ThermalSight

I purchased a HL Panther and a HL Pershing from Mato Toys (both super versions). The Panther works beautifully: it's fast and powerful, and it ran for 45 minutes on a a full charge endurance test over mixed terrain. The Pershing is a disappointment: it is slow and weak (about 1/2 or less the performance of the Panther), and it only ran for 21 minutes on the same endurance test. The Pershing also does not seem to have the performance of the HL Pershing in the video on the Mato site.

I complained to Mato, and they are sending me a replacement metal engine box along with some other upgrade parts I ordered.

Does anyone else have an idea of how the Pershing is supposed to perform generally, and compared to the Panther?

swathdiver

Endurance is generally because of the batteries. They are of low quality and I never use them. Right away I purchase something more powerful such as the Venom 3600mah sticks (3+ hours enduarance). Now as for speed, the motors and gearboxes are the same, take a look at the drive sprockets, notice the difference? That's why the Tiger and Panther are such runners compared to the Pershing and Walker.

A note about the gearboxes. The gears usually need chamfering to get them to mesh properly, get the binding spots out. Even after I do that I still run the tank off the ground at varying speeds for 45 minutes or so to break it in.

ThermalSight

Hi Swath - thanks for the info. I ran it for about 1 1/2 hours on blocks and driving around a bit. The tank is marginally better, but it still lags behind the Panther by about 1/2.

I opened it up and found the antenna wire disconnected, so I soldered that back on. I also disconnected the smoke pump because I really don't think I'll be using that much (the Panther has an off switch for smoke).

I checked the action of the transmission and did not detect any obvious binding. I guess I would have to remove it to really examine it. Since Mato is sending me a replacement engine box, I'll examine both when I do the engine swap.

A historical note about track design: the German interleaved suspension had some advantages, but it's adverse weather performance was not as good as the Pershing or the Russian T-34 (or later T-54/55, T-62) designs. The German track gets fouled with mud and rocks easier, and when that is allowed to freeze the tank becomes immobilized. The later German Leopard 1 used a suspended track design similar to the Pershing.

btw - I commanded an M60A3 tank in the US 3rd Armored Division. The Pershing is the "great grandfather" of the M60, and the track on the HL Pershing is quite similar to the real thing with track blocks, end connectors, and center guides. Somehow, I'm gonna make this baby beat the Panther!

swathdiver

You'll have to change the motors to increase the speed. But you have to be careful so you don't fry the board by drawing too many amps. I do not know what the limit is though I do run Graupner Speed 400s in my Pershing. Because of the increased power low speed driving takes a little more finesse.

The Pershings disconnect switch for the smoker is in the battery compartment.

[link=http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001200560&I=LXLLT5&P=K]DuraTrax High RPM 380[/link]

[link=http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001200560&I=LXLYA6&P=K]DuraTrax VR3 Ultra High RPM 380[/link]

I was considering these motors to give my M41 a little more ooommppfff! Wanna be the first?

Thanks for your service. I'm trying to honor the 1st Marine Tank Battalion with my Pershing project, turning my Pershing into an M26A1 which they used for a few months before switching to the M46.

raimian

swathdriver, how did you remove the pinions from the motors to swap them over?? as im interested in replaceing my motors as i will be getting the new clark electronic when they are released.

swathdiver

I bought one of those little pullers from Tower. Putting them on the new shafts is still a pain. I tried to locate replacements to no avail in case I broke one but, so far so good.

ThermalSight

Swathdiver: I'm seriously considering getting this package of upgrades (battery and motors) so I can have two comparable tanks available when my nieces and nephews visit for Xmas. Where do I get replacement electronic boards If I need one?

swathdiver

Unless I come across a steal on eBay I buy from Mato Toys. I think he's out of replacement boards right now, but if you send him an e-mail he'll let you know if he does or when they'll be in. The fellow who owns the company is named Murphy and he's always done right by me. His company is in Canada and he now offers UPS instead of Canada Post so the orders get to us in the states faster.

ThermalSight

I just purchased this enhancement pack for the HL Pershing

DuraTrax High rpm 380 Motor w/Connector Vendetta 2 12.99
Venom 6-Cell 7.2V 3600mAh Sport Battery Pack 1 39.99
GWS Gear Puller Tool Standard 1 12.09

I'll post the results after delivery/install next week.

Any suggestions on a good charger that has the correct connectors for the HL batteries and the one above?

swathdiver

I didn't want to spend a fortune on chargers that cost 3x as much as my tanks. However, I did want a peak charger with an LCD display. This is what I settled for and have been very happy with it.

[link=http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCLD5&P=ML]DuraTrax Piranha[/link]

ThermalSight

10 Minutes of Fame

I installed the new DuraTrax engines, and while I was at it I installed metal sprockets. Speed performance and power were outstanding: about 25 percent better than the Panther with plenty of turning and climbing power.

The suspension, track, and (metal) transmissions seemed to have no problem handling the additional power. The electronics, however, were unable to cope with the change. After about 5 minutes the sound no longer worked, and the head and tail lights flashed. After 10 minutes the tank was completely dead.

I'll resurrect my "Hot Rod Pershing" with upgraded electronics rather than replace the HL stuff because the HL part will likely fail again. Does anyone have a recommendation on a replacement electronics package?

raimian

yes, clark will be releasing their 1:16 tank electronics at the beginning of april 07, i not sure which dealers in the USA will be stocking them(email themn and ask)

the clark website is http://www.freewebtown.com/jyliang/eng/index_e.html

im really looking forward to their electonics being released as ive got some nice permax 400 motors to replace my stock 380's with.

swathdiver

I fried mine too this week, twice! Worked fine around the house and on pavement with occaisional forays through grass and mulch. On that day we flogged them in sugar sand with a 1/4 mile run to and from the park. The second board fried as soon as I hooked it up, don't really know what went wrong, just pulled it out and installed board #3 for the day. Have 1 left! Gotta order some more when the PZIII supply comes in next month.

As for alternative electronics I haven't paid too much attention as the expense was too great to make the switch and they lost too many features. The Clark system is interesting though, I may try that out in one tank. For now, $20 a board pales in comparison to dropping $400 for more reliable electronics and controller with a loss of features.

Merry Christmas!

Lorddraco2002

Read your article interesting. Commanded a Leopard 1A2 with the RCD and its dad was the WW2 Panther. As it was the M60 could never caught us. Mind you the M1 was a different cat. So good luck with your upgrades.

The_Stuff

the big 3200 or 3600 battery makes a world of diffrence. my pershing goes for about 4 times as long on the 3600. they even go to 4200

hdbeast

Stuff, can you tell us the site you got the 3200,3600, 4200 that will fit the Pershing?

Perry S.

Have you tried turning the boards over and putting a heat sink on them? You might be surprised.

YHR

I do this all the time now. I seal up the bottom of the tank and move everything around with the heat sink up. Haven't had a problem since. If you go to a computer repair place you can buy stick on heat sinks that can improve the cooling effect. My opinion of Heng Long electronics has gone up considerably since.

Perry S.

I just went to Radio Shack and bout a couple for $2. Blurry pic but you get the idea.

swathdiver

Venom has 4600 now too. Imagine two of those in a tank? You could run for many miles!

CapnCrunch43

The Venom 4200 (and possibly the 4600?) are a tad longer than the 3600. Just enough to where I would have to cut the battery tray in my Tam Leo 2A6 for it to fit.

That's the 4200 on top.

Harquebus

pscartozzi, YHR et al:

How do/did you attach the heat sinks? Was it easy? does Radio Shack have the press-on type?

The_Stuff

I got my battery at my LHS, but it is a venom like the ones a couple posts up.

CapnCrunch43

Same here, Stuff.

The person at the counter even said they were slightly longer, but......'Shirley you gest!!!' [:@]

Perry S.

THe heat sinks have a hole, I just drilled a hole in the aluminum HL heat sink and through-bolted with a 4-40. Make sure to use heat sink paste for good thermal contact. THe stick on types generally have more thermal resistance and I did not see any at RS.