RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

People will get confused over the names, I hope whomever used the guy in California has been told of all this. It isn't right for him to be blamed for something becasue of the names. Tell him he should change his name to :I'm Not the Scam Artist in Westland Michigan"!!

Seriously he needs to change it................

No good company should get hurt by this disaster in Westland

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Those of you that have been ripped off by this guy. Get all your paperwork in order and contact the State's Attorney General's Office in Lansing, MI. Those of you from overseas can do the same it becomes a case of international fraud and the Attorney General can then bring in the FBI. You do have that right to contact them to solve an international problem or possible fraud. They can then do a full investigation and bring charges as needed or warranted.

Five hundred dollars is a lot of money I would not want my funds tied up for months and not get a thing. This is the route I would pursue if I had been taken without hesitation. If I can not have an item within thirty days I do not buy from that company. Unless it is a local company where I can go talk to them in person.

Contacting the locals might get something done. But if you contact the state, It will get done. This state is not gentle on frauds and scammers. They go after them with a vengeance. The more complaints and more information you can provide them the faster they will move.

This state has enough problems as it is, we don't need guys like this ripping people off.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Thanks for the advice. I think I will let him know that I am going to pursue this to the end if my kit does not get out immediately. I think two years is plenty long to wait for a kit.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

I was just reading along and decided to go to his page. Being a computer person; first thing i thought it "his picture doesnt load" so i clicked on it and the link was wrong and he tried to link the picture off his hard drive... so his name on his computer is "MikeNeal" " D:\MikeNeal\Kitcutter06242008\cm490x100.gif"

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

by the time this bum gets confronted, i am afraid he will Chapter 7 the company and come back with a new one to screw everyone again.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

The Attorney General's website. There is a big red button on the left side that says "file a complaint"

http://www.michigan.gov/ag

Mike Cox is the AG.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

After two years I would not waste any more time. I would contact the AG and get the ball moving.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

geeesh, how hard is it to cut your own parts anyways?

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Oh it's really hard man! All those formers and notches. Dude! This one plane, it took me all most like two hours to cut out all the parts!


Well said Summerwind! I've been biteing my tongue on this point. If you got space to build a 1/4 scale plane then you got space for a scroll saw. If you got two years to dick around with some lazy kit cutter then you had the time to cut the kit!

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Ok guys, I've had to step in here and remove a few posts. RCU fully supports people in this hobby reporting vendor/manufacturers that they feel have given less than decent service. That's one of the things that makes RCU so great in that we do let "the people" speak their mind and tell what has happened to them. All we ask is that those posts are made in a mature and civil manner and just stick to the facts of the issue. The OP and others reporting their problems with this business have done exactly that and there is no problems with those posts. The ones that I had to remove are the posts that adopted a lynch mob mentality about dealing with this. Comments such as paying the guy a visit and harming him have no place here on RCU and I've removed them. I think everybody should understand why we have to do this. Otherwise the thread has been very straightforward and informative about a possible problem.

Thanks for understanding

Ken

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

thx Ken.
actually it's an offensive thread.......why not move it where it belongs?

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

There isn't anything offensive about this thread. RCU has always prided itself in that we let "the little guys" post problems they are having when dealing with companies in this industry. As long as they post their problems in a civil, mature,and calm manner we don't mind at all. I know that many of the big hobby companies actually read the forums of RCU in order to find out if their customers are unhappy with the service they provide. In this manner this makes RCU a tool to benefit both the consumer and supplier alike. In this case, the OP has presented his case in a decent manner, and the company involved is more than welcome to rebut those claims if he sees fit. But if he wants to he will need to present the facts of the issue. Yes I know that he has made some claims in the open forums, but because of several things going on in the background we are going to leave to those in the public eye for the time being.

As of right now there is no reason to take action or move this thread

Ken

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Couldn't you ask this same question of anyone who has ever built a kit? Personally, I've decided I'm never going to cut another set of wing ribs if I can avoid it. :D

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Hey Don, I have my new CNC table working perfectly, you don't have to cut your own ribs again. Let me know ;)

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

depends on the kit.
but to do a scratch build, i'd feel more envloved if i did all the cutting myself.....course if it is a WW2 plane, i'll have to find a riveter eh?:D

from what i'm reading though, throwing 500 bucks away for parts i can cut myslef is a travesty[&o]

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Just saying that there's no difference in principle between buying a kit and asking someone to "cut a kit" for you from plans. I might be willing to spend up to $300 for complicated parts for a complex model (think something like a Ziroli B-24), with lots of ply parts. But I'd be more likely to only have "the hard" parts cut and do the easy parts myself.

On a WWI model there's very little worth having cut. It really just boils down to ribs...and I think a set of laser cut scale ply ribs is more than worth the extra expense. I don't think I'd bother with getting anything else cut.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

&lt;meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type" />&lt;meta content="Word.Document" name="ProgId" />&lt;meta content="Microsoft Word 9" name="Generator" />&lt;meta content="Microsoft Word 9" name="Originator" />&lt;link href="file:///C:/DOCUME~1/BRIANW~1/LOCALS~1/Temp/msoclip1/01/clip_filelist.xml" rel="File-List" /><![if gte mso 9]><xml><w:WordDocument><w:View>Normal</w:View><w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom><w:DoNotOptimizeForBrowser /></w:WordDocument></xml><![endif]><style type="text/css"><! Style Definitions */p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:Arial; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {color:blue; text-decoration:underline; text-underline:single;}a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple; text-decoration:underline; text-underline:single;}@page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;}div.Section1 {page:Section1;}></style><p class="MsoNormal">It is quite obvious to me that virtually no one<span style=""> </span>knows what heck they are talking about!</p><p class="MsoNormal">First, Kitcutters.com is laser cutter, located somewhere around Anaheim, CA and &ldquo;owned&rdquo; by &ldquo;A Family Business&rdquo;; hasn&rsquo;t taken an order since Last August at least. Kitcutter.com is hand cutter and owned by Michael Neal, Cornell Michaels Kit Cutting is the business name.</p><p class="MsoNormal">How can you be creditable if you can&rsquo;t even get the companies correct that you are dealing with, or maybe you can&rsquo;t tell the difference? Maybe you are bashing the wrong guy? Seems to me that the majority of posts here are from folks that haven&rsquo;t done business with either company.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">My dealings have been with &ldquo;Cornell&rdquo; Michaels, have been honest and delivered very close to the dates (within days) we have discussed and certainly not enough difference to matter. He has kept me informed of his progress during the course of every project. I last ordered a kit from him this February, we discussed a delivery date in late June as I was not in any hurry and I had enough on my plate (building boards). Cornell was honest and up front about projects that needed to be completed before he could start on my next kit. The kit will arrive on time as far as I&rsquo;m concerned.</p><p class="MsoNormal">The two kits that arrived today are beautiful, well cut and complete. I am positive that the next will be the same and I will continue to order from Neal &ldquo;Cornell&rdquo; Michaels. Every kit has superior quality ply and balsa.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">As far as&rdquo;DanMN&ldquo; says autistic children are not considered &ldquo;retarded&rdquo;, you know damn well it depends on their level of function, some better, and some worse. Who are you to judge or are you just being PC? Are you biased maybe, because your kids function on a &ldquo;higher&rdquo; level? None one truly wants their child referred to retarded or as a retard, even if they are, I know first hand.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">Are the complainers children of the &ldquo;Now Generation&rdquo;? You&rsquo;ve gotten so used to ARF&rsquo;s, RTC&rsquo;s and RTF&rsquo;s that you can&rsquo;t realize the &ldquo;REAL WORLD&rdquo; where it does not happen over night and can&rsquo;t recognize true craftsmanship? It&rsquo;s still valued in this hobby&hellip; stick by stick by stick&hellip;</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">Anyone who has worked in Customer Service, at any level, knows that the customer will lie, cheat and falsify to &ldquo;prove&rdquo; they are right. &ldquo;Reggeee&rdquo;, Steve Chase, I&rsquo;ve seen some of your nasty and spurious (look it up in Webster&rsquo;s) E-mails, you are a real sick f*&amp;k (see previous sentence.) What you didn&rsquo;t know you little puke, is that the two B25&rsquo;s were being farmed out to another cutter that seriously needed the business.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial;">RCU should have shut this &ldquo;he said&rdquo; crap down with the first post, shame on you RCU&hellip;</span>

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

&lt;meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type" />&lt;meta content="Word.Document" name="ProgId" />&lt;meta content="Microsoft Word 9" name="Generator" />&lt;meta content="Microsoft Word 9" name="Originator" />&lt;link href="file:///C:/DOCUME~1/BRIANW~1/LOCALS~1/Temp/msoclip1/01/clip_filelist.xml" rel="File-List" /><![if gte mso 9]><xml><w:WordDocument><w:View>Normal</w:View><w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom><w:DoNotOptimizeForBrowser /></w:WordDocument></xml><![endif]><style type="text/css"><! Style Definitions */p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:Arial; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {color:blue; text-decoration:underline; text-underline:single;}a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple; text-decoration:underline; text-underline:single;}@page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;}div.Section1 {page:Section1;}></style><p class="MsoNormal">It is quite obvious to me that virtually no one<span style=""> </span>knows what heck they are talking about!</p><p class="MsoNormal">First, Kitcutters.com is laser cutter, located somewhere around Anaheim, CA and &ldquo;owned&rdquo; by &ldquo;A Family Business&rdquo;; hasn&rsquo;t taken an order since Last August at least. Kitcutter.com is hand cutter and owned by Michael Neal, Cornell Michaels Kit Cutting is the business name.</p><p class="MsoNormal">How can you be creditable if you can&rsquo;t even get the companies correct that you are dealing with, or maybe you can&rsquo;t tell the difference? Maybe you are bashing the wrong guy? Seems to me that the majority of posts here are from folks that haven&rsquo;t done business with either company.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">My dealings have been with &ldquo;Cornell&rdquo; Michaels, have been honest and delivered very close to the dates (within days) we have discussed and certainly not enough difference to matter. He has kept me informed of his progress during the course of every project. I last ordered a kit from him this February, we discussed a delivery date in late June as I was not in any hurry and I had enough on my plate (building boards). Cornell was honest and up front about projects that needed to be completed before he could start on my next kit. The kit will arrive on time as far as I&rsquo;m concerned.</p><p class="MsoNormal">The two kits that arrived today are beautiful, well cut and complete. I am positive that the next will be the same and I will continue to order from Neal &ldquo;Cornell&rdquo; Michaels. Every kit has superior quality ply and balsa.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">As far as&rdquo;DanMN&ldquo; says autistic children are not considered &ldquo;retarded&rdquo;, you know darn well it depends on their level of function, some better, and some worse. Who are you to judge or are you just being PC? Are you biased maybe, because your kids function on a &ldquo;higher&rdquo; level? None one truly wants their child referred to retarded or as a retard, even if they are, I know first hand.</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">Are the complainers children of the &ldquo;Now Generation&rdquo;? You&rsquo;ve gotten so used to ARF&rsquo;s, RTC&rsquo;s and RTF&rsquo;s that you can&rsquo;t realize the &ldquo;REAL WORLD&rdquo; where it does not happen over night and can&rsquo;t recognize true craftsmanship? It&rsquo;s still valued in this hobby&hellip; stick by stick by stick&hellip;</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal">Anyone who has worked in Customer Service, at any level, knows that the customer will lie, cheat and falsify to &ldquo;prove&rdquo; they are right. &ldquo;Reggeee&rdquo;, Steve Chase, I&rsquo;ve seen some of your nasty and spurious (look it up in Webster&rsquo;s) E-mails. (see previous sentence.)</p><p class="MsoNormal"><![if !supportEmptyParas]><![endif]><o:p></o:p></p><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial;">I agree that RCU should have shut this &ldquo;he said&rdquo; stuff down with the first post, shame on you RCU&hellip;</span>

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

"As far as”DanMN“ says autistic children are not considered “retarded”, you know darn well it depends on their level of function, some better, and some worse. Who are you to judge or are you just being PC? Are you biased maybe, because your kids function on a “higher” level? None one truly wants their child referred to retarded or as a retard, even if they are, I know first hand."

I have no idea where you are coming from on this thread. Have you read the whole thing?? Everyone is quite aware of the two different companies. No one has mentioned anything but good things from www.kitcutters.com. It doesn't take a detective to do some quick investigation on some forums to see there is a pattern with Micheal whatever his name is, not sending product that is purchased. That is what this thread is about. It would appear he came to his own defense on this thread and in my opinion, looked rather foolish doing so and didn't do himself any favors.

As far as your statement about me and where I stand on autism and "retarded". This has nothing to do with being PC. Biased? No. You have no idea where my children are on the spectrum, and I don't need you knowing that. The term "retarded" just isn't a correct term anymore, especially with autistic children. They are two totally different things. THIS I KNOW. A parent of an Autistic child would never use the term retarded.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

When I did some business with Joe at www.kitcutters.com last summer, they were located "just up the road from me" in Huntington Beach, CA. And as I said, no problems with them. If I were Joe, however, I would definitely think about changing the company name. Too bad that they aren't accepting new orders, but that's much more professional than accepting orders (and payment) on work you know you can't complete as seems to be the case with the guy in Michigan (and AZM).

The real problem with these sorts of small RC businesses is that you can't run them as a hobby. You can't do it "because you love it." It's work. Just like any other job. As the fact of the business world is that excuses, even if they are completely true, still mean the work isn't getting done.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

I logged on here to check on somethin, then got to readin this thread and now I forgot what it was I was gonna check . . .. . . . . . Very compelling reading. I was gonna check with this guy about cutting a Lynn Lockrow 1/3 scale Clipwing Monocoupe for me- dont think so now though.Theres really not that high of parts count on the thing. Think now I'll just cut it myself.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

Well put! I don't have a dog in this fight, but I am bothered by how this Michael tried to defend himself. As a professional sales person, I know that you are much better off apologizing and offerring money back than coming up with rather outlandish excuses as to why a job isn't done. That is just highly unprofessional. If you can't perform, don't take the job. Or, are you taking the job to get the cash??????

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

PS. Calling any person of any age "a retard" for any reason is as bad as any of the ethnic slurs that we as a society no longer tolerate. And autism is not always associated with limitations on mental development. One of the kids on my son's cross-country team in high school was autistic, but he also got considerably better grades than my son!

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

". . . . . . you are much better off apologizing and offerring money back than coming up with rather outlandish excuses as to why a job isn't done. .. . . . . . ."

Thats called service. Service is the heart of any business. And sometimes its expensive. But thats the name of the game if you're gonna play. And if service is the heart of any business, its people are the soul. This character seems to offer neither.

RE: Is kitcutter.com a ripoff?
 

AHIG.. If you see all the emails, you will see that I was civil and polite until He Cornell Michaels, Michael Neal referred to me as an "old Jew" because I complained that he donated some of my money on the Junior miss America Pageant, but I still didn't have a kit. If you see the emails, I told him that was a very racist remark. He then proceeded to berate me because i would deprive these young girls of money????? And I should be ashamed. I told him that logic was retarded. Any one that's says a product will be delivered in 6 weeks and and then fails to deliver in 6 months, should be taken to task. Now If I was the only one, then I guess everyone on this forum should second guess everything I say. But I researched and found other problems on other forums before I posted and now obviously a whole slew of us have the same experience. If you want to see spurious emails( look it up in Oxford's) I'll send them to you. I have no reason the lie cheat or falsify. It's really simple. He had all my money, I Had no Kit. lots of other people had the same problem so 2+2=4 (look it up)