Ok Pattern pilots,

The AMA Intermediate class 402 we have right now....Comparing to where you think it should be.
Now realize the sequence is really short two maneuvers from its intent. Regardless of whether those replacement figures are a snap or not...

What difficulty should we have in the Intermediate.

It has been suggested the step from Intermediate to Advanced is a little too big. We don't want to make a huge leap from Sportsman to Intermediate...So where should it fall.

If you think its OK and Advanced is the place to make the change then vote for #1 and go the next poll on Advanced.

And vote your opinion on it as well.

poll will run until Sat March 12th at Midnight MST

Thanks,

Troy Newman
Chairman, NSRCA Sequence Proposal Committee.

Troy,
I'm a current Intermediate pilot. I believe more inverted flight, and a slow roll should be added. Adding these 2 manuvers will help to prepare the intermediate pilot for advanced. The inverted flight and slow roll could be set up to be flown at a higher altitude. This would take some of the fear factor out of them for the less experienced or new intermediate pilot.

I'm also an Intermediate pilot. I also think that at least on inverted exit maneuver should be included in our sequence. I also think a snap would be nice, since it looks like the snap roll (however controversial and difficult to judge they are)will be included for all eternity in upper classes.

Look on the pattern mailing list archive and search for for the 402 Pattern shootout. The unknown sequence we flew was created by Don Ramsey and was a well thought out, very nice sequence that is closer to where I think 402 should be.

I think the jump from 401 to 402 should be greater and would help mitigate the rather significant jump we have now from 402 to 403...

Here's the sequence for those that don;t want to search for it:

Takeoff
Stall Turn with 1/4 up and down, exit upright (C)
Immelman with 2/4 exit upright (T)
Reverse Triangle Loop, exit upright (C)
Bunt no rolls, exit inverted (T)
Square loop with 1/2 roll on top, exit upright (C)
Humpty Bump 1/4 up and down, exit upright (T)
Top Hat with 1/2 rolls in verticals, exit upright (C)
Figure 9, 1/2 roll up, pull over top, exit upright (T)
2/4 point roll, exit inverted (C)
Figure 9, 1/2 roll down, push over top, exit inverted (T)
Double Immelman, 1/2 roll on top, no roll out, exit upright (C)
Half Square with 1/2 roll up, exit upright (T)
45 degree down, positive snap roll, exit upright (C)
Landing


Richard

Troy I agree with these guys. The two roll maneauvers, should be taken out and a slow roll added. It will give us a chance to use more of the rudder as we advance to "Advance" No pun intended!!

I fly intermediate. I agree with the addition of a slow roll, but not the elimination of the two rolls. An inverted exit manoever would also add interest.

This is perhaps personal, but I prefer large, graceful manoevers, especially those that require a lot of power. Snaps definitely lack grace and I'd prefer they not be added to this class. I accept that they are unavoidable in the higher classes.

Hey Troy,

I have to agree with Bokuda about the changes... a slow roll would be good and another inverted flight piece could be added. Not sure about a snap for Intermediate,
but right now, so much of it is kicking my bottom that it probably doesn't matter in
the long run. ; - )

Terry

I flew Intermediate last yr until the last 2 contests. The step from intermediate to Advanced is quite large. It would be a better transition if intermediate had some snap or spin, and at least 1 outside exit maneuver. It seems like 1/2 of the advanced pattern is an inverted exit. Advanced is a much more challenging and fun sequence though !!

I would like to see a spin added to the intermediate. Maybe a 2 turn spin upright to upright would be a good choice.

Randy

I. too, would have no problem with adding a spin of some type.

Dave

I fly intermediate and think a slow roll is a good idea. I also would like to see a snap or spin. It sure would be interesting to have a inverted exit in the sequence although I don't know if I am ready for that. It could be the end to alot of planes if you pull instead of push. I do think that inverted flight is good and the outside loop helps for the push that would be required for inverted exits.

I moved up to advance last year, mainly because I though the intermediate patten did not challenge me enough. It was a mistake to take out the snap.

Hey Troy.......

Speaking as I flew intermediate last year and this year will be flying advanced, I personally think that the "BIG" transition should be left where it is. I feel that Sportsman to Intermediate should be gradual. It moves the people up that have flown pattern for possibly one year. They don't need a large jump into manuvers they may not feel comfortable with.
Now Intermediate to Advanced. I fell that the jump is about right. The maneuvers in Advanced are more challenging, yes, but they are for a more "advanced" pilot. They're not too hard though. I think that when you have made the transition to the middle class, you should be able to fly inverted, do rolls (slow, snap, and point) and also be able to make rudder corrections in lines. The current advanced schedule is good because it gets us ready for the more challenging Masters.

Intermediate for me was learning a little more of how to input rudder corrections to fly lines.

I think maybe if anything possibly a slow roll for intermediate, but most of the intermediate pilots I have seen, don't know how, or just don't input rudder and elevator throughout their rolls. I kinda thought that 3 rolls used to be a good thing, because it taught me how to use rudder and elevator through out my rolls.
Maybe a immelman with 2 of 4 out.

Krishlan