RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Thanks for the tips Mike.

Thanks for the photos Tom.

Seeing pics tells 1000 words for sure.:D

After talking with George I suspect I'm going to have to change my plans regarding finishing the model. Was planning on a full glass and paint finish but may have to reconsider due to weight. I'll see how the finished airframe weighs out and make a final decision then.

When I bought the kit from you Mike you talked me into the motor box type mount for my AXI F3A motor. Was going to use a 20x13 prop on it to begin with which seems to be the consensus for this motor.

Thanks again.

Regards
Jason.

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Dad was going to glass and paint my airplane as well. He bought all the resin and glass and was ready to do it. About halfway through the sanding I talked him into covering it and it worked out well. Having a nice glass finish would be nice, but the covering was quicker and less work (though I know you disagree Mike ;).

20x13 on the AXI works real well and is a great starting point. I'm using the 20x13 with my V3 and it works great, different motor, but similar kV.

Tom

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Weight: the plane is not inherently heavy, but it depends on the builder/finisher. The glassed and painted VF3s I built this year were all between 10lbs 2ozs and 10lbs 7ozs. That's with the large AXI and larger packs. But, I have been around this block a few times, and Dean and I shared a lot of info and spent countless hours brainstorming and working out the technique. it's definitely easier to just monokote the darned thing and be done with it, just keep the wrinkles to a minimum LOL

It starts with the foam and wood selection. I have much better foam than I had even a year ago, so over here, it starts out better....the wood in the kits is the best I can get, and it's pretty darned good. the sheeting/capping is up to the builder. if you get complacent there you can pick up a full pound or more. if you treat it well this plane will last for several years and countless flights....so my theory is on the front end, just be a little more picky and patient. GOOD balsa can be hard to get at times, just don't settle for "ok" wood. Especially with an electric.

I'm considering taking some video of critical things like sheeting and capping, glassing and such and posting it on my site. I'll probably do something between now and the end of the year and if it's well recieved, I'll pursue it further. But there are some things you just have to see, and even a still camera doesn't do it justice...

-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Tom,
That's cool that you have something like that to remember your dad by. I lost my father last year so I kinda know how you feel. Time will make it less painful but you'll NEVER get over it. My dad taught me how to build and fly so that part of him still lives on. When I look at my V2 I remember how he taught me to carve balsa (lotsa curves on that tail!). He would have been proud...

Jason,
You might consider silkspan and dope with a Urethane finish. A bit lighter than 'glass. I might do my VF-3s that way. My V2 has Monokote on the wings and stab's. It looks good but there's nothing like a fully painted airplane!

Mike,
Aquila is done so I'm back on the Magics!!!

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Guys,

I am putting together a 'shopping list' for everything I will need for a BM VF3. What Speed/Torque paramaters do you look for in an Elevator servo?


Chris

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

FAST and ACCURATE. Torque itself isn't that big of a deal. My favorite servo is the Futaba 9154 heli servo. it's lightning fast, centers great, and wears well. if you're running a JR, that new super fast servo is about the same.

Don't use metal gears if you can avoid it, they wear out too fast.

-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Would you say a Good Heli Tail Rotor Servo is in order for the elevator? I never would have guessed that on my own.

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Yes, but only a certain couple of them, the one I listed is the best I have found yet. I am sure the JR equivalent is fine as well.

Otherwise a Futaba 9151 or JR 9411sa works fine too. Just be sure it's digital and premium.

The new futaba coreless 451 looks good too, but it's not as fast, and it's a little more heavy.

-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

I was running the 9254 heli servo for my elevator previously and really liked the setup. Make sure it is the 9254. Mike got the numbers mixed up. The 9154 is an aileron servo. I got the idea originally from CPLR and tried it a couple of years ago and I'm hooked. I'm the one that got Mike started on that... i changed to the new brushless BLS-451 and really liked it. Not quite as fast, but I honestly couldnt tell a difference, I think because the response time is faster with the BLS-451, so even though it might physically move a little slower, it starts moving faster and stops moving faster. That is what is in my number 1 and will be what is in my number 2 come spring.

Arch

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

WHOOPS....yes, 9254....I've got too many servos here LOL

-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

You're going to have some more in about 10 days.....the ones for number 2 will be there..

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

I think I'm going with JR servos on my VF-3's. The 9411Sa looks great for ailerons, 8411Sa for rudder and 8417 with nylon replacement gears for the elevator (as recommended by Dave L.). Unless someone can convince me otherwise...

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Mike,

You mentioned videos on your website covering specific building techniques. That would be GREAT. There isnt one part in particular that I am thinking of as being more helpful than another. Sounds like the finishing would be valuable to see. Really, though, anything would be very helpful. I am sure I dont speak just for myself.


Chris

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

I intend to try it out. My video editing abilities leave a lot to be desired, but I will try. Don't expect a lot too soon though, my time is very limited until after the first of the year.

But then if people like it, and I can handle the bandwidth, I'll go forward with a lot of stuff like that.

I'll be completely redoing my web site between now and the end of the year as well. And videos are one thing I really want to incorporate.

-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Mike,
You might like to use some of the videos that I made when my girlfriend was experimenting with Pete's fuselage jig (that thing is STURDY!). LOL Oops, I forgot this was a family show. Maybe we'll put that in the "Team" section. VBG

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

I am sure she appreciated the "right thrust"

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

And there were some people who said it didn't need to be as sturdy as I make them.......

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Oh yes it did Pete! LOL

OK, my VF-3's are moving right along. I'm sheeting cores now. I think building 2 side by side is actually the best way to do it. Set up for an operation then repeat. When you're done, clean up the mess and move on. You won't have to do it again. It's more efficient that way. Of course if you make a mistake you screw up both airplanes at the same time but that's easy: just don't make any mistakes! LOL

I'm going to frame up the fuselages on my new magnetic surface workbench. I'll post some pic's. I still have Pete's jig but like I said my girlfriend has taken a liking to it and I want to try something new - uh, with the airplanes that is... :)

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

It's a sad world when anyone make me look normal.

Can you post a few pictures of the magnetic building board?

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Hey Mike, Can you see if Melissa will bring her video camera to the Tangerine Pattern Contest? I would really like to see what I mess up on the Advanced schedule. and also some of our foamie wars.

Who else from the Black Magic group is coming to the Tangerine Contest. should be an awesome one. Alot of big names/

Chris Odom
Team Black Magic
Team Dragon Fire

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

"big names"...LOL yer funny Chris :) But yes some pretty heavy hitters are supposed to be coming down. FAI is going to be one heck of a show if even a couple of them make it.

No problem we'll bring the camera. Hopefully I'll have my new one by then, so we'll film all of your screw ups and go over it like football...."game films"?

Just teasing dude. This medicine has me loopy right now. Go forth and burneth thy fuel!

-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Wow...you guys are going to have so much fun. I cant tell you how much I would LOVE to be there..especially since my plane is a LOT closer than i could be.....

I promise I'll make a D3 contest next year Chris...and I WILL be at the NATS..

Arch

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Pete,
"Normal" is just like "reality". A noble concept that doesn't really survive in the real world. At least I didn't paint my airplane using a fishnet stocking mask! Where do you think he got the idea for that??? LOL

NONE of us are normal. If we were we wouldn't stay up all night playing with our, uh toy airplanes... (oops almost messed up there).

I'm putting together the fixtures for my magnetic table now. The table part was easy: 14 ga steel on top of my bench. I've been trying to find some good magnets that you can pick up at the local hardware store. So far I haven't found anything I'm really happy with. I MAY have to order them online. We'll see. The nice part about the magnetic bench is that I can use a lot of my machinist setup tools on it (magnetic indicator bases stick to it). If I can get a fuse fixture set up I'll send you guys some pic's.

I really like this method of putting the trailing edge on the core before sheeting. Nice. I guess it wouldn't work too well with a really thin T.E. but for the VF-3 it works great!

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

If "normal" is what I've seen from "normal" people, I'll pass. BORING!!!!

You'll be missed Arch, but hopefully we'll see more of you next season. Practice practice, the 2009 Nats are closer than you think!

Great news (to me anyway). I have a new camera on the way finally. I'll post up some new pics and some tips and tricks I have learned over the last year or so. Good stuff, I think.

Remember guys, the Concourse for 2009 will be bigger and better than ever. I intend to have a horse in this race myself. (For the best of show, not crafstman's award). I'm serving fair warning now, between what Dean and myself are cooking up, there are going to be some unbelievable planes on the ground next summer. No I'm not doing up a new design just yet, this one is working great. But what I want to do (finally) is see just how far I can take finishing and details. I really like the plane I'm flying now, but it's a warhorse....I can't type it's real nickname because the filter will probably censor it...but there's nothing like a new plane, and the last one I had was almost 3 years ago. It's time.

Post up some pics boys, and make some dust!
-Mike

RE: Black Magic VF3 Build Thread
 

Mikey....

shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.........

:)