Hi guys,

I'm currently learning to fly again. I learned to fly about 4 years ago and flew like a nutter grabbing virtually any chance I could to get airborne. However, I then spent 3 years not flying and so I am now buddied up with one of our clubs instructors and he is going to get me back up to speed again.
I am so impractical that I even had to get someone else to make my ARTF plane for me It's a Super Sportster 40.

I would love to build a plane. In part I want to do this because I want to improve my practical skills. In part because I want to be able to repair the plane if I crash it and I know it will be easier for me to do this if I built the plane myself. Most of all though I want to kit the plane out with as much scale parts (cockpit etc) as I can. So, important characteristics for me are that

a) it's suitable as a first build but is still reasonably scale and looks good in the air and on the ground
b) reasonably easy to fly given the level of my flying experience
c) I want to use a 4 stroke engine and have it enclosed (not sticking out of the side of the cowl etc).

What do you think guys?
Cheers,
Dub

Do you have a preferred aircraft type or era? Truly scale WWII warbirds can be hard to build (well) and tricky to fly (because of the wing loading). Some of the civilian types can be good fliers and not so involved to build. My own, perhaps somewhat biased, opinion is that WWI models are fairly easy to build (mostly just stick and "tissue" construction).

The Flair "scout" kits are pretty easy to build as are the Balsa USA kits. You certainly can't go wrong with a Puppeteer, which is a "sport scale" Sopwith Pup. Here's mine.

http://www.flairmodels.co.uk/Aircraf...coutframes.htm

AbuFletcher - wow so good to hear from you sir! I spoke to you MANY years ago on here - i can't even remember what my name was on the forum then!

Anyway sir, WW1 is a big hit with me. Just not sure which kit to go for... Been looking at the flair site and keep going round and round in circles. One thing that put me off the puppeteer is that I heard that to get a 4 stroke engine in to the cowl you have to make some modifications by extending the fuse (or something). Such mods will probably be beyond me.

So I guess the question is which WW1 bipe kit is good for a first timer, accurate, and can house a 4 stroke engine.

Cheers,
Dub

PS that is an AWESOME looking plane you have there!! thanks for sharing pics

I think the Puppeteer and the DVII would be the most straight-forward builds. Only slight mods are needed to fit the the Saito 56 4-stroke that I use. The Saito 62 would give a bit more umph in the same size package. Here's an extensive thread with various people's build of the Flair Puppeteer. My build starts on about page 16.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_25...16/key_/tm.htm

And here's a video of the build of my own Flair Puppeteer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db4SEClA9-s

It is only a "fun-scale" version but you really can deck it out to your heart's content. And it's a proven good flyer (over 10,000 sold) and the kit comes with almost everything your need to build it stock.


Such mods were beyond ME before I attempted them. Half the fun of building is learning how to build!

Thanks for that link The Puppeteer is looking like a good choice!

Would you be interested in the purchase of my Flair DVII? The reason for selling: I have a Proctor DVII coming, own a BUSA DVII and built a Sterling DVII many years ago. The Flair kit is a nice sport scale aeroplane. The kit is complete and unbuilt- I only looked at the plans. I just like larger models anymore.

A Piper Cub is a good scale airplane- easy to build and fly. One came out of the factory black with cream lettering- never seen that color scheme modeled. Plus, there are many that were drafted into military service!

Hi Arup

Thanks for your reply. I would be interested but i suspect shipment from the US to the UK will make it prohibitively expensive.

Cheers,
Dub

Hi Dubcat, if you are looking to go with one of the flair models I think the legonare is the one for you,easy to build & fly (NOT, a Abu ! ) no, the best of the bunch must be the SE5a ,that's VERY easy to build and fly and no problems getting a 4-stroke in

Jeff great feedback. Thanks. I prefer the looks of the Pup but if the SE5a is easier and can take the 4 stroke with no issues maybe that is the way to go. I also think it might be easier for me to find a real SE5a to look at too...

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SE5a models are almost always easy fliers.

I read the Legionaire instructions are just a bunch of esoteric text and can be quite hard to follow. Remember - Im a beginner. I was attracted by the fact that the instructions for the Pup are in pictures. What are the ones for the SE5a like?

Please remember I'm extremely impractical and so unlike many of you I will be completely dependant on instructions that are clear, accurate, and easy to follow. I have no ability to think outside of the box when it comes to these things (yet), something I hope to improve with experience.

For some reason, despite the fact that almost EVERYONE wants to use a 4-stroke for scale models, nearly all plans (and kits and ARFs) seem to be designed with a 2-stroke as the default. So you just have to get used to ALWAYS having to figure out the installation. It's just the price we pay for using the 4-strokes we love. But you do wish that designers would catch on!

Check out the Puppeteer thread. There is a lot of discussion about the mods needed for mounting a 4-stroke (which I think every single builder in that thread did). It wasn't that hard.

They are a bloody nightmare! I had my son (who's a non-modeler) read them and he said that while he understood most of the words, it was all complete nonsense to him.

The Pup "instructions" on the other hand, have moved into the 21st century were kits are sold all over the world to builders speaking dozens of different languages. Thus, there is almost no language at ALL on the Pup "construction sheets." And, really, none are needed. The very nice isometric drawings making the steps in the construction very, very clear.

The Pup is probably Flairs most "mature" kit in that it has gone through several revisions and everything pretty much fits just like it's supposed to. The Legionnaire looks like it was designed once in the early 1980's and forgotten. And frankly, I've never had such a hard time flying any model. Take-offs were a Holy Terror.

One HUGE advantage of going with the Pup is that you can read about all the solutions to all the problems on that RCU build thread. And if you have any problems yourself, all you have to do is let us know and you'll have help galore 24/7. I'm not sure I could even build a model without RCU!

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><font size="3" face="Calibri">The magnattila,puppeteer,legionnaire &amp; baronette date from the early&lsquo;80s (SE5a 1988) back then 4-strokes where VERY expensive ,so a 2-stroke was the common choice for power .The magnattia (also a excellent first build ww1 model) and pup have been completely updated, not certin if the se5 has been though .I had my pup for twenty years and it had 2 and 4 stroke engines, only difference ....was the noise !! </font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><font size="3" face="Calibri">The only part of the build that might give you problems is the <span style="mso-spacerun: yes"></span>construction <span style="mso-spacerun: yes"></span>of the ailerons , but as Abu pointed out, you only have to ask !!</font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><o><font size="3" face="Calibri"></font></o></p>

I am settled on the Pup. I am going to build a fun fighter first with a friend to get my toes wet and then move on to the Pup after. Abu, I ready every single post in that massive thread you linked. While it was informative and got me day dreaming about all the cool scale features I want to add I still have to get my head around exactly what mods are needed to fit the 4 stroker in. From what I can tell you have to cut a hole in to the firewall and mount the engine further back. You then shape the firewall to follow around the engine which is no sticking through where the original firewall was. Is that right?

More or less. On the Pup, the wooden rails for mounting the engine are built into the tank area and the entire unit is designed to naturally sit with the proper thrust angles (the title of the thread). So mounting a 4-stroke only involves making some cuts here and there so that you can mount the engine a bit further back on the rails and adding some bits of wood around the edges.

The standard method for mounting a 4-stroke is to have it sitting on a "recessed firewall" which much easier to do than the term might imply. But on the Puppeteer you don't even have to do that because of the way the engine beams are attached to the tank walls.

What's a "fun fighter?" Isn't a Pup a "fun fighter?"

Hahaha - a fun fighter is a small semi scale very easy to construct kit that we get in the UK. They are much smaller than other planes and very simple to put together.

Testing connection

Coming in loud and clear here at the airport in Osaka, Japan!

Wow! Those DO look like fun! And it might be a nice first step in building.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=738893

duplicate post removed

I am making the little FW 190 kit shown in this thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1094760

Because this is my first build I did find the plans and instructions most intimidating. Luckily my friend is mentoring me through the build and we are building this simple little plane at his house. There would also have been huge delays in the build due to me not having some of the common sense and necessary tools - again luckily my friend had everything I needed Hopefully by the end of this simple build I will be in a much better position to get started with my....

Puppeteer - I think it IS the Pup that I will go with I'm getting excited thinking about all of the scale details I might be able to add!

Thanks,
Dub

Th Flair Pup is an excellent choice for a project that builds beautifully and flie just as well, will give you many years of good service. I have built ttwo of them..the last one lasted 10 years before pilot error set in one grey sleepy morning.
The one thing I would recommend is that you deviate from the plans on thePup and install one servo in each lower wing (I insead of one in the center driving two ailerones)This will give more flexibility in fine tuning your differential and helping coordinate flying curves with your rudder.
My other recommendation would be to install an OS 70 ( 11.5 cc) or Laser 70..or similar Magnum or Saito...This will give you a bit more power for aerobatic manoevers but still fly in a scale like fashion more or less. The problem with rolling the Pup ,as Abu mentions, has never been a problem with mine..and I assume its because of this extra oomph factor. Unfortunately this size engine will protrude a outside beyond the cowling, but not in an ugly way...my opinion. At some later point you can build a scale landing gear when your skills and tools and expertise improve....you picked the right plane..take your time and enjoy building as much as flying !
Oh, one other area with all biplanes is to be very careful when buiding the Cabane section...this can cause you no end of grief later if it is not set up perfectly square to building board from all angles.

Thanks Mein - I was really hoping to have a fully enclosed engine to be honest. Can you post some pictures of your one please? Specifically the cowl and engine.
Thanks,
Dub