this isn't heading to the catostrophic conclusion that the dreaded words TAIL HEAVY conjur up thanks entirely to the profound skill and cool head of paul bennet!~best test pilot in this solar system! but it did dip a wing on roll out after landing and broke off the outer panel. i consider it a very lucky escape and thank the gods that i have the good sense to delegate test flying to someone with the skill, detatchment and analytical capabilities to make a test flight a wealth of information, not just blast around and say thats nice, or not!

anyway to summarise and i think kevin will be interested in this;

on this flight the C G was set at about 17% mac ~at the last minute i actually tied a 6" shifting spanner in the nose!!!!! this is what probably saved the model!!!! it was very touchie and rocking the wings through straight and level flight. as the fuel burned off it just shifted forward enough to land ok~albiet quite hot. the first test flight had the C G falling at approx 10% dry with all fuel forward and it landed very nicely~ i still can't explain the brain explosion that had me tampering with something that works!! the wing sweep is approx 45* and this it seems makes the wing behave very much like a delta so i've made a new set of extra strong wings for the intact fuse and guts that i so fortunately still posess

kevin the thrust line is just about zero along the bottom of the steel pipe (in elevation) with the top tapering down. with the p80 i tied the model by the main landing gear to a fishermans scale and read out 8kg~ virtually no thrust loss in this bifurcated pipe (it was made by intairco australia) the same scale with the pst read 4.5kg~ so a very informative and downright lucky flight that one! thanks splinters!!!

lets all hope that these middle east problems are short lived and merciful and we can continue to admire these wonderful jet
aircraft as thoroughbreds rather than delivery systems

Jaguar Down-under
 

The full size aircraft suffers from rocking wings when there is too much angle of attack. It gets progressivly worse until the aircraft departs completely, which is extremely violent. Just goes to show you have built an extremely scale like model. Any chance of some pics to drool over?