Pepperami

Hiya guys!!

Well, after years on R/C Helicopter crashin, I thought I might try TANKS LOL

Actually, been interested for a while, but never got around to askin the questions so...... if u could help it would be appreciated.

I would like to start off in the 1:16 scale, I do like the big beasts i've seen in photo's but im not Billy Gates, I haven't a fortune stashed away, and the 1:16 look good

i dont know what all the slang is, what is an IMPACT TU exactly lol

What I would like is some recommendations for a Tank

I would like to be able to get upgrades for it, like the metal tracks, and I've seen some that say there "complete with Full Options" so what does that mean?

Im not necessarily looking for one that ACTUALLY FIRES anything, the Tamiya 1/16 XB German King Tiger 1 Tank R/C RTG c/w Full Options (23619) looks very nice, as does the Tamiya 1/16 German RC Leopard 2 A6 Main Battle Tank but these are ready built at the place im looking to get them from, I would ideally like to build it myself

The upgrades I think are fairly important, as is the build quality... I ***** at painting, but i'll have a go lol

I have a Radio System (no servo's) The Spektrum DX7 is this any good to use?

Any help appreciated guys!!

Thanks!

Chris

streetsquid

pepperami,
First and foremost welcome to the hobby and to this forum. This forum is an excellent source of information and inspiration. It is populated by lots of very talented and knowledgeable people from around the world, who are always willing to share. In fact there are some who can probably answer your questions better than I, but I'm willing to take a stab at it.

Probably the most important thing you should decide before buying a tank is what you would like to do with it, and at what level you want to participate in this hobby. Some guys simply love to build and run their tanks on relatively smooth ground, while others will join a club that then hosts simulated battles in which your tank will be driven on all sorts of terrain. Deciding this first will help determine what kit and upgrades will best suit your interests.

As you mentioned some of the tanks are designed to shoot the air soft BB's, while others use an IR (infrared laser) battle system. That system uses a "battle unit" to receive and resgister the incoming shots from another tank. Sounds like you have already decided to go with the IR type system.

Most of the available tanks can be broken down into two categories:
1. Comes in a kit form in which you have to build the tank. (Tamiya, and some old Bandai kits are good examples)
2. Come as a pre-built (mostly assembled, except for some small cosmetic details). These are usually the "airsoft" tanks (Heng Long)

Because Heng Long offers more options, many builders will buy an HL tank, and then convert it to an IR battle system. And others will use either the Tamiya or HL tanks as a base to modify and make new variants of a vehicle that do not already exists on the market.

Then there are the upgrades. There has always been much debate within the hobby as to which is better. The "put together toys" which may run you $150, or buy the more expensive "kit form" that will set you back say $800. There are many in both camps and lots of reasonable and logical arguments for both, truth is you have to decide what you would get the most enjoyment out of. I personally started with a kit as my first tank, because when I started the "toy" tanks weren't nearly as popular and simply weren't yet available on the market. I now have both, and am in the middle of building a Tamiya kit, as well as converting a Heng Long tank.

Well whichever route you choose to go, kit or pre-built, there are lots of after market companies that make upgrades and after market parts that will either make the tank stronger, more accurate, run better, or convert it into a completely different variant. Depending on the upgrades you can spend 2-3 times as much as tank itself in upgrades. Good examples of websites to check out for available upgrades is Tankzone in the UK, or ETO Armor here in the states. Some of the biggest and most recognized names in after market parts are carried by both internet vendors including Wecohe, Schumo, Kenny Kong and Impact.

Realize too that by doing some upgrades you create the situation that you need to do additional upgrades to support what you've done. For example many would reason that if you upgrade to metal tracks, you add weight and stress to the stock plastic suspension components and plastic gears in the gear boxes. So logic would dictate that you would also upgrade the suspension and transmissions to handle to torque and stress of metal tracks. Again many discussions have occurred about this subject. I would encourage you to ask as many questions as possible and ask them frequently.

You ask what "Full Option" means. Basically Tamiya has packaged most of their tank kits in both static and RC forms. When you buy the RC kit they refer to that as "Full Option" because it come with a DMD (Dual Motor Drive) and an MFU (Mutli-Function Unit) which is the brains of the tank. It controls traverse, elevation, recoil, sound system, and registers the damage during a battle. You will also here the term TBU (Tamiya Battle Unit) which is frequently referred too as the "Apple". This is an after market add-on that allows you to battle with other tanks that are equipped to battle as well. For the longest time Tamiya had a corner on the IR market, but in the last few years other companies have designed and developed battle systems that are compatible and capable of battling against Tamiya units. Pros and cons to each, and another topic of much discussion on this and other forums. Some of the other companies to consider for the "electronic brain/ battle systems" are Impact, El Mod, and Darkith.

Ok I've blathered on for long enough. As I said earlier there are guys who can answer you questions more completely and accurately than I can, so by all means I encourage you to post frequently and keep posting until you feel you have learned enough that you can make an informed decision before you invest in your first tank. I would also recommend you seek other tankers in your area or a local club, it will make the hobby more enjoyable if you have others to participate in it with.

Once again welcome, I hope this post helped at least a little!

Kindest regards,

Streetsquid (craig)
XO - DAK (Desert Armor Korps)
www.desertarmor.com

thebronze

+1

Pepperami

Thank You Streets Quid for a very good reply!

I had looked at both the Tamiya Tanks and the Heng Long ones, and the price difference here in the UK is HUGE with the decent Tamiya ones running into the £600-£700 mark (although some of these are already built and painted!)

The one I like the look of is the Tamiya German RC Leopard 2 A6 Main Battle Tank but thats around £750-£800

Its a more modern Tank, but as its new, I do not believe there are for instance the Metal Track Upgrade Option (Unless for that price it has them its a kit! LOL)

Also there are no TU Upgrades available either, meaning when they DO arrive, it will push the price up to over £1000.00 I would imagine!

My Next choices were either........

Tamiya 1/16 German Panther Type G Tank with Full Option

or

Tamiya 1/16 German Jagpanther Tank Destroyer Kit (does this come with full option it doesnt state it in the site description?)

Both of these are around the £550

My last choice, only because its slightly more, is the Tamiya 1/16 German Panzer J Tank Kit with Option Kit Priced around the £650-£700 mark

Im am sure I have seen the Impact Tracks and aftermarket upgrades for all these tanks, and might post a POLL in a moment to see what people think

Anything you want to say about the choice I may have narrowed it down to?

Chris

streetsquid

pepperrami,
Ok let's get down to particulars for some specifics tanks. First just know that IMHO you simply can't go wrong with Tamiya tanks, any of them. They are top notch quality, well thought out, well engineered, and have good and comprehensive instructions. Basically Tamiya does what it does best and that's make great model kits, these just happen to be radio control. Ok, so I'm a Tamiya fan!

I don't personally own a Leopard so I can't speak too much about it other than to say it is not the most popular Tamiya kit, but for good reason. It is the only 1/16 scale modern tank available (although another company is on the verge of releasing a T-55) so therefore it has nothing to battle against. And a good portion of the people in this hobby do use their tanks to battle, so the WWII tanks are the most popular. That being said I've seen the Leo run, and it is awesome and impressive in it's own right. It is a newer Tamiya kit (although not the newest by far) and there are some after market parts available, but because it's not as popular I don't believe companies have invested as much in manufacturing upgrades.

The Panther G I own and it is a sweet tank! I can't say enough about this kit, has to be one of my favorite tanks to drive on the battlefield. This is also a relatively new offering for Tamiya, I think the kit came out in 2007. It was greatly anticipated and many of the aftermarket companies have jumped in to make accessories and upgrades. Photo-etch metal, cast white metal, and resin parts are all available. The standard upgrades of metal tracks, suspension, gear boxes, etc. plus a lot of cosmetic things like new working hatches (Those come on the stock kit as molded shut), hatch handles, tie downs, periscope glass, etc etc........ Here is a thread to my panther project if you are interested in some for the upgrades I did to mine.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_72...tm.htm#7232225

The Jagpanther came out after the the "G" model, and from what I understand that kit shares much of the same tooling with the Panther (chassis, lower hull, and detail parts). Bare in mind this is a tank destroyer so it has no rotating or traversing turret. Which is fine, it just means if you do indeed plan to battle, the tactics you use and the way you drive this will be totally different than you would with a tank with a turret you can traverse. You basically have to face your adversary to fire at him, so it takes a lot more maneuvering.

Until Tamiya releases their KV-1, the Panzer IV J is their newest kit (also read most expensive). From what I've read this is also a real gem. Highly detailed and goes together very well. But because the tooling is the newest and the tank has been on the market the least amount of time, the vendors have not yet developed as many after market upgrades.

But to be really clear, all of these Tamiya kits build up to be great models that run well straight out of the box. You do NOT have to add upgrades. Now you may find some that disagree and insists that upgrades are necessary. But I will tell you that I own 4 Tamiya tanks, a Panther, a Tiger I, a King Tiger, and I'm in the middle of building their Sherman and the ONLY performance upgrade on any of them is a set of wheel bearings I'm adding to the Sherman. I battle my tanks on rough terrain and I drive them very hard and have never had a problem with the stock suspensions, gear boxes, or plastic tracks.

I'm partial to the Panther, although the other two are both supposed to be awesome tanks. I'd have to imagine the Jag would run similarly, but as I mentioned you would drive it differently as a tank destroyer. No one in my club has yet to build the Panzer, so I haven't seen it run personally.

You can't really go wrong with any of them, so I'd take a look on the web decide which one you like the best (as far as asthetics) and buy the kit that tickles your fancy the most, you won't be disappointed. You can also see lots of info on most of these tanks at our club website, checks out the projects page @ www.desertarmor.com

Don't know if I helped much, if at all, with your decision.

Best of luck!

Streetsquid (Craig)
XO-DAK (Desert Armor Korps)
www.desertarmor.com

Panther F

Great points Craig! I would also like to add that the bearings and the metal elevation arm be installed during the build. Just about all the rest of the upgrades available can be added later, although some of them like the barrel sleeve and or the better mantlet for the Panther should be installed during the build as well.

Pepperami

Hiya Craig!

Yes u have definitely made it a lot clear, I for instance didnt realise that the Jagpanther was a NON Rotation turret! I thought (Stupid me lol) as im still learning that ALL Turrets rotated, so there, I've learnt to look before leaping... see I nearly brought that lol

looked at the New Leopard A6 tank but realised it was a modern one, and it would appear there are not too many people using them, so I put that one out the window to (Good really as it was a lot more money!)

Tamiya 1/16 German Panzer J Tank Kit with Option Kit (56026) is the one I have decided to go for, I like the look of it!

Did u say you could get the bearings for this?

Can u supply a link if so

Thanks!!

Chris

pcomm1

Pz4J bearings: I have not found bearings, yet, for the Pz4J's road wheels, maybe they are available now, but I could not find ones that would fit during my build. Plus, the road wheels, assembled correctly, spin very freely using the kit supplied bushings.

I did use bearings in the metal idlers and that will make a positive improvement on how the tank will run. While bearings do make a nice running improvement when compared to a tank that does not use them, the improvement is minor when running outside. For the Pz4J, consider a Daryl Turner metal gearbox mount and a metal elevation arm, those 2 items will save you some turret repair elevation grief down the road and protect your stock transmission: http://www.etoarmour.com/products.php?ViewCategory=29

John

I got my Pz4J and idler bearings here:

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Tamiya-1-16-R-C-F-O-German-PANZER-IV-Ausf-J-Tank_W0QQitemZ390044987258QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_De faultDomain_0?hash=item5ad07e2f7a&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262&_trkparms=|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A30

Pepperami

Hiya mate

I had considered gettin the Tank from Hong Kong, but the import duty alone would be around £200.00 if it got stopped!

I once brought an AOSHIMA Thunderbird 2 from Hobbylink in Japan. The model was £130.00 and the import tax was £80!

Im in a slighly unique position of being a Warehose Manager for a DieCast Model company. The place im hoping to get the Tank from is a Customer of ours who recieves some discount regualrly, so I am going to have a chat with him tomorrow, all being well, I should got it for a bit less than normal

Do u recommend the Metal Tracks?

if I could find out a size of bearing for the road wheels it might be possible with the amount of R/C Cars and Helicopters using Bearings that there might be a suitable one to be had, either that or email Tamiya directly see if its possible?

pcomm1

I do not recommend the metal tracks on this model. The metal track detail looks great and they run good, but I thought the metal added to much weight on a small model and slightly degraded running performance.

The Tamiya kit tracks work really well and do not stress the stock gearboxes as the metal tracks could.

I have both the Tamiya kit tracks and the Impact Pz4 Tamiya tracks which I bought at a discount sale. I have run both, and decided to run the Tamiya tracks. Anyway, with side skirts mounted on my Pz, one can't really see much of the track details. So save yourself some money and skip metal tracks, unless you want the killer good looks of metal tracks.

That would be great info to publish, the size for the Pz4 road wheel bearings.

Pepperami

Surely it could be worked out from the Bushes and the shafts and the holes they sit in couldnt it?

Someone got a bush they can accurately measure with a digital vernier guage?

if we could get some sizes we could im sure find a bearing to fit?