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frsky !

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

Hey guys,
this may help ypou to get out flying again.
As you know, all of my crashes not related to doing something i shouldn't have like 2 foot acro which i like to do. Wa caused by spektrum receivers...not spektrum radios. Spektrum receivers have a design flaw and they are not disclosing it because they would be held responsible for all our losses including aircraft and everything in them that flys....there is no limitations when it comes to fraud...especially mail fraud. Their advertisements do not disclose any problems or special requirements to keep from crashing...management has known this for many years.

Install a jr or orange receiver then prove it to yourself...we all got suckered in by some fancy marketing that did not tell the entire truth. Lack of disclosure is the same as lying by law. Prove it on the ground...do not crash your plane...even if your spektrum works on the ground, remember that is under no load...in the air they are under heavy load when deflected. Mine all failed on the ground...first video i took.

I would love to have a new dx-18 for my medium size planes and smaller stuff.

I put a ar-8000 in a plane with a dle-20 (small 67" span. I installed spektrum digital servos. Two nicd batteries.( 90% of the pilots still fly nicd) i also have life for larger aircraft up to 155 in span.

The spektrum ar-7000 & ar-8000 would not handle the voltage drop created by their digital servos...$140 for a receiver and foolish me, i thought it would work.

Ithey would brown out every time i did a snap roll (on the ground with absolutely no load...imagine how bad that would be flying under load.

Then it dawned on me...i never crashed a plane with the hobby king orange receiver.

I left everything as it was and installed a seven channel with s-bus and fail safe. Great receiver for only $17.00 ( i can purchase 8 of them for the price of an ar-8000)
i also never fly without the satelite antenna so i put in one of those for $13.00.

Holly cow !!!! It works perfect ! Try as i may i can not get it to brown out...i am thinking about flying it this afternoon. If it survives, i will install a life a123 battery and run it through the orange receiver.

I will also video the test before i fly and photo the flight itself.

I think that this prooves that spektrum receivers have a design flaw and are responsible for thousands of crashes. They know this already and their employees all have work around with different receivers , custom power sources, and separate power busses for their servos

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO BUY A RECEIVER THAT DOES NOT WORK?

THE BEST ONES THAT WORK WITH SPEKTRUM Tx ARE THE JR'S AND ORANGE.SAVE YOUR AR-8000 FOR SMALL AIRPLANES AND PARK FLYERS...THE 1700 FMS FOAMIES HAVE LOST CONTROL AND CRASHED. MAYBE IF WE CAN CONTACT THE PILOTS WE WILL FIND OUT MORE. ALL CRASHES WE KNOW ABOUT THAT INVOLVED SPEKTRUM Tx ALSO INVOLVED SPEKTRUM Rx AR-7000 & AR8000 ON THE WAR BIRDS BECAUSE OF THE FLAPS AND EXTRA "STUFF"..

WE TESTED THE ORANGE 7 CHANNEL RECEIVER AGAINST THE SPECTRUM AR-7000 & AR-80000 NEW RIGHT OUT OF THE BOX, WE USED NICD 5 CELL 6V WITH 99% CHARGE..BECAUSE 90% OF THE PILOTS OUT THERE STILL FLY NICD...WE USE LIFE ON OUR 70" AND UP AIRCRAFT.
MIGHT AS WELL USE LIFE ON EVERYTHING: ABOUT THE SAME PRICE, HOLDS A CHARGE LONGER, CONSTANT VOLTAGE AND A HIGH DISCHARGE RATE FOR LARGER SERVOS. EASY TO SET UP MULTIPLE BATTERIES. A MUST ON BIG MODELS THAT COST UP TO $11,000 FOR STANDARD AND UP TO $65,000 LIKE GIANT SCALE WAR BIRDS....YOU CAN NOT BY ANYTHING BUT THE BEST...MOST PILOTS OF THAT TYPE FLY FUTABA AND JR....BOTH EXCELLENT RADIO SYSTEMS. THAT I CAN NOT AFFORD. GOT TO MAKE SPEKTRUM WORK FOR THE GENERAL PUBLIC...

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

ANY ONE FLYING SPEKTRUM AT TOP GUN HAD A SEPARATE POWER BUS FOR SERVOS...AND A SEPARATE POWER SOURCE FOR THE RECEIVER....

I DON'T KNOW ANYONE THAT WOULD RUN POWER FOR THE SERVOS DIRECTLY THROUGH THE SPEKTRUM RECEIVER...GOOD LUCK lol

P.S. WHAT RACES? ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT "SPEED WEEK" THE WORLDS RECORD LAST YEAR FOR A JET WAS 447 MPH. SEND MY YOUR E-MAIL AND I WILL SEND YOU SOME PHOTOS.

A FRIEND OF MINE HAS THE RECORD FOR THE SMALL PROP CLASS OF 276 MPH...I SET THE WORLD RECORD ONCE FOR A WHOLE HOUR IT DID NOT HOLD UP ON MY SECOND RUN...OH WELL, IT WAS FUN. THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT...HAVING FUN. LIFE IS SHORT.

MY PARTNY IN LIFE SUPPORTS ME ALSO...A GOOD WOMAN CAN MAKE YOU OR BREAK YOU...TREAT THEM WITH RESPECT.

jmiles1941

I am going to put my 2 cents worth in I have been flying Futaba since 1990 , I purchased a Spektrum in 2013 had it for 2 weeks almost lost my 30% extra 300 finally got it on the ground and the satellite wire the gray one had came loose inside the satellite , this was enough for me went back to my Futaba 9 cap in dec 2014 I purchased a Futaba 14 SG love this transmitter great feel and I fly IMAC my set up is with a smart fly with a futaba 14 channel rx 6014 I use dual ED A123 2600 mah 6.6 v batteries on my rx, my smart fly eq10 prevents any servo problems , and battery problems as it is always drawing equally from each battery and if a problem occurs the smart fly shuts down that servo or battery to prevent failure my planes are all over $6000 and I would never consider of putting anything in my plane but a Futaba , never ever had any problems with any of my Futaba equipment enough said , I have seen way too many crashes at the fields with no radio control no one had a clue and they were all spectrum equipment all of you who have not had a problem consider your self lucky but I will never again fly a spectrum
I watched my friend crash his imac plane on spectrum radio dx18 he sent it back no problem , he ordered an new Futaba 14SG yesterday smart decision !!!

lawrence b

Hey Topgun Winner,
You might want to get your facts straight before you make a post. I flew at Top Gun this year placing 4th in Masters class using my Spektrum system and I do not use a separate power system for the servos or receiver. I have been flying my models with only a single RX pack of 4.8 volt NiCads and have had no issues.

Now you know of someone who runs power through the RX to drive the servos and has been for the past 6 years.

Do a little more research next time instead of making up facts as you go along!

Larry B

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

LAWRENCE B.

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION...I DID NOT SEE WHICH RECEIVER YOU USED...EXACTLY WHAT WAS IT? FLYING ANYTHING WITH A 4CELL IS NOT VERY SMART. IF ONE OF THOSE CELLS DECIDES TO GO REVERSE POLARITY YOU ARE LEFT WITH 2.7V AND THAT WILL NOT CUT IT.THAT IS WHY WE USE 5CELL AND CAN STILL FLY LARGE IMAC TYPE AIRCRAFT. WE JUST CAN NOT DO IT WITH A SPEKTRUM RECEIVER.

I NEVER LOST IN USAF COMPETITION...MY INSTRUCTOR WAS AN ACE WITH 16 KILLS IN THUNDERBOLTS. HE TOLD ME NOBODY KNOWS IF YOU FINISH SECOND IN COMBAT...HE WAS VERY GOOD AND I GAVE HIM 100% OF THE CREDIT FOR MY WINS. YOU WERE TOY TOP GUN I WAS REAL TOP GUN...I AM A MASTER BUILDER...GOT $1.7 MILLION FOR ONE FULL SIZE MODEL.
SEND ME YOUR EMAIL AND I WILL SEND YOU PHOTOS OF SEVERAL MORE. COVER OF AVIATION WEEK. BEEN FLYING MODELS FOR 75 YEARS AND STILL FLY BETTER THAN MOST.

I NORMALLY DON'T SAY ANYTHING BUT YOU ARE IN A POSITION TO SET AN EXAMPLE TO OTHERS. BEING RUDE TO AN 80 YEAR OLD MAN WITH CANCER THAT IS TRYING TO FIX A WRONG OS NOT VERY CHRISTIAN EITHER.

DON'T THINK YOU ARE SUCH A HOT SHOT FOR FINISHING FOURTH...I LOST 1.2 BILLION DOLLARS IN 2000 BECAUSE I STOOD UP TO SOME CROOKED POLITICIANS... DID YOU EVER HAVE A BILLION TO LOOSE. .I HAVE DONE MORE FOR AVIATION THAN ANYONE YOU NEVER MET. HAVE A GOOD DAY.

I WILL HAVE A TESTING LAB VERIFY WHAT YOU SAID. TELL EVERYONE WHAT YOU USED IN THE WAY OF RADIO Tx & Rx, SERVOS, NUMBER , ETC YOU KNOW, YOU ARE A SMART GUY.

ARE YOU SPONSORED BY SPEKTRUM OR HORIZON HOBBIES? IT REALLY SOUNDS LIKE IT. IF YOU TOLD ME YOU USED JR OR FUTABA I WOULD SAY "GREAT JOB, CONGRATULATIONS"

A SPEKTRUM RECEIVER AND 4.8 NICD...I WANT TO SEE IT...IT IS A MIRACLE...I OWNED A DOD TESTING LAB FOR 30 YEARS, TESTED A LOT OF HIGH TECH STUFF BUT NEVER SAW A MIRACLE

GOD BLESS AND GOOD LUCK NEXT YEAR.

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

JMILES 1941...congratulations...SMART FLY IS IN ALMOST EVERY PLANE WE FLY. ALL MY FRIENDS ARE IN IMAC COMPETITION. YOUR SET UP IS TYPICAL...WE HAVE LOST 3 AIRPLANES LOCAL COMPETITION AND ALL WERE SPEKTRUM TRANSMITTERS AND RECEIVERS. THEY SWITCHED FROM FUTABA AND IMMEDIATELY BOUGHT A NEW FUTABA AND GAVE AWAY THEIR SPEKTRUMS WITH A WARNING THAT IT WAS FOR PARK FLYERS.

PLANE JIM

My Feedback: (109)

Topgun Winner-please do not use your medical condition or your age as a excuse for your unbelievable experiences you post on this forum=because it did not prevent nor cause you to post replies with the unbelievable content-thanks

John_M_

TG / W, if anyone flies a $10k - $65k aircraft and are not running a smartfly or equivalent with a servo power buss, along with full multiple battery pack redundancy. i.e, bad pack isolation, load balancing, etc, should rethink what they have invested in their aircraft... it is inevitable that these aircraft will meet their demise one day, it comes with the hobby, but like anything mankind builds, there are ways to extend that inevitability through proper failsafe setup, using high quality components, good installation layout practices, proper per-flight and post flight inspections.

I couldn't afford to play with those expensive jets, but if I could, I can guarantee you I would not fly with a marginal setup... I fly mostly sport giant scale, and would not fly without a separate receiver and servo power buss... knowing what I have learned over the years, even if I went back to 40-60 sized aircraft, I would still set them up with a separate receiver / servo power buss... the receiver is the heart beat of the system, cleanly powered on its own, without drawing off a common power source, to me is the only way to go.... the receiver will draw a steady 60-70 mili-amps off its own power source... there is no voltage fluctuations as you might get off a common shared power source with the rest of the radio system... even if the receiver had a high current buss that the mfg claimed could handle all the servos connected directly to the receiver, I'd still separate the receiver and servo power supplies, the added weight would be marginal.



John M,

lawrence b

Did I ever say that I was a hot shot? I only pointed out that you are dead wrong about what was being flown at Lakeland this year. I am not sponsored by anyone but myself, I do not have hundreds of models or millions of dollars. I use a Spektrum DX8, 3000ma NiCad pack of 4.8 volts & a spectrum RX running 5 JR servos (2 on a Y harness), I have never had a glitch since getting back into R/C scale in late 2009.
I would be willing to bet that I am flying one of the lowest dollar models at Top Gun, scratch building my own designs saves some money but I just enjoy designing and building my own stuff.

Also, I really doubt that I will ever have a billion dollars to loose, congratulations on that one!

Have a nice day!

P.S. Where would you like to meet for your lab testing?

Turner2

Good luck with your lawsuit. You say that Spektrum has lied and misinformed about this little known problem. That's a joke. Many of these losses are the result of inadequate power supplied to the Rx. If you would just read the literature that comes with your Spektrum Rx you would see they have informed people of the need for adequate power to the Rx for quite a while.

I have to laugh when you that have left Spektrum describe your new Futaba installation with dual batteries, etc., etc., when if you provided this to your spektrum Rx you would most likely not have had problems.

This from an AR7000 users manual from 08:

Receiver Power System Requirements
Inadequate power systems that are unable to provide the necessary minimum voltage to thereceiver during flight have become the number one cause of in-flight failures. Some of thepower system components that affect the ability to properly deliver adequate power include
• Receiver battery pack (number of cells, capacity, cell type, state of charge)• The ESC’s capability to deliver current to the receiver in electric aircraft
• The switch harness, battery leads, servo leads, regulators etc.
The AR7000 has a minimum operational voltage of 3.5 volts; it is highly recommended thepower system be tested per the guidelines below.
Recommended Power System Test Guidelines
If a questionable power system is being used (e.g. small or old battery, ESC that may not havea BEC that will support high current draw, etc.), it is recommended that a voltmeter be used toperform the following test.
Note: The Hangar 9 Digital Servo & Rx Current Meter (HAN172) or the Spektrum Flight Log(SPM9540) are the perfect tools to perform the test below.
Plug the voltmeter into an open channel port in the receiver and with the system on, load thecontrol surfaces (apply pressure with your hand) while monitoring the voltage at the receiver.The voltage should remain above 4.8 volts even when all servos are heavily loaded.

mikes68charger

My Feedback: (34)

Ok well maybe that is why Spectrum has Power Safe Reciver for planes with larger loads.

I have been useing AR9020 as a 10 channel and with X Pluse added to it with 15 out of the 18 channels in my jets for 3 years with no issues.

Yes I use 2 swiches (unless I use my Bumba RC 2 in 1 switch) with 2 (2200 2s 6.6 life Hobbyking)

In 3 years I have only had 2 Hobbyking life go bad and they both still worked just puffed a little.

I always plug one of the life batterys to each bus on the reciver or if useing X Pluse I plug one in the XPLUS module.

I have one 12 channel Powe safe spectrum Reciver in My Velox XL with a 45 pound turbine, because it's so larger some of the servo leads to the elevator and rudders are at least 4 feet long so as I'm useing JR811 all over this jet with 2 on the elevators it made sense.

I think this is were some common sense comes in, my feel the AR7000-AR8000 are for small to park flyers, if your flying bigger you should step up to bigger reciver or use a power expander.

Heck I know I guy flying a 110cc 3d bird hard with a old AR7000 DM2 with a Smart Fly exspanion 2 HK life packs for 7years with no issues.

Come on People,

Aerocal

I was really hoping for the magical video proof in Technicolor. Oh well.

Sad part of it all.I went through this same dialog with the local AMA club president and a few other "respected experts" who have been modeling far longer then my 15 years or so now. They still dont quite grasp the difference between a signal issue and a power related issue. Of all the issues 99+%
IMO are power related. There is no simple grasp of the difference between voltage and current(amperage). The term Resistance(ohms) might as well be greek.
The information is out there.I find many young ones that havent been in the hobby more than a few years grasp all of this much better than some who claim to be old enough tohave built their own radios back in the day. They are curious and they have the net. 30 mins if they are focused they can learn what took us years. They see this nonsense too. It turns them away from old clubs.
Then the same guys say on one hand say they want new blood in the club but on the other hand spew a load of nonsense. It turns ppl off. It does me. Pretty sad.

Im getting older but I will never stop learning.I try to look at things from all angles. It leads to overthinking alot of the time but it reminds me that I will never know it all. Sometimes I have to stop and listen. Ive been humbled more than once and probably not the last.

So...this old quote comes to mind again. I could exchange Aviation for Spektrum and mod it a hair and it would be good here.

Spektrum in itself is not inherently dangerous(flawed). Not unlike other (insert brands here) brands but possibly slightly more they are all terribly unforgiving of any Carelessnes,Incapacity or Neglect.<insert picture of airplane in a tree>.

I learned early on with DX7(original) when DSM2 was released and I switched from another brand on 72mhz that this wasnt your father,grandfathers system. Power requirements were alot different.Plug and Pray doesnt get it anymore. Servos started taking giant leaps forward about the same time.
Eagletree logger and the little plug in Data reader that came later told me alot of things I didnt want to know. It did show me when I got to where I needed to be without alot of guessing.

Knock on wood I havent had any failures of radio equip inflight. I kind of attribute success to more than pure dumb luck.

TOPGUN
Please dont shout so much.It hurts our eyes. Since your obviously not grasping some basic concepts your more than welcome to ask questions about anything that has been said.Just please dont shout.It is kind of annoying.

lawrence b

AeroCal,
You hit the nail on the head! No one will ever know it all and we will never stop learning. I am considering changing over to the Futaba Fasstest system because of what I have learned about how the signal is actually transmitted from the Tx to the Rx. I have some incredibly smart engineering types as friends out in Albuquerque NM who explained to me the difference between the "smart" frequency hopping system that Futaba uses and the "dumb" frequency system that Spektrum uses.
After learning the details about the difference between the two I may change to Futaba which I used to fly way back in the late 70's.
Either way I have had fantastic results with my Spektrum DX8,
Reguards,
Larry B

jmiles1941

for your information my spectrum had dual batteries and a smart fly sport if you loose the signal from the receiver nothing works , the dx8 almost cost me a airplane , my buddies dx18 locked out went full throttle and tore up his imac plane 4000 he had no control plane was flying straight and level he did his roll and the plane nosed up he pulled the throttle back but the plane went full throttle and barrel rolled into the ground , we put the radio equipment and servos back together , turned it on and it would not bind , he tried again would not bind , finally got it to bind we put a amp meter across each servo checking for too much current draw all was normal .05 ma then all of a sudden receiver went dead could not bind again after several attempts it bound we sent all equipment to Horizon Hobby they said they checked everything 6 times and could find nothing wrong , bottom line he ordered a new Futaba 14 SG don't tell me spectrum doesn't have problems , it is too obvious , way too many planes crashing on spectrum end of story !!!

raptureboy

Anybody bring the popcorn? Wait just a minute while I go to the bathroom. Oh, I forgot this is not a movie I can stop reading at any time. So how about those Patriots

[email protected]

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get rid of the radios get a futaba

dirtybird

My Feedback: (5)

.Top Gun I just have to top your story.
I am 88. I have had a triple bypass ,two strokes, valley fever,colon cancer, and have been hospitalized for anemia twice.
I am also blind in one eye due to botched cataract surgery.
Just recently I had to have my pacemaker replaced as the first one nearly popped out.
They said the first one overloaded due to excessive masturbation.

But I never had a battery reverse polarity on me or I have never lost a billion dollars.
But I have been flying RC since 1950

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

lawrence b:

Congratulations on that fourth place in Masters at TOP GUN. no need to test...you used 5 JR servos that works perfect with any Spektrum receiver. I still suggest 6.0v 5 cell nimh in place of the 4 cell.

We just flew a 30% IMAC airplane with two 6V NIMH packs going through a Futaba receiver and driving some mega servos...a nice 120 twin cyl engine. NO SMARTFLY AND NO POWER BUS FOR THE SERVOS. WE DID FLY PATTERN AND IMAC TYPES 20 YEARS AGO WITH REALLY OLD EQUIPMENT. NO FAILURES ...I HAVE A GREAT SUPER 8 FILM OF FPV FLYING ABOVE THE CLOUDS IN CALIFORNIA IN 1986 FULL TELEMETRY INSTALLED IN A HIPPI-VAN WEEDWACKER TYPE CONVERSION FOR A MOTOR...LOOKED LIKE A GIANT TELEMASTER...COULD DO INSTRUMENT APPROACHES. SO WHAT'S THE BIG DEAL TODAY?

HAVE A GOOD ONE

I would never fly my Patty Wagstaff Extra 260 without a separate power bus for the servos and a separate battery for whatever the receiver is. I designed and built all of my aircraft from 1941 to 1986 when i purchased my first ARF TRAINER to teach one of my kids to fly. I used to turn the other cheek but since 2000 I don't let anything slide. read what you wrote and how you said it...

lenape68

My Feedback: (1)

I have lost a 50cc extra 330 (aprox $2,000) and a Edge 540 50cc (aprox $2,200) in the last few months. Both times flying for about six minutes and then nothing, no control what so ever. DX18QQ has been back for service twice. First problem throttle trim switch stopped working, got the radio back and less than a week later had to send it back again because screen would not initialize. They did the repairs at no charge but I had to pay once for return shipping. This was not a cheap radio and I am having second thoughts about using it.

Aerocal

While the potential limitations of the DSM2 protocol at large events is well documented the DSMX (hopping) protocol is every bit as good as any other.
Could you explain exactly what part of the protocol is "dumb" as it was explained by experts?
If there was an inherent flaw it seems to me that failures would be spread across the board at a somewhat even rate. As it stands some have nothing but problems and many have none whatsoever. This tends to lead me to think that the individual is more of a factor than the equip itself.
As the 2.4 revolution has engulfed the hobby Ive seen more than 1 or 2 individuals who have been through pretty much every major brand and experienced the same problems with all of them. While they no longer use Spektrum because they were told by numerous others that the system was flawed they are still in denial that any of the problems they have may somehow be related to their implementation of various components.
If it makes you feel better or more comfortable to use something else by all means have at it.
My experience has been the opposite. I flew with Futaba before I switched to 2.4. I had more trouble with my 7C and 9C in the handful of years I used them than Ive had with all my Spektrum systems combined. I did have a couple actual Rx problems and my DX8 that I got when it was released finally went in for gimbal repair after 3 years of hard use. They were back to me in less than a week from when I sent them in. And all at no cost.
I wont say how long it took or how much it cost me to send my others in have them fixed and shipped back. Ill just say it was alot more than the cost of one way shipping.

Aerocal

Are you taking advantage of the ability to Monitor basic parameters(voltage and FL data) in real time via telemetry?
Were your problems power or signal related?
Or when there is a problem are you like many others that just stand there scratching their heads with no information other than a big guess as to what went wrong?
When in doubt blame the one thing you have no control over.

Slapnuts

Spektrum=Krap!!!! Bottom Line!! All you cheapskates will pay in the long run, it's just a matter of time. How many planes do you have to see or hear about crashing because of that Krap!!! Yes!! KRAP!!! Spektrum stuff is Cheap for a reason, it's KRAP!!!!!!!!!! KRAP!!!!!! KRAP!!!!!!

Pay now or pay more later and get a sore back from picking up the pieces of your smashed airplane due to your cheap Spektrum KRAP!!!!

TOPGUN WINNER

My Feedback: (27)

hey mike thanks, you made my point THE BASIC RECEIVER SOLD BY SPEKTRUM CAN NOT DO WHAT YOU ARE DOING WITHOUT A LOT OF EXTRAS THAT COST A LOT OF MONEY.

FUTABA AND JR CAN SUPPORT THE AVERAGE PILOTS REQUIREMENTS...I SAY" SPEKTRUM RECEIVERS ARE FINE WITH 5 STANDARD SIZE SERVOS...THEN SOME GENIUS POSTS THAT" YOU ARE STUPID, I FLY A BIG PLANE WITH FIVE SERVOS AND DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM YOU HAVE A POWER PROBLEM....DAHHHH....