RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Matt and Bryan:

Thanks, sounds like things are working out well.

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

We (pattern pilots) are a very unique in how we think and fly. We go out to the field and practice our maneuvers every chance we can and for the most part we are happy:eek:
We feel that if we fly good it all comes down to 75% pilot skills and 25% airplane & setup. Well boys.......! Yesterday that illusion was shattered when Bryan Hebert gave me the controls to his Shinden. Please don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that the plane makes the pilot. What I am saying is it does narrows the gap. We should all be so lucky as have someone like Bryan Hebert give us the chance to fly a pattern plane as nice as the Shinden. My eyes are now open [sm=49_49.gif]

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

I agree, Jon, after flying the Genesis that Bryan set up I don't know how I ever got by flying my old plane. I think it's more like a 50/50 split on skills/plane setup. But then again, isn't it pilot skill that helps them set up their own airplane? Granted, if I always ask for Bryan to set up my planes, I'll never learn how to do it myself. On my next plane I'm definitely gonna have him teach me how to do it, as opposed to just getting him to do it. Not that I haven't already learned a lot from him. The Shinden does fly nice though, don't ya think?

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Jon,
The plane, theoretically, should not be the limiting factor. Better pilot needs a better plane. I helped a guy adjust the balance on his P-51 today and he was amazed. Thrilled. The P-51 sport scale is still a turd, but he loved it. You got your hands on a plane that does not limit you. You would feel limited by a Cessna, but an F-22 might stretch you, and you are a professional pilot. The Shinden suited you. Feels good, doesn't it? Bryan understands airplane design and airplane trimming, as you observed today. Come back to Dixie and fly my 3D.... you'll like it too. And I have flown that Shinden, as you will recall. I've done all of the work trimming the 3D since Bryan finished with the original setup, most of which he pointed out the need for. What's important here, is me learning what he's showing. That's the really neat thing about this hobby, when people do it right; we all win. Bryan is my good friend, and it's only natural that I should blow his horn, but, he's a great guy that gets his high by seeing those he helps out to succeed. That's a rare commodity. And it is why I recommend his planes. He helps because he likes to, and he's good at it. You should have been around when the Quest was flying, though. Another great plane, but it was akin to that F-22; a really hot setup! Not many could handle it.

BTW, I pulled the DZ out of the 3D and put an "L" in it, along with other mods that have it approaching 10 lbs. It's flying really good. Come give it a try, too.

Brian C.

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Any properly setup airplane can be a winner in the hands of a skilled pilot. I am not knocking any of the expensive designs but, a plane helps but skill and an eye for patern is the most iportant.

My father is an amazing pilot, can fly anything and he can't fly pattern to save his life.. draw a straight line.. when told.. no way... stall turns in a particular spot, he folds like a wet paper bag, let him just have fun.. amazing.

give him a perfectly setup pattern plane, guess what, same probem. so i believe it is all pilot, the plane just makes it easier.

Chuck

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

What you stated coincides with my own experience ------stated numerically about 5% Airplane and 95% fuel/time spent flying it!

The guy with the basic set up and LOTS of time practicing will usually win. Quique with your airplane, your setup-----will still probably win.

There is no way to beat effective hours spent flying. Quique (Chip, Jason, Sean, Tony, Don, Troy) are making corrections they don't even realize they are making-------matter of fact if you have to THINK about the correction you probably aren't in the top ten.

Hours upon hours plus a decent A/C which isn't changing "looks" on you each flight is the recipe----Oh yes, GOT to have the basic talents too.

But with that as a given it still comes down to the 100 Gallons of fuel each year ----- year after year.

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Maybe so, but you are assuming that ANY plane can be properly set up. One past design that is well known was the Prophecy. Lotta trophies won with it. Doesn't do knife edge very well by today's standards. Sean McMurtry doesn't fly his any more, sold it to Chris White several years ago. He beat you and I both with it. And I hope Chris is still flying it. My plane does a beautiful knife edge, with my inferior skills. Might be the edge I need when Chris and I meet again. Winning, second place, third...... not much separates them in Muncie. A better design would do it.

A 'skilled pilot' would win almost anywhere with a 'properly set up' plane, but to win in the big show, you need the best tools.

Brian

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

150 if you're using a DZ!!

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Any news on the next shipment? Mine is in it I hope. :)

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

:(
You are right!! Guess I was too busy putting the 55 Gallon Drum in the trailer for Saturday's practice session [&o]:)

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Looks like the next shipment will be in April.
But I'm not going to hold my breath.[&:]

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Need some help here. I'm trying to get everything I need for this airplane before it gets here. Anyone care to list what works well in this such as tank, servos (IE low profile for ailerons) Which pull pull setup. Wheel size and things like that. I have a 821 muffler, Hyde ARIA mount, NPM Header.

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

When to the Post Office yesterday and weighed my Shinden - Bad news for me - It weighed 11 pounds 9 ozs.

Billy

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

OMG are you kidding? 11lbs 9 oz. I would demand a recount. what are you flying in the plane, a da 50?

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

It flys great with a 160 DZ. Weighed it twice. My scales said 11 lbs 6 ozs.

Billy

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Some suggestions on weight; the Hyde ARA mount is 3.1 oz, the ARIA is 4.9 oz. I recommend the Futaba 9650 servo for throttle, 0.9 oz; the 3050 servo for rudder (1.6 oz and 90 0z torque) 9550 for elevator 1.6 oz and 83 oz torque; and 1.9 oz 9150's in the wings. Using the 791 header and 821 pipe is light, too. DEPS pushrod in place of the supplied pushrod; light backplate for the spinner, Duralite battery (or li-poly's) and watch your servo mounting very carefully. I can take pics of mine, if anyone wants to see it, of the installation. I've got a SUPER LIGHT tank mount, too. Easy to make, weighs next to nothing. It's not exactly like Bryan's, but he likes it.

Of course, some trick things can help; carbon fiber spinner, Dubro diamond tread tires, and I have a bunch of little things to help weight placement for balancing without using lead weights. Did you know that moving the motor mount 1/8" forward is equivalent to adding an ounce of lead six inches forward of the CG? Think inch-ounces of lever moment. And try not to add lead weight to balance. Mine is one of the first batch, too, and I've been careful with installation, but not crazy with it. Bob Violette has set absolute weight standards for everything received after the first batch, but the first five just need a little bit extra care. Hebert was flying his today with Matt Frederrick and I; we can attest to the performance, in his hands.

I'm sure Hebert can help you 'get er done', as Bob Violette mentioned in the instruction book sent with the model. Bryan has a couple of things that will shed a few ounces, too, if you would call the number in your instruction manual. It's not going to be easy to get performance, durability, and low weight or else everybody would be doing it! This is a BIG model. But shedding six ounces is do-able. And help has been made available.

Brian

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

I re-read the first post; NINE ounces is do-able. Call Hebert, or call me. You will need to do an inventory of every component, with weights of each.

Brian Clemmons
225-572-0189

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

11.9 Maybe a Aprils Fools joke ? :)

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Nope, not a joke. I fly with Billy every weekend and his shinden is 11lbs. 9 oz. It's a shame as it flies very nice, just can't go to the nats with it.

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

What got it so heavy? If the rest are coming in at near this weight it's going to be tough to sell. :(

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

the airplane is Big But it will make weight !!
there are a few things that you have to be carfull of
Mine is under 11 pounds and nothing Exotic.
it is a very good flyer the more I fly it the better it Gets

TWTaylor.
e-mail me if you need any info on what to put in it to keep it light
However the weight issues have been addressed and the new ones are lighter
Bryan

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

I read where you said had changes made that would lower the weight by 8 oz or so. This is going to be so much fun...............

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

I guess it might be considered fun if you didn't have a horse in the race! ;)

Brian

RE: Hebert's Shinden
 

Just took the NiCd battery out and replaced it with a lipo. Saved 5 ozs - 4 more to go.

Billy