Fsttanks

People seem to says upgrade to metal track, suspension and road wheels but never a good WHY other than to say they are stronger? Over this last summer I really beat my tanks up in particular my T90 and green Abrams (see photo gallery) as I wanted to see just how weak or strong the "plastic" parts really were. Here is the South West deserts of the U.S. the majority of the terrain in extremely dry, dusty, sandy and rocky. I spent on average an hour a day driving my tanks and neither experienced any breakage and both ran far beyond my expectations and earn a level of confidence in R/C tanks that I had never experienced in the past. At this point I could not see any reason to upgrade to metal suspension or road wheels as I saw no issues with strength of the "plastic" parts.

Well fast forward to this weekend and while putting on a set of DKLM "Abrams" tracks on both the above tanks I discovered an issue. Seems all that dust and sand kicked up while doing those hard turns, you the kind that look cool as the sand and dirt is spilled over the track and pours down onto the road wheels. All that dust, dirt and sand ground down the suspension "axels" and inner wheel "bearing" surfaces to the point I was amazed the road wheels did not break off of the tanks or were throwing tracks every few feet/meters due to them flopping around.

OK now back to my title, "Why the need for metal suspicion arms and road wheels? Since pictures are worth more than words, see below.

These are the "axels" from the my T90 compared to a new "axel" from an Abrams just to show a comparison of the wear vs new. Both my T90 and Abrams had the same type of "axel" and road wheel wear. Also you can see the amount of space worn between the "axel" and road wheel. I have done a patch job on the T-90 until new suspension arms and road wheels arrive and have also included a photo of this simple patch job (aluminum tube glued over worn part and road wheel reamed out to fit).

purplebrad

My Feedback: (1)

For the Tamiya Leo 2a6 the plastic suspension arms, at least some of them, will break. When it comes to metal tracks many suggest not to use them except for maybe the King Tiger.

CaptainB

The truth is, you don't need to upgrade. On the modern HL tanks, the plastic set-up is perfectly okay and has the benefit of running quieter. The modern tanks benefit from speed which the plastic set-up also gives you OOB. For me, the only reason I upgrade to metal is to get a better scale look and finish as the detail in the plastic wheels is not complete. So on modern tanks, I tend to run on plastic gearboxes and tracks with metal roadwheels and sprockets. Yes a bit more torque would be nice but with metal gearboxes, you get the speed issue and possible motor/pinion upgrades needed and of course, the noise. On WW2 tanks, metal upgraded make more sense and a slow crawling Tiger 1 for instance with all the clanking of the tracks etc. is cool..........just my 2 cents.....

Cheers

CaptB

Rad_Schuhart

Mate, have you seen the photos our colleague posted? That happens in WW2 and modern tanks too. I could post the same photos with my tanks. I had to replace the suspension arms in my tanks because they were like the photos posted. And the wheels were worn too...

I agree there is no need of metal upper hull and metal turret, but the suspension arms are a must... Unless your tank is a shelf queen, of course. But if you are like me and like to drive the tank outside home, what Mr Fsttanks shows is what happens, sooner or later.

CaptainB

Well, I drive my tanks outside quite hard in a nature reserve and they get stressed but I have to say I have not seen the damage you suggest. Maybe you just drive yours harder? - dunno - anyway, yes replacing the suspension arms for metal can do no harm.

Cheers

CaptB

Springman65

Guys,

I have to wonder if some components could be optimally designed and printed out of ABS - such as roadwheels and tracks and possibly idlers and sprockets????
Think about it, it you could print your own.......and when you wanted or needed them......even "tweek" them to suit your desire (add a bearing or brass sleeve to the design)

I think eventually as printed technologies and materials expand, it will replace casted white metal parts......

The possibilities ahead are very exciting.....

Springman

PS - We need to get someone to start making PLA filament in Dunkelgelb..........

Rad_Schuhart

Sometimes you cannot see the damage until you remove the wheel. I discovered it after breaking one wheel. I removed it and then I saw the suspension arm. Then I removed all the wheels and all the suspension arms were like that.

When using plastic arms is very hard to prevent this damage. Some people says to use oils or grease, but that creates a grinding paste which is even worse than leaving them alone.

I guess it is not only how you drive the tank but where you drive it. In places with dust is more probable to have this problem. With sand much more... Running at the garden, less. And at home, no problem at all...

I must say this is the problem I am having in my tamiya sherman idler wheel. The plastic wheel runs over a metal arm with no bushings or bearings at all, so it ended failing.

CaptainB

Yep - agree with all of that.....................

CaptB

Springman65

Ok guys, I have a problem with this thread....the use of "plastic" as a catch-all is just WRONG! There are a multitude of plastics out there (Styrene, ABS, PLA, TPU, Nylon, and so on...and even sub-groups to those.....). And there characteristics are just as varied...... I think most of you have experience with simple styrene and thus apply it to ALL plastics and that is SO WRONG......

I just doubt that your "plastic experiences" are properly fitting to ALL plastics........and, I just want you to keep that in mind.......

Sorry if i have offended anyone....its just worth saying here.....

springman

Rad_Schuhart

Well, good point.... I am not an expert in plastics... The only thing I can say is the Tamiya tanks are made of styrene which in my opinion is a very soft plastic (Well, some of them has wheels made of ABS), and the heng longs as far as I know are made of ABS which is one of the strongest plastics there, but you need some special glues for it.

If I am right and Heng Long uses ABS, it wears as the Fsttanks shows... So it looks like no matter the plastic, metal is a need in that part.

Fsttanks

Plastic, polymer or whatever chemical based material that is being used simply is NOT the point and meaningless to bring up here. The point is the material used in the entry level Heng Long tanks will wear faster if used continuously run in dirty, dusty and sandy environments. These parts should be inspected from time to time and replaced based on ones budget to evert surprises like I encountered. For some that will be will basic oem none metal parts, for some a mix of non metal and metal and for others full metal parts. I started this thread because myself and I am sure others could not find another that showed what kind of wear is being encountered with hard use (yes I used the search button). Seems very few folks like to post photos of issues for other to learn from, they do love to write about issues though. Not me, I like show and tell.

So, lets get back on topic and not start a pissing match over simple descriptor words, I think we all know what is being referred to when the word "plastic" is used in terms of r/c Heng long tanks.

CaptainB

If you drive your tank hard to the point of abuse in a hostile environment then you are going to accelerate wear period. Remember,these tanks are essentially toy tanks at the standard level that are not engineered for much more than simple backyard type play.

Cheers

CaptB.