BobH

My Feedback: (2)

Yeah it means you dont hafta shoot yourself just because you own some Futaba 2.4 ghz equipment lol.

OnTheEdge

If you can't find yours, I got one I can sell you!

ME109

question to the guy that was able to replicate the switch issue, is it possible that the radio lost its link to the receivers from cycling the power switch but not zero his GUID, If he checked his radio on a "test" RX that would answer alot of questions

Julez

As long as no TX, which changed its GUID, has been proven to have changed it to a different value than "0...0", it is, in my opinion, safe to assume, that any GUID change results in a ZGUID.

RyanPSU21

I'm going this morning to a hobbystore that's on the list for having a checker. Assuming they have it already it will get checked. If not everyone who wants to know that answer is out of luck as it's going to UPS after that to get returned to Tower.

I suppose it could have become something other then it's original value but not zero. From the descriptions I've read about how flash memory works it's a wipe and then replace so if replace fails you get the default wiped value. aka zero.

RyanPSU21

I went to the hobbystore this morning that had a FASST Tester. Here is my impressions from that. 1. My transmitter operated the test RX so it has a zero code. Yes, it did turn from normal to a zero code from cycling the on-off switch. Second, this hobbystore is pretty knowledgable usually and had no real understanding of what the tester was for when I got there and hadn't even taken it out of the box yet or read the instructions. I wouldn't depend on even the hobbystores on the list as having testers to really understand or know much about the issue at all. In the US there is no label or sticker being given if you pass test test and don't have a ZGUID. Third, the hobbystore owner pulled out another 7C while I was there after testing to see what would happen with a normal transimtter. The battery was dead on that TX because it had apparently been turned on and put away but the store owner proceded to fast cycle the on-off switch atleast 2 times to check to see if it would turn on so he was totally unaware that, that was how the problem could be created in the first place. I don't have much confidence in this checking program at being able to really provide much resolution to this. The LHS owners aren't checking the stock they have on hand and atleast from this observation are fast cycling the on-off switches themselves not knowing they could potentially be causing a problem with their stock on hand. Unlike Europe where they are getting a label after the TX is checked we are not here.

ME109

Thank you for doing that. I hope this gets resolved the right way and not the quick way.

fizzwater2

My Feedback: (61)

what good does the label do if the transmitter is subject to change with cycling of the power switch?

GrayUK

RyanPSU21


How do you know that it went to 0000000 due to the on off switch?

It may have been like that from the factory.
Have you had to re-link since you got it new?

Paul

Zombie

No good - as your TX may go to ZGUID anytime after you put the sticker on it. And that's what so much of the flap is all about. Futaba has yet to admit that the TXs can change to ZGUID in the field - attempting to maintain the myth that the problem is merely a "few" ZGUID TXs that were shipped that way from manufacturing, nothing more.

RyanPSU21

Yes, it was normal from the factory. I had to rebind all 3 RX's I have 4 or 5 days ago now after cycling the power switch several times.

GrayUK

OK, well we have the proof.

For the moment, lets just make sure we don’t break the 5 second rule!

My set has been perfect from new and when we had the 3 faulty tx's at my field at the beginning of this problem (remember my original post on the subject) mine passed against them 100%.
So I know mine is fine and provided I do not have to re-link, it will stay that way till Futaba sort this out.

I shall be flying tomorrow with the same gear, confident in its use.

Keep calm folks, it will be sorted, just be extra careful for a while longer.

All you 12 FG and 14mz guys are in the clear anyway (wish I had one!).

It would be interesting to know just how many sets actually turn out to have the problem (doubt if we will though!)

Paul

OhD

How do we know that for sure? I'm planning on buying a set.

Jim O

GrayUK

Futaba have stated so, plus i have it on very good authority.

Paul

AIRPLANENUTS

My Feedback: (2)

I have returned all of my 607fs receivers and cancelled the backorder on the TM-8 module, because if I were to use the FASST system, the only way I would trust it now is if I owned one of the receivers Futaba is sending to the hobby shops and could test my transmitter each and every time I turned it on at the field. This issue is far too serious because of the inherent safety hazard of a ZGUID tx condition when in the presence of another tx with the same condition, and I do not want to be the guy who finds out the TM-8 has problems, as well.

By the wording on Futaba's website, they want to downplay this issue, but I believe we have only seen the tip of the iceberg. What other problems are lurking in the FASST system? Obviously, it has not been tested sufficiently by Futaba.

Are we the beta testers? Why, yes, we are! Are the potential lost sales due to delaying a product's shipment so that it may be exhaustively tested more important than the lost confidence of some LONGTIME Futaba users with (the good Lord willing) many years ahead to purchase radio equipment? Why, yes, it is!

Witness the 6XA. Very shortly after I make the investment in this tx, Futaba comes out with the 6XAS. Witness the venerable 9C. Very shortly after I make the investment in this tx, Futaba comes out with the 9C Super. Witness the 607FS receivers. Very shortly after I make the investment in six of these rx's, Futaba comes out with the 617FS. But Futaba gets it right the first time! http://2.4gigahertz.com/ You may say, "Well, Futaba just improved their product with newer models, more features, etc." Well, my point is, we are beta testing these products so that Futaba doesn't have to do the research necessary to make a product with features we like, they just send it to market and get their market research from us free of charge by looking at the forums to find out what we like after we spend our hard earned money. Easy, and cheap! Witness Androgeny's angst over not being able to use FUTABA RECEIVERS WITH OTHER FUTABA TRANSMITTERS! http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_68...22/key_/tm.htm

If you , want to buy Futaba, wait and see what the improved product will be, after the beta testers finish doing Futaba's research. You'll be glad you did, because I believe Futaba will get it right, but not the first time.

pilotpete2

And the current version of the Sony Hi-def Tv we own will blow ours away and costs 500 bucks less than I paid two years ago, what's your point
Oh, and lets not get into discussing computer technology
This is the world we live in and if you are an early adopter, sometimes you pays the price.
With all the details we know about this temporary problem, I cannot for a moment understand your logic.
It took a year for this problem to emerge, with the loss of one high value airframe (replaced by futaba), this in contrast to the numbers of models lost to the teething problems that Spektrum users have encountered.
As to your impatience with the release of the TM-8, why do you think it's being delayed, to make sure they get it right, the first time. Don't be so FASST to jump ship, the Futabic didn't hit an iceberg, just a speed bump
Pete

OhD

Did your good authority (or Futaba) say they mechanized it in a different way and describe the difference?

Jim

Hirobofly

This thread has gone pretty much off topic.... people write complaints about that they don't like it when Futaba releases a new version of a product and they have just bought the previous version, they feel they could have got a Spektrum or other radio a year ago instead of waiting for Futaba to release the wanted product, some complaint that they think the Futaba products have not been tested good enough and then should have been delayed to marked-then others again complain about that Futaba does not release products fast enough.....
In addition, several threads are initiated covering the same topic, but with a different subject-descriptions and people (often the same individuals) then cross-reference these threads back and forth as "facts" or support for their statements.
None of this is related to initial problems some have had with some FASST-system.
At the way this thread is developing now, it can be renamed to "Why I hate Futaba" or similar.......

//RJ

RyanPSU21

To be fair. Futaba has done this for a long time now. This has dated back to the 7uaf atleast. They release the first version. 7uarf. Then half a year to a year later release the "super" version. 7uafs. This has occurred for 7uaf, 8uaf and 9c and 6ex. They've released radios this way for well over 15 years now. This isn't really a fault for them. They always release a radio, get customer feedback on it and then release an improved version. The "super" version. Then it doesn't change again until the totally new radio gets released a few years later.

LSF2298

My Feedback: (4)

It's the Microsoft Business Model. Release a beta product and let the early buyers do the testing. Then charge them for the new improved version 2. Sure has worked for them.

tkilwein

Technology changes at such a fast pace in the electronic field, so having a newer version every so many months is not uncommon.
I am a RF-Digital HW eng and you pick a part out today that is just being proto sampled and in less than 3 to 6 months it has a new rev of silicon or is better-faster than the one you designed into the PCB card.
End of life parts, cost factors or product improvements are another reason to change designs after you introduce them. Company A buys out company B and now company "A" decides on old companies B parts and does a EOL notice that company B never intended to EOL. So now you have to redesign. I have been here a few times.

I have the 14MZ fasst system and it has been good for me.
When I bought the 14MZ it came with a 5014 RX now they have a 5114, new and improved.
My 9ZHPS I bought new in 94 and it evolved to a 9WC, 9WC2 over it's life.
I think this is nice as it shows there is contining products and not a stagnat company.

Product evolution is a good thing IMO.
I know it sucks when you buy on the tail end and they introduce the next generation of products just after you buy. Been there also.

nxtdoor

My Feedback: (10)

All the people that are complaining about todays radios don't have a clue what it was like in the 60's and 70's. The equipment today is bullet proof compared to then even with this type of issue.

If you are an early adopter of any technology you run the risk of being left behind with version improvements. I recently bought an Iphone with the knowledge that a version two will be out by the end of the year. Will I cry and blame the manufacturer for making it better than the one I bought; no.

BTW, love my new 12FG FM set. I knew better than to be an early adopter of the 2.4 technology. Been there, done that.

Thanks to all those that are busting trail on 2.4 though.

Jeff

P-51B

My Feedback: (5)

Yeah, I used to walk to school in the snow...uphill in both directions. Before there were cars, there were horses that worked just fine.


I find it interesting that the futaba system was supposed to have been in use for many years in another application...but on RC systems a problem like this shows up all of a sudden out of the blue.

tkilwein

NXTDOOR,

Remember the Heathkit RC setup? 4 channels if I remember right.

For those that don't.

1: you build it, TX, RX and even the servos. I mean down to the components.
2: you test and repair it.

Now those are the day's!

d_wheel

Only a quick cycle of the switch will cause the problem. Something that people usually do not do. Yes, this is a problem that Futaba MUST resolve with a hardware or software change, but it is not the end of the world.

The test and sticker are very important. Until now one of the most fearful parts of this ordeal has been that no one knew for sure if their transmitter was defective. Without careful testing, 2 defective transmitters might be turned on at the same time causing a crash. With this test, we now know if our transmitter is defective or not. And, once tested and found to be working properly, we now have a way to be sure that our transmitter is working properly in the future. If you turn your transmitter and receiver on and they link up, your transmitter is still working normally. Simple as that.

No, not a final fix, but a way to help keep things safe until one is found. Once my transmitter has been tested and stickered, I will fly it with absolutely no fear of problems. The sky has not fallen yet.

Later;

D.W.