Peter G.

I was given a Pica Spit 1/5 scale half built. I already have a little spit that I completed as true to scale as I could.
My question is the kit has pressure sensitive decals and I was thinking of putting panel lines and rivets on this big spit. Has anyone tried to put decals over rivets? If so was there a trick and did the decals lift around the rivets? Or should I just airbrush them on like my little spit? On one hand I like to put lots of detail on my planes.............. but then I get too scared to fly them . I thought if I try and keep the labor down and use the decals I might actually fly the thing more. Thanks for your input. Peter

pittsdriver

My Feedback: (7)

Peter, The Spit had flush rivets on the wing and raised on the fuse but the vinyl decals won't form to the panel lines and rivet detail. To do it right you have to use a high quality water slide or the best is to paint all of the markings on. It's not that hard to do and the results look real instead of something you just slapped on. Don

RandyL

My Feedback: (4)

Peter, Don knows much more about your paticular project than I but I can show you how I used decals similar to yours on an airframe with lines and raised rivets.

Once the airframe is ready to start the panel line layout, tape your decals in place using a bit of masking tape. Do all of your panel line layout and then remove the decals leaving it smooth under them. Apply your rivets, again leaving it smooth under the decal areas.

Now paint the airframe, install decals, use some panel line tape for reffernce and apply glue rivets over the decals. Then remove tape. You will not notice the absence of panel lines on the decals and the transluscent glue rivets take on the color of the area that they are applied over. I then flat cleared the entire airframe.

While not dead to scale, the end results are good enough for all but the most rigid scale enthusiasts. Here are a couple of photos and a lot more can be seen on my B-25 page that is attached to my homepage below.

RandyL

My Feedback: (4)

and the finished results.......

pittsdriver

My Feedback: (7)

Randy, That does look great, the best job I have seen using stick ons. Is that your B-25? Is it getting ready to fly again? I have a 101" Ziroli also that I will do this winter and your step by step site will help greatly. How do you think two Laser 2.00 v-twins would power it? I have one and getting another is cheaper than buying a couple of gas engines plus they will fit in the cowls completely. On the markings side, I just prefer to paint them as its not that hard to do and they look soreal then. Also it is easier to wheather a painted marking. Don

Peter G.

Thanks Don & Randy;

I might try that idea. I thought of trying to pluck the rivets off where the decal goes, but thought I would chip too much paint. I can see this already......... I am going to spend too much time on this plane and have another wall hanger

Thanks guy's Peter

PS: nice job Randy

Peter G.

I was also going to glass the whole bird as I have a Folke-Wulf that I used cloth on with detail, and it seem's I have to go over it every now and then, as the covering bubbles or lifts

What covering do you use, (or used on your B-25). Is this just a fact of all coverings?. By the way I have used stik it and balsa rite both. Maybe just poor covering material.

Thanks again.

RandyL

My Feedback: (4)

Peter, No one covering is the best for everything. Usually, when you are not happy with the results it can be traced back to the wrong material ( or appliacation ) for the expected results.
In a nut shell... If it takes heat to apply it, then heat will probably loosen it. All the plastic type covering are great but sooner or later they will wrinkle, loosen, etc. Very easy and light however.
On open structure I like a cloth type covering and there are many ways to apply and finish cloth.
On the full sheeted airframe, I only use 1/2 oz glass cloth and resin. It is the most permant type covering for sheeted airframes that I know of. I much prefer to use an epoxy resin to apply mine but there are arguements for water based, and laquer based products as well.
In short....If it is sheeted give glass covering a try, there are MANY threads on the topic. No bubbling, lifting, shifting, lossening once finished.

RandyL

My Feedback: (4)

Don.. Yes I am working on my 25. The fuse is rebuilt and the outer wing panels are again ready. I seem to have ran out of time but will get the left side of the center section repaired soon. Trying to get done by this fall. When you get ready, shoot me an e-mail, I have a lot more photos of the B-25 project than what is published on the page
I don't know the ability of the engines you mention but knowing some of your modeling I would expect that they are very nice. Will they turn a 16-8 through 18 -6 better than 7K? According to the size you have posted I would suspect that this RPM is no problem.

Peter G.

Thanks Randy;

I guess I knew all that.......... just trying to put less hours, hence less attachment, hence less nerves when it comes to flying her. It's decided then, glass it is. I only seem to dislike the results of cloth on full sheeted area's. It also does not help that the only place I can store all my planes is from the ceiling in my shop where the heat ducts tend to blow on them. There is also quite a range of humidity in the shop that no doubt play's a part.

Thanks guy's.

pittsdriver

My Feedback: (7)

Peter, Glassing is not that big of deal and is also lighter than fabric covering materials. Also water base latex and acrylic paints are light and very easy to use.
Randy, The Lasers will turn an 18-8 or 10 to 7000 ok. I also build light so hopefully it should work good. I'll get ahold of you when I start. Don

Peter G.

Pittsdriver;

I don't know............. it might be that I am slow or too much of a perfectionist, but when I glass a wing it takes weeks. There is always that spot here or there, or just one more coat of primer, only to sand and say the same thing all over again. I have done planes in fiberglass before, that's why I was thinking of something a little less time consuming. I agree though, it gives the best results I have seen so far. I know on my Folke-Wulf I deliberately stopped myself from spending too much time on it for fear of owning another wall hanger, hence I used fabric and was not totally pleased. I suppose............. if I was a better pilot this would not be as great an issue But then that's another story.

Thanks again, and what a great site this is. Peter.

pittsdriver

My Feedback: (7)

Try using laquer base polyurethane to lay the glass. Put a couple of coats of sanding sealer on the raw balsa, sand with 320 grit and a block then lay the glass using the poly. It dries in about an hour and two or three coats is plenty for a primer base. You can glass a whole airplane in a couple of evenings. Don

Peter G.

Hey that I might try. I have used epoxy and fiberglassing resin(polyvinyl ?) I am always willing to try new things though, thanks.

p51flier

I tried custom made waterslide decals on my fiberclassics Mustang recently. I also had to apply some decals over flush rivets. I brushed some softener (Micro-SOL) on the wet decal which sunk into every irregularity. Of course the dried decal must be clear coated. See the pic below. There is decal material over the row of flush rivets between the two text blocks and as you can see you see nothing, no bubbles or something else. From now on the waterslide decal method is my favorite method.

smchale

My Feedback: (67)

P51flyer,
That looks great! Can you share some details on the type of paper, printer, application, etc. you used? I'd like to take a stab at this. Did you need a glossy surface for the decal to go on, and then go with a flat clear after? Thanks!!

p51flier

It seems to me that the decals are printed on sheets from http://www.microscale.com/trimfilm.html

As I mentioned earlier I do not make them by my own. The decals are made by a one man enterprise in germany. But is is definitely stuff from the US. The decals come on sheets in US-letter format which is totally uncommon here in europe. So the url above might help.

That's the way I do it:
1. create all the graphics and labels and signs (not the insignias, too big) with CorelDraw or something similar
2. send the file to the manufacturer and check with him if everything is okay and looks the same as well as on his computer as on yours (then order, wait, receive....)
3. cut out the decal close to the border of the graphics/labels
4. apply some Micro-Set liquit with a soft brush to the place you want to place the decal
5. hold the cut out decal into hand warm water for about 10 sec
6. slide the decal to the place with the Mirco-set and align it
7. use a paper towel to remove excessive water/Micro-set
8. apply some Micro-Sol to the decal with a soft brush (you can also do that to a decal which is already dry), the decal will wrinkle horrible, but it will sink into every irregularities and will be flat after few hours. That step can be repeated several time. DO NOT touch the decal while it is wrinkled
9. when dry, it's time to apply the clear coat of your choice. I use 2 component automotive clear paint (glossy or dull). After that step the edges of the decal actually becomes invisible.
10. weathering/scratching of a decal: rub the coated decal with a polishing/rubbing paste (it feels like mashed potatoes) and stop rubbing with your fingers when the decal looks as desired. At last a final clear coating is necessary.

Granted, many steps, but the result is really cool. See the elevator of my Mustang below and a service hatch in the next posting.
The way I make the dirt in the panel lines and around the rivets I allready described here in rcuniverse.

p51flier

.....and here is the hatch.

If you need more info feel free to shoot an email.

Joe