rgaynor

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Hi Chad - I am interested in learn more about your technique. I have not heard about vinyl rivets - what are they. I have used rivet tape before http://www.rcscaleproducts.com/finish_acc.htm - is this what you are referencing?
Thanks
Ron

rgaynor

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HI Chad - thanks for your suggestion. I am not familar with Vinyl rivets. I have used rivet tape ( http://www.rcscaleproducts.com/finish_acc.htm ). Is this what you are referencing? If not, please tell me more.

Thanks
Ron

Chad Veich

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Ron,

The vinyl rivets are just the opposite of the rivet tapes, ie, you keep the small vinyl dots and throw away the strips. I don't know if anyone is actually marketing these but any laser cutting service could make them for you. Actually, any vinyl cutting service could probably do it as well as they don't necessarily have to be done with a laser cutter. Just tell the cutter what diameter rivet you want and how far apart you want them and they should be able make them up in big sheets. Then you just carefully transfer the rows of vinyl dots from the sheet to your airplane with Scotch tape. Come to think of it a vinyl cutting service could probably apply a mask of clear transfer tape to the entire sheet for you. As the Scotch tape or transfer tape is clear you can easily see through it to position the rivets along your panel lines or reference marks and then rub them on. Go back and put a drop of glue on each one with a toothpick or hypodermic needle and your done, perfectly round rivets.

rgaynor

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Interesting - don't they make these dots with adhesive on the back? Should I decide to do it the old fashion way, what type of glue do you use to make the rivet heads. I have used Elmers, but it is a little runny. I think Kim mentioned that he uses canopy glue. How about you?
Thanks

V35BFLYER

Ron,

Chad's idea is ingenious! Wish I'd thought of it!!! When I got my RCScale Products rivet "tape," the strips still had all the "dots" still in the holes. And yes, the strips have a light adhesive on the back.

It just hit me......take the strips (either from RCScale Products or from any vinyl shop), lay them over your rivet line, rub on the tape with your finger, lift the strip and VOILA! A neat row of tiny rivets evenly spaced. Genius! Then go back using Canopy glue to "enhance" the rivets....making them domed. It completely eliminates the thousands of pencils marks I made inside each and every "hole" to show me where to place the Canopy glue drops. Brilliant!!!

Come to think of it, you could experiment using a scrap piece of styrene or wood with the vinyl rivets on it, then prime over them, and no Canopy glue to see the effect as well.

Chad Veich

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The vinyl has an adhesive backing on it. It's basically just like stick on Monokote trim. I have used yellow wood glue as well as canopy glue (RC56) with good results but the canopy glue seems to be the best overall choice.

I did just that on my current Hellcat build Kim. The Hellcat has both raised and flush rivets so I burned the flush ones in the usual manner and then used the vinyl rivets, without any glue, to simulate the raised type. I think the effect works well on the Hellcat which is only 1/8 scale. On a bigger model it would probably be obvious the rivets are not domed but I'm satisfied with it on the little Hellcat. I don't really have a good pic but you can make out some of the "raised" rivets in this close-up shot of the tailwheel area.



Here you can see the white vinly rivets on the same area of the fuselage prior to getting a coat of Zinc Chromate. It's a good idea to use vinyl that is a contrasting color to your primer. On my T-6 I started out trying to put light grey rivets on a silver base coat. Bad idea!

Chad Veich

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One last note regarding the vinyl rivets. Sign vinyl comes in various thicknesses. I would recommend the very thin type if you plan to do the glue drops and the thicker stuff if you would like to try them sans glue.

rgaynor

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I like the idea and will pursue this method -thanks for the great feedback!!

rgaynor

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Hey Chad - thanks for the great suggestion and pictures. The vinyl rivets are very consistant and would probably do a great job in pooling the glue in a defined area when dropped on top of each dot.

Chad Veich

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My pleasure Ron and best of luck with your Bonanza. Looking forward to watching your progress.

rgaynor

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What is a Bonanza without a step-up... I molded this one out of balsa and stuck magnets on both ends so that it is removable during transport

rgaynor

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OK - call me crazy, but I came up with another idea for putting on raised rivets. Using the Woodpecker tool, I removed all the wheels except one. I used the tool to roll out perfectly separated indentations in the wood and then filled each one with glue. What do you think???

V35BFLYER

My first thought was....brilliant!

Then I thought that "perforating" might/maybe/could weaken the structure. But since they're so far apart, unlike paper towel perfs, I think you'll be OK. Lay out your lines and just keep the Woodpecker going straight, and I think you'll be fine.

Quick, neat, great spacing.....ingenious!

Kim
PS. I'd get some additional feedback from someone who's tried this. I'd hate to see the skins "split" along perforation lines.

rgaynor

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My idea of making rivet heads did not work out. The glue ended up sinking into the small holes leaving not much of a rivet head. I think I may just go back to rivet tape and appling individually.

rgaynor

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The rivet process has begun - completed 1/4 of the wing and it might be until next YEAR before I finish riveting this entire plane!! What is interesting is how the glue dried - it did not form a dome top on each rivet - HUM.

ktcanuck

Sure does look like a lot of work which makes me a bit hesitant to say this but the pics I have show the aircraft to be flush riveted, no?

rgaynor

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UGH - you are correct! The wings do have flush and it is the fuse that have raised rivets. What are your suggestions? Would you sand these down and then make them flush? Thanks for bring this to my attention.

ktcanuck

I guess it depends on your intention. If it is to practice scaling rivets then leave them. If it to be closest to scale then, yes, afraid so. There are a few techniques for doing flush rivets to scale using appropriately sized sharpened tube. A search here or RC Scalebuilder will find them. I think most of the fuselage is flush too but I don't have my photos handy to be certain, sorry.

rgaynor

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Thanks Kim - I will need to give thought what next steps to take.

ktcanuck

No worries. It's Keith. At least you are doing your riveting! I have been on hiatus on my V tail for months now.

rgaynor

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Sorry Keith - Kim is V35BFlyer. Time for you to post pics of your V-tail - I would enjoy seeing how yours is coming along

V35BFLYER

Ron,

DO NOT SAND THEM OFF!!! About the only thing you can do is to pick each one off with tweazers. It's not as hard as it seems and goes pretty quickly. Bonanzas are indeed flush-riveted to reduce drag. You're doing a great job on this model and are not too far into the rivet detail. I'd start over and do flush rivets with a sharpened brass tube affixed to your soldering iron.

Kim

ktcanuck

I have had good success removing unwanted surface irregularity using an Exacto Chisel blade with care, bevel side down of course.

rgaynor

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Thanks Kim and Keith fo your suggestions. One step forward...TWO STEPS BACK!!! LOL

V35BFLYER

Keith,

I have an Exacto chisel blade also and was thinking the same thing. Ron has already primed and sanded so I wasn't going to mention going that route for obvious reasons. The chisel "method" would work and probably be faster, although gouging the surface would be hard to avoid with the chisel I would think. Just my .02.