Hi All,

Just a thought I had after practice on Sunday that I wanted to throw out there to get people's responses: I was drawing a half-reverse Cuban eight on a piece of transparency to help with my visualization of the maneuver when I realized that it's actually a very difficult maneuver to pull off perfectly because of one thing - It is the loop segments (1/8th, and 5/8th loop) that dictates the length of the straight line (45 degrees) segment. In executing the move though, when a pilot is "drawing" the straight line segment, he/she's only pulled the 1/8th loop! So the pilot has to be very clear in their mind about the size (radius) of the major loop segment (5/8th), to establish the right length of the 45 degree line, and the only real visual clue he/she has is this short 1/8th loop done right at the beginning! Now technically, this is because the AMA book says under "Description of Maneuvers", "...All maneuvers which contain more than one (1) loop or contain partial loops should maintain a constant radius for the looping portions of the maneuver.." So if the 1/8th and 5/8th loops are to have the same radius and for the entry/exit altitude to match, the straight line segment can only be a certain length. Of course, this is only the case for those of us trying to keep the entry/exit altitudes the same (as in Sportsman - not a requirement in other instances).

Any thoughts, anyone?

Cheers,
Ken

Do not allow the loop portion to dictate the length of your upline. The length of your upline will dictate the size of the loop. Of course, you do not want to pull a 30 foot diameter loop, but do not get carried away and end the upline at hourglass altitude. If you make your loop to big, then you will probably end up outside of the end marker and zero the whole manuever.

This is a case of where it is easier to fly than to draw.

Mark

I'm not a pattern expert but i agree with what mark is saying. In a PERFECT world the size of the loop would have to be predetermined. In the real world you can make small corrections in the 5/8ths part of the loop to end up at the same spot, and the Radius wont vary enough to be noticeable as compared to the initial 1/8th segment. The key to flying ANY airplane smoothly and professionally is making small enough corrections early enough that no one else can tell you are even making corrections.

One other aspect to to try and visulize. When properly done the 1/2 Cuban 45 degee line wll not look the same at the end of the box as it does right in front of you. The line will appear to be at a sharper angle when it is further away from you when done properly. A common mistake made by pattern freshman. You will have a tendancy to make the 45 degree line too shallow resulting in either a too low of an exit because of a constant raduis loop or you will be pinching the 5/8 loop to keep the same altitude. A point made to me by an FAI pilot. In the lower classes up through advanced there are several areas this manuever is executed either reversed or normal. And the exit should be the same altitude as entry.

Mark, I'm one of the "Freshman" fliers and I wouldn't consider giving anyone advice on doing any maneuver because I'm not qualified.

However, I did want to clarify for Ken one point you made regarding going outside the box when doing the turn-around 1/2 Rev. Cuban. You mentioned that if you came down outside the box you'd zero the entire maneuver, but the way it has been scored at the contests I've attended is that only the percentage of the maneuver that is outside the box will be deducted for a box violation.

Therefore if you do a perfect maneuver and 1/4 of it is outside the box you will get a 7.5. I don't know if this varies with FAI or if it is enforced differently at different competitions, but this is the way it has been enforced in my very minimal experience.

Keith

One other comment, I'd agree with what Toymaker said about the 45 deg up line at the end of the box looking too steep. I practiced this on my on for a few weeks and when I finally went to a field with experienced pattern fliers one of the first things I was told was that my up-lines weren't steep enough. When I adjusted and did as they instructed I was shocked at how steep it looked. I still don't know exactly how steep to draw those lines, but I'm closer than I was .

Actually, I must correct myself, one of the first things they said was something to the effect of "Hey dummy, fly straight". OK, they didn't really say "dummy" but that's how I felt

That's why it's nice to have some experienced pattern fliers to fly with .

Keith

Make a 45 degree triangle out of cardboard and hold it up to get roughly the perspective you would have when flying a 1/2 reverse cuban, that gives you a very good idea of just how steep to make it.

As far as box violations, they are a little different in FAI than in the AMA classes. You are penalized less in FAI when flying within 150 meters. You can get that kind of info from the NSRCA judging page, I dont remember it off the top of my head.

The trick to box violations is not to make them Then it doesnt matter how they are downgraded LOL

Scoring clarification: Keith you are close.

All manuevers are scored 2 points per 25% off position. Therefore, if the entire manuever was done out of the box and it was otherwise perfect, it would be a 2.

Likewise, a centered manuever performed totally to the left of center would recieve an 8 point downgrade as well.

The reason it usually comes out as zero is because it's less than perfect too. Man those points add up quick =)

These are AMA rules of course. International rules may vary.

-Mike

It used to be everyday, but now it's only about 6 days per week that I learn something new.

FAI code indeed states that manuevers flown partially outside of the box should be downgrade accordingly and only zeroed when entry AND exit (the whole manuever) are done outside of the box. My mistake.


Mark