avg_joe

I want to hear everybody's opinion as to why I should or shouldn't 'upgrade' to a hardened steel idler in my trany. Tub style rc10 GT with a Dynamite 12spd. Gearing at stock or one step toward acceleration. 20% nitro.
Also wondering about opinions on ceramics. While I have it apart, I was thinking about replacing the bearings in the trany with ceramic ones, as this is about the only place that I can see would really benefit from ceramics in offroad conditions.(and justify expense) They are getting replaced anyway, as they have gone through several sets of tires, and 2 idler gears. They are showing some slop, and I don't doubt that was a contributing factor in the wear of the idler. Would the initial expense outweigh any potential gains in performance, and maintenance? Just a basher, so I'm not looking for power at the sake of longevity, but in theory....

ICrashThings

i have the steel idler and diff. get both and you have no worries!

avg_joe

Somehow, I already knew that you were gonna say that.LOL
My main concern would be that any vibration caused from all that metal meshing doesn't get absorbed by anything, and could manifest itself in radio interferance, or accelerated bearing wear in the trany...

EdsWords

I have a steel idler and diff gear sitting in my pit box. The plastic ones last about 2 diff rebuilds and cost only 6 dollars to replace. I dont think steel is much of an upgrade.

InfinitySpeed04

when you upgrade to a harder material there is nothing to worry about because everything that companies sell they test out in many different situations and other types of problems.

jakjr

My Feedback: (18)

If you arent stripping out gears to the point that your tearing your tranny apart weekly, then stick with the composite gears.

Metal gears just add rotating mass and will in fact wear out over time.

avg_joe

Any opinions about ceramic bearings? Are they worth the added expense for the trany? What about maintenance, do they require more or less fequent attention? Would they last longer? I don't have any experience with them, except once I put them in the clutch bell, and they blew in 15 min, just like the normal ones(had worn clutch nut), so I want to hear what people that have used them think.
Thanx!

Jamxx

Sorry, I don't know anything about ceramic bearings, and that's why I'm posting this. What exactly are they? I know what ceramic is, and I know what a bearing is, but putting the two together just doesn't seem like that combination would make an effective product.

Basically what I'm saying is, what are they? I've never seem them before nor heard of them until now.

avg_joe

Ceramic bearings are just a higher quality bearing, with the balls made out of some ceramic material instead of metal. Ceramic is harder than metal, so the bearings would run with less friction, freeing up HP to the rear wheels. They are also made to tighter tolerances, too(I think), making them run straighter. They are harder, therefore more brittle, and don't take side loads well, and prone to failure in harsher conditions. They are also more expensive(only by a LOT). Which makes me cautious for a number of reasons. One, I like my money, and like to keep as much of it as possible. Two, if they fail inside the trany, then I don't know about it until I shred a gear(or gears).(refer back to One) Three, if they don't last as long, then my fun is cut short due to breakage, and no lhs for 100 miles.
I know they aren't suitable for clutch bell, or wheel bearings in offroad vehicles, but I though that the trany is fairly rigid, and no side loads should be transmitted into the trany...

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

if you haven't torn up a stock idler gear yet, why would you upgrade it?

avg_joe

T'bird, I have torn up the stock idler. I tore up two idlers with the set of bearings that were in the trany.(over a period of time) The bearings are starting to get a little bit sloppy, so I will replace them. That was the reason for this whole thread, I was wondering if it is worth the expense to put hardened idler, and ceramic bearings while I have it apart, and have to replace it all anyway.

Jamxx

Ah... Thanks for the information Joe, I'll keep that in mind. [8D]

cruuk

One other thing is if you are still running the plastic diff gear, make sure there is never any slipping. As soon as it does slip all the balls will melt into the gear and it will be useless. Luckily there is an aluminum one, which I use for bashing. Dont know if all the extra weight of an all metal driveline is good for racing but I dont care :P

econ909

What about metal spers ? whats the whole deal if they cost so much then they must last.. i hear alot of gruff about them but no one has really used them. i heard it can make your system have glitches.
if you have every thing properly set up, no slip in the diff, slippage in the slipper clutch so you dont fry anything. all of your moving parts move free. sometimes stuff gets dirty and you need to clean out the trans of gunk and the bearings. and most of all chassis flex. i put a zip tie from my trans to my engine so they dont sepperate. i have an older style Fac-team GT with the black tub. i heard there is an aftermarket brace but i havnt found it maybe some one can help..

cruuk

Ive heard the old tub chassis can be hard on spur gears, especially with more power. Ive used the factory team chassis and the Team Blue Star chassis and have never stripped a plastic spur gear, even with the .18

jakjr

My Feedback: (18)

Metal spur adds ALOT of extra rotating mass, which slows acceleration and top speed. Theyll last longer than a plastic spur, but youll pay triple when it comes time to replace a metal spur or chewed up CB.

As far as glitching goes, any constant metal to metal contact can cause RF interference, so the less metal-metal contact the better.

econ909

so say if i blew a CB bearing and the Cb was rubbing on the flywheel would that make the system glitch?

jakjr

My Feedback: (18)

It could.

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

Joe, yeah, might as well throw the idler in, but i PERSONALLY wouldn't bother with any exotic bearings.

avg_joe

I just replaced everything with stock. I have been down for a while, and I don't feel like experimenting right now. I just wanna play, and the stock ones worked just fine for quite a while. I have a small track and I don't need all that extra performance anyway. I will eventually test out ceramics in the trany, or maybe pick up another trany to do up, so I can just do a quick switch and compare, but right now it's time to play!!